The single most overlooked part of game play: kicking

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There are several different ways to do most anything and pool is no different. Some use a long bridge every shot. Some use a short bridge every shot, while some use a bridge length that is needed per the shot's request. In other words, each shot needs a "specific" bridge length, height etc...etc. there is no one bridge that is best. We should use the best tool for the task.

Take english (top/bottom) and spin (left/right), most everyone, even the elite have a favorite shot. Why? Well, that's what they feel most confident with. Most feel more comfortable with a touch of bottom or a touch of inside etc...etc on most shots BUT, they will use ALL variations of spin at one time or another. Why? Well, they have to if they want to be competitive and win. You can't always use what feels best.

Just like a stance, nobody and I mean nobody uses the exact stance on every single shot. Everyone from the least to the very best on the planet adjust their stance to meet the shot's needs.

I said all of that to say this: kicking is no different. I see people all the time that kick by feel on all kicks or will use one particular system for all kicks and they are usually the loser's at the end of the day.

There are many, many ways to kick at a ball or pocket. Having said that, IMO, I think the worst thing a person can do is learn to kick at a ball or the pocket. IMO, everyone should learn to kick at a target.

When learning to kick, if a person gets hung up on kicking at "the ball", well, most will get lost in the details during competition because if playing an advanced player, you will seldom have a kick where the track line isn't blocked and that in itself usually forces people to fall back on feel and forget everything they drilled in practice. At that point we see jump cues pulled out faster than a gunslinger in a shoot out.

Even people that run kicking drills fall apart and seem to temporarily forget what they know and fall back on kicking by feel only to end up hoping to "just hit" the ball but, end up selling out.

As mentioned, there are many ways to kick but, most of the time just like with any shot, there is almost always a "best" way that increases your odds of getting out of jail or kicking safe instead of "just hitting" the ball and selling out.

The whole point of this post is:

Don't be the player that has but one tool for kicking. Learn to kick by all systems. Run kicking drills often.

I'm not saying never use "feel" while kicking. Nope, far from it acually. What I am saying is:

Any time you need to kick, start off with the system that matches and increases your odds and use feel when necessary coupled with that specific system.

Some people do ok with feeling their way while wiggling around until they "feel" good, but, the players that get out of jail and then put you in jail are the very players that know many systems and know when to inject feel into the shot.

There is a reason kicking is dreaded by most. The reason isn't because it's extremely hard. The reason is however because they do not know how to kick. Why, well....in their list of priorities, kicking is usually nonexistent or at best at the bottom.

Jeff
 

336Robin

Multiverse Operative
Silver Member
Angle in angle out to a point works well with me. Rarely do you get a pathway
that is perfect anyway so you're having to do something to the cue ball in many cases.
Its estimation. I hit more balls using the estimation with spin than I would have
predicted when I first started playing. Knowing your 3 rails paths and being able to
know how to get on one and diverge from it is good. Practicing two rail kicks into a point
is good but feel from angle in angle out estimation is more useful to me.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
Jump cues have actually delayed folks from really ever learning kicking basics.
 

Tooler

AhSheetMaDruars
Silver Member
Jump cues have actually delayed folks from really ever learning kicking basics.

This for sure..... Why would anybody risk hitting the wrong side of the OB, or missing it with a 2/3 railer, when you can jump it ?

I love kicks.
I hate jump cues.:angry: Take the training wheels off. Use your shooter.

I wonder what guys like Willie would say: :confused::shrug:
 

gerard soriano

HIGH RUN STILL TO COME !
Silver Member
I love to kick & I use Grady Mathews (RIP) system
It works well for me
In my opinion if you don't have a System any way you look at it Your Guessing !
 

One Pocket John

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Probably the best video on the planet to get you on the right track for kicking is Tor Lowry's video "Kicking and Banking" video. Then incorporate feel and stance.
Nice post Jeff.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
It's a shame that a repertoire of advanced and impressive pool shots such as kicks, banks, carom and billiard shots are often discouraged by the game itself or its circumstances, because if one wanted to simply pocket balls and play position they can go ahead and play snooker.
 

7stud

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
At that point we see jump cues pulled out faster than a gunslinger in a shoot out.
lol.

Could you tell me what kicking system you used when describing the aim point in the other thread? I couldn't make sense of your description. Thanks.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
lol.

