Dealing with people who dont know fractions

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv
Silver Member
I needed a extra long drill bit .504 which no one makes .
1/2 drill bit is 16 bucks. next size up is a 13mm .05115 Price 259. 00 bucks :mad:
I decided that I could use a 33/64 drill bit , .515 .

I go into a place that I can order drill bits .
I talk to a young lady who flat out said this is over her head and said her manager will be back after lunch .
She gave me a pen and piece paper .
I wrote down my name phone number , That I needed a extra long drill bit about 12 inches in length and in a 33/64 Dia .


The manager never called me that day instead he called me two days later .
Once again I explained what I needed .

He calls me back in 1 hr and said the drill bit I needed was in this kit of drill bits .

The kits biggest drill bit was 1/2 .
It was a normal drill bit set that went from like 1/32 to 1/2 and they were not extra long !
Part of my point is the drill bit size I wanted wasn't in the kit and the second part the drill bits were not extra long and everyone I talked to didn't know how to use a drill and tap chart.
And I had already told everyone written on paper what I wanted and they couldn't get it right .....

I told the manager Hey You couldn't get it right the first three times , I am not willing to explain what I want again .
 
K

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
What you're looking for is a 12.8mm and yes, it is made.
I'll point you in the direction of the library but I'm not doing your homework.
The library is located near eBay.
I'll give you a hint: It's got nothing to do with fractions.
 
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mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv
Silver Member
Drill bit

KJ Cues said:
What you're looking for is a 12.8mm and yes, it is made.
I'll point you in the direction of the library but I'm not doing your homework.
The library is located near eBay.
I'll give you a hint: It's got nothing to do with fractions.
Click to expand...

I got in the 33/64th drill bit in yesterday ....thank you .
 
Texas Carom Club

Texas Carom Club

9ball did to billiards what hiphop did to america
Silver Member
When I order tools I have a few select that I ask for, if they are on the line with someone else, I wait

dealing random unknowns I don't do because this can and does happen
 
mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv
Silver Member
12.8 mm extra long drill bit

I got the 33/64th drill bit in for 27.00.
I did a short search for a 12.8 mm extra long drill bit ,
Grainger came up with a carbide 12.8 mm extra long for 529.00 or 559.00

I also found a 13mm extra long drill bit in the UK not sure of the price but my guess was 30 to 40 bucks .
Here its 130.00 to 259.00
Sure some of you will prove me wrong but we are getting bent over for the cost of some metric tooling where its ten time less in other countries .
 
K

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
Mike,

Have you ever heard the expression; "you catch more flies with honey than you will with rant" ?

"A problem exists only because of a lack of imagination." That's another one. I just made it up.
However, it's true.
I can buy a 1/2" x 12" drill bit with 3/8" reduced shank for $6.50.
That completes the majority of your task.
I can buy a 12.8 mm drill bit for under $10. If you want it 8"L, it's $13.35 (free shipping).
Do you want one 12"L or longer ? Do you know a tool & die welder ?
Thinking is easier than bending and obviously more cost effective.
 
J

john coloccia

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
KJ Cues said:
Mike,

Have you ever heard the expression; "you catch more flies with honey than you will with rant" ?

"A problem exists only because of a lack of imagination." That's another one. I just made it up.
However, it's true.
I can buy a 1/2" x 12" drill bit with 3/8" reduced shank for $6.50.
That completes the majority of your task.
I can buy a 12.8 mm drill bit for under $10. If you want it 8"L, it's $13.35 (free shipping).
Do you want one 12"L or longer ? Do you know a tool & die welder ?
Thinking is easier than bending and obviously more cost effective.
Click to expand...

Wow...never considered that! Does that work on taps too? I just assumed that it would be very prone to breaking, leading to disaster....but I never thought to actually try it.
 
conetip

conetip

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
John, 680 welding rod will weld a tap to a piece of other tool steel or to 4140 or 4340 etc. There may well be a better welding product out there these days. I think 680 is a Eutectic product from like 30 years ago or so. Maybe they have a tig alternative these days. Google may have more options or info of course.
Neil
 
K

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
john coloccia said:
Wow...never considered that! Does that work on taps too? I just assumed that it would be very prone to breaking, leading to disaster....but I never thought to actually try it.
Click to expand...

Well, that's why I said tool & die welder. They know how to weld tool-steel and dis-similar metals.
Lack of knowledge/experience can result in cracking, breakage and a non-uniform hardness.
Consider though that if the 1/2"x12' drill were used to open the hole, he'd only need to go .005" larger.
There's not going to be a lot of load/twist on the modified/fabbed drill. I think I could pull it off, but that's me.
While I'm not certified tool & die, I have been welding for 50 yrs. If Mike can't do it, find someone who can.
Even if the guy is not someone he knows he's going to be way under $500. More than likely under $50 tops. I'd be like $20 total.
Oh, to your question about taps. Yes, I believe it can be done but consider what you'd be tapping. Wood, easy. Metal, not so much.

HTHs, KJ

To Neil,
Ah yes, Moly. I used to make springer front-ends for motorcycles about 45 yrs ago. Used 4130 for the legs.
Millions of flex-cycles. Some of my work appeared in national magazines. If I don't blow my horn, who will ?
 
