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The butt and nothing but the butt!
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ShootingArts
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The butt and nothing but the butt! - 05-18-2019, 09:34 AM

Just wondering. With the emergence of the black factory shafts will cue builders start building butts in colors and design schemes that go with the black shafts? Will they soften the hit of the butt a little to take the ping out of the carbon fiber shafts with a hard tip?

Just curious about player's opinions. I could have put the same question in one of the builders forums but I want users opinions rather than builder's opinions.

Hu
  
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05-18-2019, 09:36 AM

they will do whatever the people will pay for
which seems to be about anything for pool cues


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05-18-2019, 09:38 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
Will they soften the hit of the butt a little to take the ping out of the carbon fiber shafts with a hard tip?
How is that done?

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05-18-2019, 09:42 AM

I’ve been thinking the same thing. The butts have not caught up with the shafts. Most still are made to go with the light tan colors of traditional shafts rather than the black shafts. I’ve seen a lot of people playing with ugly combinations lately.
  
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any way you want to - 05-18-2019, 10:01 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
How is that done?

pj
chgo
pj,

I am going to assume that is a serious question. No idea how fast sound travels in the synthetic shafts but it travels over 15000fps in end grain wood from what I have read, roughly fifteen times as fast as it moves through air. An easy test, hit a few balls with your cue, then take the bumper off and hit a few more. There should be a very noticeable change in sound, perhaps vibration too.

Changing the design of the joint, the design or material of the collar, the woods used in the butt, the construction of the butt, pretty much any variation will affect the sound. Always a mystery to me why people that like a sharp ping when they hit the cue ball like veneers too. Veneers are made out of very soft wood, not to be confused with softwoods! Unless veneers are completely saturated with a glue that gets very hard they will dampen the sound of the cue a little compared to what it would be without them.

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05-18-2019, 10:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
pj,

I am going to assume that is a serious question.
Yes - no sarcasm (this time ).

Quote:
No idea how fast sound travels in the synthetic shafts but it travels over 15000fps in end grain wood from what I have read, roughly fifteen times as fast as it moves through air. An easy test, hit a few balls with your cue, then take the bumper off and hit a few more. There should be a very noticeable change in sound, perhaps vibration too.

Changing the design of the joint, the design or material of the collar, the woods used in the butt, the construction of the butt, pretty much any variation will affect the sound. Always a mystery to me why people that like a sharp ping when they hit the cue ball like veneers too. Veneers are made out of very soft wood, not to be confused with softwoods! Unless veneers are completely saturated with a glue that gets very hard they will dampen the sound of the cue a little compared to what it would be without them.

Hu
Thanks, Hu.

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05-18-2019, 10:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
Just wondering. With the emergence of the black factory shafts will cue builders start building butts in colors and design schemes that go with the black shafts? Will they soften the hit of the butt a little to take the ping out of the carbon fiber shafts with a hard tip?

Just curious about player's opinions. I could have put the same question in one of the builders forums but I want users opinions rather than builder's opinions.

Hu
That was the first thing I was thinking about once I've noticed the growing popularity of c.f. shafts. I have a few projects in work at the moment and in all of them I'm trying to make them looking good with any shaft like my current playing cue seems to do. I also do like the feel and look of satin and matte finish in pair with c.f. shaft over common glossy one. For example my butt is out of such hard and densed like hell ABW that there is much less risk to get a dent in the wood. I can tell after playing with my current playing cue for more than a year and accidentally hitting the rail and other objects while playing like it happens sometimes...I can't still find a single dent in the wood. I have possibility to play with my butt in combination with Cuetec Cynergy one of my students bought recently and asked to test it to know my opinion. I did not notice any strange pingy sound yet. Plays and feels very solid...such a stiff combination I've never experienced before (with exception to another c.f. Revo 12.9) and I really like though Cynergy has Sniper tip on it which seems to be rather soft then hard. Cynergy has definitely different and much more common sound and feel in comparison with Revo.
On the picture the combination with the Revo I've tested much earlier.
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Last edited by S.Vaskovskyi; 05-18-2019 at 10:46 AM.
  
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05-18-2019, 10:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
Just wondering. With the emergence of the black factory shafts will cue builders start building butts in colors and design schemes that go with the black shafts? Will they soften the hit of the butt a little to take the ping out of the carbon fiber shafts with a hard tip?

