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Advice on break shots
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king cut
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Advice on break shots - 01-21-2015, 11:22 AM

hi runs 95, 81, 81, 79 and 50+ many times, but most runs end with first shot after making
the break shot and coming up stitched. I tried easier, harder, higher and lower on the rack, read books and watcher you tube, but can't seam to resolve this problem.
Any advice Please!@
  
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Blackjack
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01-21-2015, 11:31 AM

Here -

Examining the Break Shot

Rules of Thumb


"Turkeys are hitting the ground like sacks of wet cement!" ~ Les Nessman

“Dead balls are harder to find than they are to make." ~ Cisero Murphy

"When all else fails, try not missing ... INTENTIONALLY." ~ Steve Mizerak

www.thezone-spc.com


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Favorite Pool Player - Joey Koontz
  
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01-21-2015, 11:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
Just wanted to say your info has helped me tremendously over the years.


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01-21-2015, 01:26 PM

Thanks
I'll try practicing this, should I be trying to it a ball square and not between 2 balls?
Also what book is this from and where can I buy it.
  
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01-21-2015, 01:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
Great info right here, thanks for everything David !!!

[QUOTE=king cut;5052723]Thanks
I'll try practicing this, should I be trying to it a ball square and not between 2 balls?
Also what book is this from and where can I buy it.QUOTE]

that is what many of us are wondering !!!

what do you say David ?

-Steve


PETE TONKIN CUSTOM CUES

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50 ball evaluation by Blackjack David Sapolis -->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiBfKo85z4g

Last edited by stevekur1; 01-28-2015 at 01:17 PM.
  
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01-24-2015, 11:37 AM

See on Youtube... Pat Fleming's Creative Edge - Final Chapter. Pat not only, explains, but demonstrates the break shots in 14.1. Pat has several equally great demonstration Accustat Videos on Youtube. Good Luck on increasing your 14.1 runs in the future. rd
  
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01-25-2015, 09:17 PM

Grady Matthews video for 14.1 break shots is the Teacher!
Best what I've seen for 14.1 break shots so far...
If I remember it right it is accu-stats production.


-special man for a special shots-
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Do it like Efren: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yrqhJixAmWY One cool rack after opponent safety..
8-ball trickshots https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33Fu...ature=youtu.be
  
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01-25-2015, 10:09 PM

http://www.1vshop.com/Accu-Stats/sto...onal+%28DVD%29

Here it is... If link work..


-special man for a special shots-
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Do it like Efren: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yrqhJixAmWY One cool rack after opponent safety..
8-ball trickshots https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33Fu...ature=youtu.be
  
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01-28-2015, 12:20 PM

All the responses have been great and helpful. Learned a little from each video. Goal of 100 balls getting closer. Thanks to all.
  
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01-28-2015, 01:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by king cut View Post
All the responses have been great and helpful. Learned a little from each video. Goal of 100 balls getting closer. Thanks to all.
You must be a helluva player to get those high runs and at the same time have only a little knowledge of the break shot.

Congrats!


Dan White
  
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01-28-2015, 02:59 PM

Never really studied the game, just hit the rack hard. Now that I'm retired I have time to study and practice the science of the game. That is what makes this game so great, you can never stop learning. Playing for 50 years and still finding new ways to enjoy the game.
  
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01-28-2015, 05:53 PM

[QUOTE=stevekur1;5052764]Great info right here, thanks for everything David !!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by king cut View Post
Thanks
I'll try practicing this, should I be trying to it a ball square and not between 2 balls?
Also what book is this from and where can I buy it.QUOTE]

that is what many of us are wondering !!!

what do you say David ?

-Steve
I too would very much appreciate hearing opinions (and bases for those opinions) about where to try to have the cue ball strike a ball or balls in the stack (the middle balls, not the top ball or the bottom ball). Many thanks in advance. By the way, maybe it is just me, but I didn't find the diagrams and explanations in "Examining the Break Shot" to be particularly clear/informative ...
  
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01-28-2015, 09:03 PM

That is probably because that section is part of a larger 14.1 course that I teach - this section is to be used as a guide - and what is contained in that section is accompanied with a 2 hour block of instruction along with 15 additional videos.


"Turkeys are hitting the ground like sacks of wet cement!" ~ Les Nessman

“Dead balls are harder to find than they are to make." ~ Cisero Murphy

"When all else fails, try not missing ... INTENTIONALLY." ~ Steve Mizerak

www.thezone-spc.com


Playing Cue - McDermott D-21 w/ Predator Z Shaft
Favorite Pool Player - Joey Koontz

Last edited by Blackjack; 01-28-2015 at 10:36 PM.
  