Could you tell me what kicking system you used when describing the aim point in the other thread? I couldn't make sense of your description. Thanks.

there are many different systems. some systems are very, very similar to the, while others are not. Some systems are easier to understand and execute while others are not.

^^^^^^^^ that's why it is so important to learn all systems because some people will learn "x" system and understand and execute very well, while others may be able to execute yet another system more consistent.

Here is one way to shoot the almost identical shot that was in the thread you speak of and is pretty much the same system he used to hit the ball. It is really easy to execute after a little table time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rk0-4fbY-Ss


Keep in mind that a system is only as accurate as your stroke.


Also, keep in mind that kicking systems are like math. Any one shot within a system almost always has a prerequisite.

Jeff
 

Bavafongoul

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
RJ Got It Right.

RJ is absolutely right about the proliferation and popularity of jump cues essentially changing the way
players approach a blocked or hidden object ball. Understanding the science behind kicking at a ball still
involves judgement. More importantly, there are occasions where your rail aim point can’t be struck due
to other OB’s interfering with the line. That necessitates compensating with English and the amount, type &
speed all affect how the cue ball travels afterward and a lot more when English gets applied. So there’s a
sight judgement you have to reach to decide how much or how little, as well as how hard or how soft.

I have always relied on the Diamond System. It is simple multiplication and seldom do you ever need a 3
digit kick so it is very basic and simple. I pocket more balls than other local players can & it’s not uncommon
the shots result in cue butt applause. Yet the percentage is still relatively low, but the total misses or ball in hand
table surrender is very slight, like a low single digit BIH foul rate. But there is still judgement required and like
I earlier wrote, sometimes English too, so it’s not just math. I can’t jump balls because of my bum shoulders.

Getting back to my main point, RJ is correct. Learning a kicking system or by trial and error experience is
a lot of work and a jump cue, especially the way players have become so skillful with, largely eliminates
relying on kicking at a object ball. And when you don’t practice kicking at the ball by actually using this in
your matches and practice too, your skills suffer and diminish. Lastly, the table cloth and rails have a major
influence on how the kick shot rolls, even room humidity. There’s so many variables & a jump cue pretty
much eliminates that. It’s like playing a more elevated, harder struck masse shot vs figuring out the other stuff.
 

ctyhntr

RIP Kelly
Silver Member
In the past, were there skill levels to judge the progress of kicking? Say, compared to an A level player vs C or D level?
 

7stud

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Last edited:

Nostroke

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It was overlooked til Efren got here. Since then it has been looked at very carefully and better players spent hundreds of hours learning systems and practicing it. JMHO
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It was overlooked til Efren got here. Since then it has been looked at very carefully and better players spent hundreds of hours learning systems and practicing it. JMHO

If were talking mid-level pros and up, your correct. But, if we only talk about amateurs up to the lower-level pros, well, IMHO, your wrong, dead wrong.

If we look at matches between the elite and lower-level pros, the biggest gap between them will be their saftey play.

All pros from the least to the biggest beast can run racks. Running out is the easy part so, what does that tell us? It tells us that who ever has the strongest saftey game will get the first shot and who ever gets the first shot is suppose to win the game.

The lower down the food chain we get, the smaller the gap gets for an amateur. For that reason, I say most all spend to little time on safty play.

The thread started a few days ago brought this to my attention:

The player hit a very easy three rail kick and some made it sound like he did something special and was asking questions and seem to know very little about it.

We all have to learn but, we can't learn if we don't know how and even then, they won't excel at kicking and safes unless kicking is moved to a higher priority.

People can say kicking is not lacking if they want but, all I have to say is, go to any room and see how many people are running kicking drills compared to people practicing drawing their cb or pocketing balls.

Also, ask people what their favorite drills are. I guarantee you kicking drills will be few, or not mentioned at all.

Jeff
 

trinacria

in efren we trust
Silver Member
kicking isn't overlooked, just like jumping isn't overlooked. jump cues have been around a longtime now, theyre part of the game, get used to it. crybabies crying about jumping, the fuch do I wanna kick 5 rails for if I can jump the ball. got a cheap jump cue, works wonders. sometimes a kick is more effective, nobody here is Efren, so the best you can hope for is hitting and try to get lucky.
 
Top