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FranCrimi
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12-20-2019, 08:59 AM

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Originally Posted by skipbales View Post
Hey Fran Merry Christmas!! I see your point and believe I was on a wrong track worrying about upper arm position all together. Here is what I discovered please tell me what you think.

I re-watched some stance videos, in particular one of Tor Lowry's. Here is what I learned and changed.

Before I started with the center of my body on the shot line. I think it should have been my stick, at my side, on the line. This moves me left some. (right handed).

Before I put the ball of my foot on the shot line, now I put my toes on the line.

Before my right foot was 30-45 degrees to the shot line. Now it is closer to 90.

Before I stepped forward and to the left with my left foot, more left than forward. Now I step more forward and only a little left with it. I noticed Tor's feet were closer together than mine.

Before my left foot was parallel to the shot line, it still is.

These changes just turn me a small amount but it is enough to give me clearance. It also feels like I am "sticking my butt out" when I drop into the shot. I don't lead the move with my butt but it does have more of that affect.

I end up with my body more left of the cue than over it. This gives me clearance and with my head turned to look straight down the cue it feels pretty good, not strained. My cue is away from my body and I kind of miss that security of having my body to help guide my stroke but that may be like training wheels on a bicycle. Not sure.
Sounds great. Time will tell if it helps you make the shots you've been missing.
  
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12-20-2019, 09:47 AM

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Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
How much pressure would you say should be on your bridge hand?
Pressure, just the normal weight of those body parts. Basically no pressure. If there is forward pressure on your hand then your applying forward weight to your stance, thus putting your whole body Slightly off balance.

I'm very critical about this because I'm real tall. 6'6''.

When I'm slightly off it's waaaaaaaaaay worse that a person who's allot shorter than me.


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12-20-2019, 07:24 PM

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Originally Posted by skipbales View Post
To be clear, how are you measuring 4 diamonds?

for Draw two diamonds to the cue ball and two diamonds back would be a 4 diamond draw as the draw wears off due to drag on the way to the object ball. A one diamond form the object ball and 3 back would also be 4 diamonds.

For follow it gets easier with a little distance as the drag helps you just like it hurts you in draw.

So two diamonds to the object ball and two more to the hole is a little easier than one to the object ball and 3 more to the hole.

I will set some up and see how I do. I have done these before but not for a long time.
Try this https://youtu.be/D3oj9lte_5o?t=327


  
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12-20-2019, 10:16 PM

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Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
Pressure, just the normal weight of those body parts. Basically no pressure. If there is forward pressure on your hand then your applying forward weight to your stance, thus putting your whole body Slightly off balance.

I'm very critical about this because I'm real tall. 6'6''.

When I'm slightly off it's waaaaaaaaaay worse that a person who's allot shorter than me.
I thought because of my height, (6'3") that i may need to lean a little more forward on my bridge hand.
  
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12-21-2019, 05:38 AM

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Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
I thought because of my height, (6'3") that i may need to lean a little more forward on my bridge hand.
No, that would be like being in a Karate stance, and because your taller, your balance points (3) would be different. nope


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12-22-2019, 11:55 PM

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No, that would be like being in a Karate stance, and because your taller, your balance points (3) would be different. nope
So should i bend both knees?
  
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12-23-2019, 06:25 AM

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No, that would be like being in a Karate stance, and because your taller, your balance points (3) would be different. nope
Totally agree with 'no'. Leaning forward will cause other problems.
  
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12-23-2019, 06:29 AM

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Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
So should i bend both knees?
You can but you have to be cautious about bending both too much. Another way to do it is to keep your back leg on the straight side but with a soft knee --- very slightly bent, not rigid.
  
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12-25-2019, 04:54 PM

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You can but you have to be cautious about bending both too much. Another way to do it is to keep your back leg on the straight side but with a soft knee --- very slightly bent, not rigid.
Thanks Fran.
  
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12-26-2019, 06:51 AM

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Originally Posted by JoeyInCali View Post
Thanks Joey!! I have that video and do that drill from time to time. Bert Kinister has a more extreme drill where he starts the cue ball from the corner pocket, maybe 2" from the pocket, goes to the opposite corner one diamond from the pocket and draws all the way back to a scratch. Crazy hard. It is funny to me that they both seem to marvel that the draw shot is harder. You have to hit much harder and the cue ball travels much farther. That is why I asked you about a "four diamond draw shot". It all depends on how you count.

In the Dr. Dave video for the follow the cue ball goes 2 diamonds forward to contact then 2 more to the pocket. All this with the table encouraging roll. In the draw shot the cue ball goes 2 diamonds forward to contact then has to come back 4 diamonds to get to the opposite pocket. All this while the friction with the cloth works to take the back spin off the cue ball forcing the shooter to hit very low and pretty hard.

That said I will shoot a few and see how I do. I can do 5 in a row forward and after a few get that up to 10. At least I could the last time I did it. The draw, of course, is much harder. Dr. Dave says 1 out of 5 is good. I don't remember if I did that one or how it went. I do a 4 diamond side to side draw and can do that pretty consistently. That one is 2 to the object ball then 2 back to scratch. Drawing back 4 diamonds into a 5" space isn't just a little harder than back 2. It is a LOT harder. We will see.

Is this a drill you practice? If so how do you fare at it? Thanks for the TIP.

Last edited by skipbales; 12-26-2019 at 06:54 AM.
  
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12-26-2019, 04:26 PM

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Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
So should i bend both knees?
What ever feels comfortable when your down on your shot....

Some lock both, some lock one and bend the other, some bend both.

Go to a pro event and look at the plethora of stances.

Rempe years ago/late sixties/his stance looked awkward to me, when I first saw him play at Johnston City.

When he was ''down and done''....He could thin a ball with the best of em.


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01-02-2020, 09:28 AM

Shows what you (don't) know. The pendulum stroke is far superior to the piston stroke...it's not even close...but you go ahead and tout all those famous players from the time before great, accurate pool instruction became available. Also those great players had no inkling about pool physics...they were great players in spite of missing that knowledge. The majority of amateur players today benefit GREATLY from this information.

To Skip...Doesn't matter if the upper arm is parallel to the table or not.

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"Elbow Drop" is just a big humbug from instrictors.
Jimmy Caras, Willie Mosconi, Eddie Talyor, Steve Mizerak, all dropped their elbows most of the time to get a good follow through.
Don't worry about it. Just shoot the balls in the holes.


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01-02-2020, 09:42 AM

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Originally Posted by Scott Lee View Post
Shows what you (don't) know. The pendulum stroke is far superior to the piston stroke...it's not even close...but you go ahead and tout all those famous players from the time before great, accurate pool instruction became available. Also those great players had no inkling about pool physics...they were great players in spite of missing that knowledge. The majority of amateur players today benefit GREATLY from this information.

To Skip...Doesn't matter if the upper arm is parallel to the table or not.

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
Thanks Scott. I think my stance was the issue. My back foot was on the shot line but it was the center of my foot. Using the toe gives me the clearance I need. Sometimes you start with a thought and the discussion helps you find the answer and it may not have anything to do with the original question.
Thanks to you and all who participate.
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