Just curious about player's opinions. I could have put the same question in one of the builders forums but I want users opinions rather than builder's opinions.

Hu
I just started playing with a GB1 with a Cuetec carbon fiber shaft. By far the most comfortable combination I've ever used.

Regards,

John
  
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05-18-2019, 10:50 AM

I've bought a few cues lately and almost all have ebony in them, either forearm or butt and points. While I do like ebony and figure they'll look a little better with a black shaft, I'm more concerned with how they play with maple. As far as tuning butts for playability, I have no idea. Many post that the butt doesn't matter, it's just a handle for the shaft, but I'm not sure about that. I have this coming later in the summer.
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05-18-2019, 11:23 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveM View Post
I've bought a few cues lately and almost all have ebony in them, either forearm or butt and points. While I do like ebony and figure they'll look a little better with a black shaft, I'm more concerned with how they play with maple. As far as tuning butts for playability, I have no idea. Many post that the butt doesn't matter, it's just a handle for the shaft, but I'm not sure about that. I have this coming later in the summer.
In my humble opinion the butt does matter and quite a lot but that is my experience. Now in pair with such a stiff shaft out of c.f. like Revo or Cynergy I can easily see and feel it. I've tested both Revo and Cynergy on my full spliced extremely stiff butt and other butt with maple forearm. The difference in vibration is obvious. These two set ups vibrate and resonate so differently. C.f. is stiffer then maple so on a maple forearm the amplitude and frequency of vibrations in certain parts of the cue is so different in comparison with my butt with very stiff and densed ABW in the forearm. The question is what does the one likes in his cue.


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05-18-2019, 11:49 AM

Becue offers a full carbon fiber cue. And there are numerous colors and designs.
  
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05-18-2019, 01:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrickyb View Post
Becue offers a full carbon fiber cue. And there are numerous colors and designs.
My Becue plays damn good, but I'm using it with the Becue butt.

To me, it hits more like a wood cue than any of the REVO shafts that I've tried on the various wood butts that they have been coupled with.

FWIW, I've tried my friend's Becue Prime M 12.5mm on his custom wood butt (don't remember the maker at the moment) and it doesn't feel as "good" as my Becue does. Maybe that is because I've got used to mine, or maybe it has to do with carbon being attached to a wooden butt vs a carbon butt.

Someone mentioned in this thread (and other people in numerous threads on this site) that they didn't think the butt really make a difference. I totally disagree with that.

I have a custom wood shaft that I had made by Schmelke. It is 29", 13.25mm, 15" Pro taper, and has a 1/2" XTC ferrule and a black phenolic collar. It has an Ultra-skin soft tip on it. The joint is 3/8-10 flat faced, wood to wood. I had it made to fit two cues. Both cues are almost the same weight with the shaft and they are very close in diameters for the length of the butt.

On one cue (full spliced ebony nose with purple heart back end) with a G-10 pin, phenolic joint, and a black leather wrap, the shaft hits "stiff" and makes a "ping" when you shoot with it. It feels really "hard hitting".

The other cue is a RS-11 McDermott that isn't full-spliced and it has a linen wrap and an implex joint. On this butt, the cue plays way "softer" and feels nowhere near as "stiff". Also, the sound is muted and there is no "ping". To me, the shaft is much more "user-friendly", on this butt, when it comes to controlling the cue ball.

There is a noticeable difference between the way the shaft plays, sounds, and feels when you switch it between the two different butts.

If any pool scientist wants to believe otherwise, they are free to come over and try the cues out.

Last edited by HawaiianEye; 05-18-2019 at 01:45 PM.
  
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05-18-2019, 02:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
Just wondering. With the emergence of the black factory shafts will cue builders start building butts in colors and design schemes that go with the black shafts?

Hu
I use an Ikon 2-1 and Schon H4 (Hoppe tribute) with the REVO. Both match up great with the black shaft. No need to custom order or look for another butt.





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05-18-2019, 06:43 PM

I have a blak 4 and think the revo looks great on it.
  
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05-19-2019, 02:16 PM

I use GO customs cf shaft with zan grip hard tip.
This shaft sound almost indentically like wooden shafts.

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