Stop recommending Players HXT?

ScottK

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Curious as to the thoughts of anyone who 'd like to chime in.

I had the tip on my HXT skinny shaft replaced this week by a local cue repair guy. While trimming the new tip, the tenon on the HXT shaft snapped. Without consulting me, the repair guy cut a new tenon and installed a new ferrule. For those who may be unaware, the low deflection technology in an HXT shaft is, in fact, the ferrule. It's a hollow, polymer filled design. So, the shaft is no longer low deflection.

I called Players today to find out if the shaft would be repaired or replaced under warranty. I was told it probably would have been if I'd have just sent the shaft and broken tenon/ferrule/tip in for examination. However, since the repair man took it upon himself to fix it, the shaft is no longer covered under warranty.

I'm not particularly mad at anyone involved. Things happen and I think the repair guy tried to do what he could to make the situation right at the time. However, he is apparently unfamiliar with the correct process for replacing a tip on an HXT ferrule.

Similarly, I can understand Players position. There is no way for them to determine what exactly happened. But, I do have the ferrule with the tenon inside and a partially trimmed tip installed. It seems fairly obvious as to what transpired here. And it seems to me like a problem that should be covered under warranty.

So, what do you think? Stop recommending the HXT shaft? Not because it's not a good shaft, but this could happen to any repair guy, unknowingly voiding a customers warranty. At very least any recommendation of these shaft now requires a footnote for when tip replacement time comes around. Or, do I "blame" the repair man? He did a very nice job with the new ferrule and tip by the way, so he seems competent enough. Perhaps he should have recognized he was in unfamiliar territory with this shaft and acted accordingly.

Thoughts?
 
zpele

zpele

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
IMO the company is not at fault. The repair man should never have taken it upon himself to do what he did.

If you brought your car to the mechanic and he broke an axle by accident then replaced it with an axle from a totally different car and all of a sudden your car didn't turn correctly - who would you blame? The car manufacturer who refused to fix your issue for free or the mechanic?
 
hang-the-9

hang-the-9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
ScottK said:
Curious as to the thoughts of anyone who 'd like to chime in.

I had the tip on my HXT skinny shaft replaced this week by a local cue repair guy. While trimming the new tip, the tenon on the HXT shaft snapped. Without consulting me, the repair guy cut a new tenon and installed a new ferrule. For those who may be unaware, the low deflection technology in an HXT shaft is, in fact, the ferrule. It's a hollow, polymer filled design. So, the shaft is no longer low deflection.

I called Players today to find out if the shaft would be repaired or replaced under warranty. I was told it probably would have been if I'd have just sent the shaft and broken tenon/ferrule/tip in for examination. However, since the repair man took it upon himself to fix it, the shaft is no longer covered under warranty.

I'm not particularly mad at anyone involved. Things happen and I think the repair guy tried to do what he could to make the situation right at the time. However, he is apparently unfamiliar with the correct process for replacing a tip on an HXT ferrule.

Similarly, I can understand Players position. There is no way for them to determine what exactly happened. But, I do have the ferrule with the tenon inside and a partially trimmed tip installed. It seems fairly obvious as to what transpired here. And it seems to me like a problem that should be covered under warranty.

So, what do you think? Stop recommending the HXT shaft? Not because it's not a good shaft, but this could happen to any repair guy, unknowingly voiding a customers warranty. At very least any recommendation of these shaft now requires a footnote for when tip replacement time comes around. Or, do I "blame" the repair man? He did a very nice job with the new ferrule and tip by the way, so he seems competent enough. Perhaps he should have recognized he was in unfamiliar territory with this shaft and acted accordingly.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

All LD shafts I now of have some special trick in the ferrule, whoever replaced it should have known unless he never worked with an LD shaft. Don't know why Players is at fault at all here, aside from maybe the original break, which may have been caused by the repair guy doing something funny with the shaft, maybe it was spinning off center on the lathe while trimming, or too much force was used.

I have yet to find a shaft that plays as nice as the HXT ones if one is looking for a mid LD shaft with a good hit. And the thing is a bargain to boot.
 
Banks

Banks

Banned
zpele said:
IMO the company is not at fault. The repair man should never have taken it upon himself to do what he did.

If you brought your car to the mechanic and he broke an axle by accident then replaced it with an axle from a totally different car and all of a sudden your car didn't turn correctly - who would you blame? The car manufacturer who refused to fix your issue for free or the mechanic?
Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking.. but! He's also responsible for understanding the warranty that comes with the product that he owns. He brought it to somebody that wasn't certified or what-not to do the job, but then the guy messed it up worse. The car company would tell you that you're SOL. His only recourse is to try to get some kind of compensation from the repairman, but then I don't think he should expect to get any work done in the future.
 