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DaveK

DaveK

Still crazy after all these years
Silver Member
mortuarymike-nv said:
Sure some of you will prove me wrong but we are getting bent over for the cost of some metric tooling where its ten time less in other countries .
Click to expand...

Quite possibly a result of your country's ambivalence and pushing back against the metric system for so long.

Dave
 
K

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
I'll give you something to think about Dave. In this country, back before Metric, all the high dollar mechs
had $5-6,000 'Snap-on' tool sets. Now along comes the metric system and the mechs are like WTF ?
That meant that they now had to go out and buy metric wrenches, etc. Even the auto makers were hesitant at first.
USA thought the rest of the world was just kidding, would see the error of their ways and come back to Imperial/SAE.
Since they made the majority of the best cars at the time, they were going to wait it out. No such luck so the
auto-makers started using SOME metric hrdw so now the car was 1/2 metric, 1/2 SAE. Talk about a cluster-flock !
Just the opposite was common in the rest of the world; Germany, Japan, etc.
If they wanted to work on American cars, they had to have SAE tools even though they were on the metric system.
They both work equally as well IMO and I now have twice as many bright, shiny tools in my box.
Had to get a bigger box though.
 
J

john coloccia

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
We switched to metric where there was a real advantage, and that's in the sciences. There's no advantage if you don't have to deal with systems that use all sorts of different units to arrive at an answer, and where it's convenient that the units are organized in some sensible way. But I'll say that metric is a little crazy. Let's choose the CGS system...centimeters, grams, seconds. Look how crazy those units are! You have to use 1/100 of the basic unit for length (the Meter), to get something even close to congruent with grams, but how light is a gram!!! 1/100 of a meter is still absolutely gargantuan when you compare it to the weight of one gram. What do you know that's 1 cubic meter and weighs a gram? So there's craziness there too.

But there's no real advantage to switching anything else over, and please don't anyone say "fractions" because that has nothing to do with metric or imperial. The metric advantage is much deeper and has to do with the relationships between fundamental scientific units.

But I wish we would just choose one way or another and just get on with it. But hey, KJ...who ever complained about more tools, right? I wonder if I could buy another lathe and convince my wife that I needed a metric one too?
 
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Murray Tucker

Murray Tucker

Just a Padawan
Silver Member
In my machine shop I still have the old tool cage set up as kind of a shrine to the "good ole days" of machinists. It is full of hand built tools, jigs etc. that were built back in the 60's and 70's. If a machinist needed something special to do a job back in those days then they had to build it. There are probably 50 extra long drill bits that were make by brazing on a longer shank. Brass is nice because it is strong but you don't have to apply a lot of heat and it is easy to machine off after you are done.
 
DaveK

DaveK

Still crazy after all these years
Silver Member
KJ Cues said:
I'll give you something to think about Dave. In this country, back before Metric, all the high dollar mechs
had $5-6,000 'Snap-on' tool sets. Now along comes the metric system and the mechs are like WTF ?
That meant that they now had to go out and buy metric wrenches, etc. Even the auto makers were hesitant at first.
USA thought the rest of the world was just kidding, would see the error of their ways and come back to Imperial/SAE.
Since they made the majority of the best cars at the time, they were going to wait it out. No such luck so the
auto-makers started using SOME metric hrdw so now the car was 1/2 metric, 1/2 SAE. Talk about a cluster-flock !
Just the opposite was common in the rest of the world; Germany, Japan, etc.
If they wanted to work on American cars, they had to have SAE tools even though they were on the metric system.
They both work equally as well IMO and I now have twice as many bright, shiny tools in my box.
Had to get a bigger box though.
Click to expand...

I hear ya. In Canada we have an interesting time in that we import much product from the USA, and also from the rest of the world. Any decent mechanic in Canada has both imperial and metric tools. I have wrenches, crow-foots, sockets (not the handles, they are all 1/4", 3/8", and 1/2" :thumbup:), taps, dies, drill bits, and many measurement dvices in both ... it does take up a few more drawers :thumbup::thumbup: When I go to work on something I will grab both as it is a guessing game depending on the product. I'd say our world here is about 1/2 and 1/2, if you work on plumbing, electronics, farm machinery, autos of all vintages, etc. . Personally my stock of NC and NF fasteners is significantly larger than my metric fasteners, but can get any common metric thread with ease.

My local Bolt Supply has an extensive supply of both product. For example their threaded rod rack is two sided, one for metric and the other for imperial ... same for the stainless threaded rod rack. No issues finding product.

Dave <-- also has a BA wrench set :eek: and is a bit of a measurement and units enthusiast :D
 
J

john coloccia

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
carguy said:
john coloccia said:
What do you know that's 1cc and weighs a gram? So there's craziness there too.

QUOTE]

Water.
It's tooo simple.

Robin Snyder
Click to expand...

Yeah obviously, by definition (used to be, anyhow). I meant 1 cubic meter and was just typing along on auto pilot. I corrected my post. The point is that the most basic units are orders of magnitude apart in scale so you have to use thousands of one to match up somewhat with one of another.
Click to expand...
 
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