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01-29-2015, 07:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
That is probably because that section is part of a larger 14.1 course that I teach - this section is to be used as a guide - and what is contained in that section is accompanied with a 2 hour block of instruction along with 15 additional videos.
My apologies for what must have seemed like rudeness. It wasn't meant to be. Among other things, I didn't realize that the material was yours.

I should have elaborated. What confused me was this passage and the associated diagram:

"In the above diagram, we are shooting the shot from Cue Ball Z. There is a gap between the contact point and the Directional Line. To have the cue ball move along the Directional Line, follow would be needed. Center English – or Stun English would have the cue ball travel along the Tangent line and contact the 2 ball as diagrammed below.

"The dotted red line shows the direction of the cue ball with Stun English. This dotted red line can be bent forward by using follow – or it can be bent back by using draw. This line begins at the contact point and extends to a direct point on the rack. By using this method, you can accurately determine EXACTLY where you will contact the stack."

My confusion stems from the fact that the dotted red line does not appear to be the tangent line, and with a center ball hit, I would expect the cue ball to travel along the tangent line, not along what is shown as the dotted red line. Also, the relatively close proximity of the cue ball to the stack (as shown in the diagram in question) would seem to preclude any meaningful amount of deviation of the cue ball path from the tangent line as a result of using follow or draw, at least if the cue ball is struck other than softly, with at least moderate speed (which would seem to be advisable on a break shot).

Ultimately, I'm interested in getting feedback on the question of where to try to strike a given ball or balls in the stack, and why. Certainly there is some opportunity to alter the cue ball path with spin and speed, particularly if there is some distance between the cue ball and the stack. My instinct is that a flush hit or a hit on the center table side of the stack ball is preferable to a hit on the foot rail side of the ball, simply to reduce the chance of scratching. Whether I am correct or incorrect about that, what I don't have much sense for is whether a hit directly in the notch between two balls is problematic, and why.

At my level, I'm not incorporating English on most break shots simply because I want to make pocketing the shot the no. 1 priority, and I don't want to introduce complicating factors. The exception for me -- and I'm comfortable with this only because I've practiced it enough -- is that I will hit high inside when the break ball is low. This nicely brings the cue ball back to center table.

Thanks for your consideration of these questions.

Respectfully --
  
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01-29-2015, 11:06 AM

You did not come off as rude at all.

I wish there was an easy answer to this part of the game - but there isn't.

The diagram -
There may have been a twinge of follow on that shot - but not enough for me to classify it as "Follow/Stun.I made the diagram from the video - if it is confusing - or if it is in error - I sincerely apologize. I can only document what the cue ball did in the video on my table.

The main point of that lesson is that you can change the direction (from the object ball contact point) by using follow - stun - and draw - and all spin in between. Keep in mind that every shot is going to be different - and each table is going to react differently - and each situation will have it's own unique solution. That is why I tell players to learn which break balls work for them - and which break balls to stay away from.

Personally, I like my cue ball up and down with the break ball - slight outside angle - that way I can "follow" through the shot and hit the contact ball right on the nose. For me, follow tends to get the cue ball out of the way - in fact the cue ball "whips" then proceeds - I like that especially if I make good contact with the stack.

I don't like going into the gaps between balls because the cue ball tends to die - that is why I try to position my break ball where I can go into the corner balls in the stack (if it is possible). I don't like going into the side of the stack if I can help it - on behind the stack break shots - I prefer a higher / deeper angle so I can use follow - then again - these are just my preferences.

Different things work for different players based upon stroke mechanics - table conditions - etc. It makes if extremely difficult for anyone to say "use this" or use that" all the time on any particular break shot. There are just too many variables in this game.

I can only document what works for me and encourage you to experiment with break shots as much as you possibly can - that way you learn how to avoid the scratches and the dead spots.

That might sound like a cop out - but its really not. You just have to know what works for you - and even when you know what works for you - sometimes you're going to be wrong. That's just pool. Most of us get into trouble when we stray away from our capabilities - or we lose sight of what works best for us.

I believe that a break ball is only as good as what you did to get there. Find what works for you consistently and try to recreate that as much as possible. The high numbers come when you take advantage of what is working for you.


"Turkeys are hitting the ground like sacks of wet cement!" ~ Les Nessman

“Dead balls are harder to find than they are to make." ~ Cisero Murphy

"When all else fails, try not missing ... INTENTIONALLY." ~ Steve Mizerak

www.thezone-spc.com


Playing Cue - McDermott D-21 w/ Predator Z Shaft
Favorite Pool Player - Joey Koontz
  
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