H

Hits 'em Hard

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
ScottK said:
I had the tip on my HXT skinny shaft replaced this week by a local cue repair guy. While trimming the new tip, the tenon on the HXT shaft snapped. Without consulting me, Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Your repair guy is incompetent as hell. What was he doing that cause so much sideways force on the tenon in the first place. So many faults with your repair guy I don't even have a clue how you can even say the HXT is the problem. Tell your repair guy he owes you a new shaft, and find a new repair guy to use.
 
jaetee

jaetee

rack master ;)
Silver Member
Repair guy should know the LD "trick" of the various offerings out there and be able to accommodate the differences among them, but maybe this was the first HXT he has worked on? I would chalk this up as an unfortunate accident that resulted in him having a learning experience. That should be at his expense, not yours. IMHO, he should source a new HXT for you, and collect whatever he would have charged you for the re-tip. Then he can keep the shorter, no-longer-LD shaft and do whatever he wants with it...

On a side note, how does the HXT play now that it has a normal ferrule? In all honesty, can you reallytell a difference between before and after...? Has your play suffered?

And do you notice the 1" difference in length?

I have an HXT that I use on my Espiritu and I generally like the shaft, but every now and then it makes a funny noise when I hit the cue ball and it takes me a while to get over that when it happens. Hence, it becomes a distraction while I'm playing because my focus shifts to the equipment, not my game... Which sends me back to using my Schon or Gunn.
 
Celophanewrap

Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
How does a ferrule and tenon snap off when you're trimming a tip? I know there are a several methods to install and trim a tip down to size and I suppose that we all do it a little different (maybe) but in thinking through it, I'm really curious as to how the tenon breaks away during a tip install.
Anyways, the HXT seems to be one of the lower priced LD shafts maybe you could sell yours to aid the purchase of a new one?
 
I

itsfroze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
jaetee said:
repair guy should know the ld "trick" of the various offerings out there and be able to accommodate the differences among them, but maybe this was the first hxt he has worked on? I would chalk this up as an unfortunate accident that resulted in him having a learning experience. That should be at his expense, not yours. Imho, he should source a new hxt for you, and collect whatever he would have charged you for the re-tip. Then he can keep the shorter, no-longer-ld shaft and do whatever he wants with it...

On a side note, how does the hxt play now that it has a normal ferrule? In all honesty, can you reallytell a difference between before and after...? Has your play suffered?

And do you notice the 1" difference in length?

I have an hxt that i use on my espiritu and i generally like the shaft, but every now and then it makes a funny noise when i hit the cue ball and it takes me a while to get over that when it happens. Hence, it becomes a distraction while i'm playing because my focus shifts to the equipment, not my game... Which sends me back to using my schon or gunn.
Click to expand...

What makes you think it's shorter ?
 
P

poolguy4u

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
:smile:



I think the shaft will play about the same as it did before the repair.

I'd be surprised if someone will be able to tell the difference.
 
Rain-Man

Rain-Man

Team Deplorable
Silver Member
Hits 'em Hard said:
Your repair guy is incompetent as hell. What was he doing that cause so much sideways force on the tenon in the first place. So many faults with your repair guy I don't even have a clue how you can even say the HXT is the problem. Tell your repair guy he owes you a new shaft, and find a new repair guy to use.
Click to expand...

Yep.. He broke it, then tried to do a quick fix of it and blamed it on the shaft.. It aint the shaft, lol...
 
Rain-Man

Rain-Man

Team Deplorable
Silver Member
itsfroze said:
What makes you think it's shorter ?
Click to expand...

He most likely faced off the shaft at the point of break, re-cut a tenon, then put a ferrule on the new cut tenon. In which case, shaft would be shorter by the amount that broke off..

He could have fixed it another way, but my guess is that he didnt, and took the easiest fix route..
 
ScottK

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
hang-the-9 said:
...Don't know why Players is at fault at all here, aside from maybe the original break...
Click to expand...

I should clarify. I don't mean Players is at fault. By the title I mean should I continue to recommend a shaft which has the potential to end up ruined by what otherwise seems to be a competent repair guy.

hang-the-9 said:
I have yet to find a shaft that plays as nice as the HXT ones if one is looking for a mid LD shaft with a good hit. And the thing is a bargain to boot.
Click to expand...

I like them. I'll probably buy another. No question you can't beat them for the price, but if cost isn't a concern there are certainly better LD shafts.


Banks said:
That's what I was thinking.. but! He's also responsible for understanding the warranty that comes with the product that he owns. He brought it to somebody that wasn't certified or what-not to do the job, but then the guy messed it up worse. The car company would tell you that you're SOL. His only recourse is to try to get some kind of compensation from the repairman, but then I don't think he should expect to get any work done in the future.
Click to expand...

It was a simple tip replacement. I understand the warranty. The repair guy took it upon himself to replace the ferrule without consulting me.


Hits 'em Hard said:
Your repair guy is incompetent as hell. What was he doing that cause so much sideways force on the tenon in the first place. So many faults with your repair guy I don't even have a clue how you can even say the HXT is the problem. Tell your repair guy he owes you a new shaft, and find a new repair guy to use.
Click to expand...

ChicagoRJ said:
Stop recommending your cue repair guy ;)
Click to expand...

Agreed. It was my first time dealing with him. I had a bad feeling about it going in, but two buddy's referred me. Like I said, he did a nice job replacing the ferrule for what that's worth. I certainly don't intend to pay him.


jaetee said:
Repair guy should know the LD "trick" of the various offerings out there and be able to accommodate the differences among them, but maybe this was the first HXT he has worked on? I would chalk this up as an unfortunate accident that resulted in him having a learning experience. That should be at his expense, not yours. IMHO, he should source a new HXT for you, and collect whatever he would have charged you for the re-tip. Then he can keep the shorter, no-longer-LD shaft and do whatever he wants with it...

On a side note, how does the HXT play now that it has a normal ferrule? In all honesty, can you reallytell a difference between before and after...? Has your play suffered?

And do you notice the 1" difference in length?

I have an HXT that I use on my Espiritu and I generally like the shaft, but every now and then it makes a funny noise when I hit the cue ball and it takes me a while to get over that when it happens. Hence, it becomes a distraction while I'm playing because my focus shifts to the equipment, not my game... Which sends me back to using my Schon or Gunn.
Click to expand...

It plays fine, but you can absolutely tell the difference. Basically, it's just a standard maple shaft now and 1/2" shorter. I've only played one nine ball match with it, I missed five balls in six games. However, I've been playing with my Gilbert J/B the last few weeks, so in contrast to that it's still less deflection.


Celophanewrap said:
How does a ferrule and tenon snap off when you're trimming a tip? I know there are a several methods to install and trim a tip down to size and I suppose that we all do it a little different (maybe) but in thinking through it, I'm really curious as to how the tenon breaks away during a tip install.
Anyways, the HXT seems to be one of the lower priced LD shafts maybe you could sell yours to aid the purchase of a new one?
Click to expand...

That's what I thought. How much lateral force does it take to trim a f*cking tip? Which got me thinking maybe there was a defect in the tenon. The shaft had been sounding funny prior to the tip replacement, but I chalked it up to the soft tip getting hard. As far as selling it, the HXT are inexpensive enough that I'd just buy a new one. I'm not worried about selling this one.
 
ScottK

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
itsfroze said:
What makes you think it's shorter ?
Click to expand...

Of course it's shorter.


poolguy4u said:
:smile:

I think the shaft will play about the same as it did before the repair.

I'd be surprised if someone will be able to tell the difference.
Click to expand...

Why would it play the same? Every aspect of it that made it low deflection has been replaced.

Don't be surprised. The difference is noticeable.
 
ScottK

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Rain-Man said:
Yep.. He broke it, then tried to do a quick fix of it and blamed it on the shaft.. It aint the shaft, lol...
Click to expand...

In his defense, he hasn't blamed anyone or anything, nor has he denied it's his fault. I haven't spoken with him yet. A buddy picked up the shaft for me because the repair guy was going out of town. He and I will talk when he returns.

I'd like to think the fact he was going out of town and wanted the shaft to be playable is part of the reason he fixed it on the spot. We'll see.
 
Rain-Man

Rain-Man

Team Deplorable
Silver Member
ScottK said:
In his defense, he hasn't blamed anyone or anything, nor has he denied it's his fault. I haven't spoken with him yet. A buddy picked up the shaft for me because the repair guy was going out of town. He and I will talk when he returns.

I'd like to think the fact he was going out of town and wanted the shaft to be playable is part of the reason he fixed it on the spot. We'll see.
Click to expand...

Scott, what pin do you have? I can get you a replacement at dealer cost if you want it...?
 
ScottK

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Rain-Man said:
Scott, what pin do you have? I can get you a replacement at dealer cost if you want it...?
Click to expand...

It's Turbo Lock.

I appreciate the offer, sir, but I'd have to insist you mark it up. It's not your mess to fix. Also, I won't pick up a replacement until after I talk to the repair guy. He may very well be willing to replace the shaft.

I'll definitely let you know.

Thanks. :)
 
Nullus

Nullus

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Your repair guy shouldn't have done anything once it broke until he contacted you first. Because he did work that wasn't approved ahead of time, regardless of why the shaft broke, beit faulty or error, fault should lie with him as to replacing the shaft once he did the work without consent.
 
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