Hitting it pure...I'm gonna get hate for this but oh well.

Drop The Rock

Drop The Rock

1652nd on AZ Money List
Silver Member
I love this topic. Although I can't describe or quantify it, only compare it.

Ever hit a golf ball with a 7 iron and feel the difference between two shots that travel the exact same distance? TO ME, this comes from proper tempo and acceleration with the least amount of tension in my arms and hands, while maintaining uniform motion.

I used to play a ton of basketball and could always feel the difference between pushing and shooting. Pushing the ball was a result of near zero uniform motion and resulted in zero backspin. Shooting was a result of excellent tempo and maximum uniform motion.

I believe this applies to pool as well. I have heard many a pro, whether by podcast or in person, talk about hitting the ball pure. Some attribute it to tempo, others how light you hold the cue, acceleration etc.

For those that don't believe that this phenomenon exists please explain why.

For those that do, what is that x factor for you?
 
philly

philly

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
peppersauce said:
I think hitting a ball pure is a thing for sure. For me it has a lot to do with smooth acceleration and a grip that allows me to release the cue as it goes through the CB. Timing is important as well. When everything comes together, it makes me feel like any shot is makeable and any position attainable without forcing the CB around.

I don't know if I actually answered your question but that's how it feels when I'm hitting the ball pure.
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It's being in the zone, as they say. We're all looking for the reason why we can't play our best game all of the time. I think it's because we get in our own way and overthink. It's the feeling of just doing whatever we imagine.. Nothing more. And yes, it is like golf, when you pure an iron and don't even feel the ball on the club head.
 
Straightpool_99

Straightpool_99

I see dead balls
Silver Member
To me, hitting the ball pure is about having the correct stroke timing as well as straightness. When you do it right, you get the sensation of "pushing" the ball around, rather than hitting it. Watch Buddy Hall or Stephen Hendry to get what I mean. I humbly suggest that the people that are going to give the op and me a hard time about this, are the ones that never have, nor ever will, have that feeling.


The best teaching I ever got, was getting a crack in the ferrule of my first cue. The cue repair guy told me that it was not worth fixing, so I filled in the crack with glue. I was terrified of hitting the ball too hard, with a sharp impact or glancing blow, so I worked hard on the "pushing" stroke, to get the maximum action with the least stress to the ferrule. Keeping the cue level and accelerating at the right time to "cushion" the blow. That ferrule problem turned into a wonderful learning opportunity.
 
P

pooln8r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Drop The Rock said:
I love this topic. Although I can't describe or quantify it, only compare it.

Ever hit a golf ball with a 7 iron and feel the difference between two shots that travel the exact same distance? TO ME, this comes from proper tempo and acceleration with the least amount of tension in my arms and hands, while maintaining uniform motion.

I used to play a ton of basketball and could always feel the difference between pushing and shooting. Pushing the ball was a result of near zero uniform motion and resulted in zero backspin. Shooting was a result of excellent tempo and maximum uniform motion.

I believe this applies to pool as well. I have heard many a pro, whether by podcast or in person, talk about hitting the ball pure. Some attribute it to tempo, others how light you hold the cue, acceleration etc.

For those that don't believe that this phenomenon exists please explain why.

For those that do, what is that x factor for you?
Click to expand...

Great thread!...Gotta love this game!
Sounds to me like you're talking about proper stroke timing. I just had this conversation with Dennis Spears, local high level player here in NJ. He talked about how important it was to get through the ball properly and in the correct part of your stroke. Sure makes a world of difference when you hit the ball at the proper point in your stroke timing with a level cue and get through the ball. If you have your alignment on and your head clear enough being in the zone isn't too far away. This one aspect in our fundamentals can make playing way more enjoyable and ball movement way more accurate and predictable.

Good shooting to you!

Kevin
 
philly

philly

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
pooln8r said:
Great thread!...Gotta love this game!
Sounds to me like you're talking about proper stroke timing. I just had this conversation with Dennis Spears, local high level player here in NJ. He talked about how important it was to get through the ball properly and in the correct part of your stroke. Sure makes a world of difference when you hit the ball at the proper point in your stroke timing with a level cue and get through the ball. If you have your alignment on and your head clear enough being in the zone isn't too far away. This one aspect in our fundamentals can make playing way more enjoyable and ball movement way more accurate and predictable.

Good shooting to you!

Kevin
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Analyse all you want. How do you get in the zone? I know this thread is going to turn into another fundamentals thread. I see it evolving. If you concentrate on every aspect of the stoke you will paralyze yourself. I think it's all PSR and letting your subconscious take over.
 
S

SilverCue

Sir Raksalot
Silver Member
It's what Mark Gray and Daryl Peach was missing in the final WCoP :)
Esp Daryl.

Some players may need to be in the zone, other players can do it on demand.
 
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ENGLISH!

ENGLISH!

Banned
Silver Member
If one has any wrist action it is about timing that wrist action. If one has no wrist action & uses a full pendulum stroke it is probably hitting at or perhaps better yet just before the transfer of direction.
 
philly

philly

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
peppersauce said:
I was talking to Gabe Owen some years ago and I asked him about his weird wrist action with his grip hand. His response..."If I start thinking about that I won't be able to make a ball." Lol.
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Exactly. I have said this before: If you analyse every little thing that it takes to walk you probably would fall over. When you are playing in the zone, for lack of a better phrase, it's like breathing. Some players are able to fall into it better than others and have what we call consistency. Me, well, I call it getting in my own way or stepping on my own d**k.
 
HawaiianEye

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
peppersauce said:
I was talking to Gabe Owen some years ago and I asked him about his weird wrist action with his grip hand. His response..."If I start thinking about that I won't be able to make a ball." Lol.
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I've had people ask me the same thing and it is something I rarely notice.

I think sometimes it is my subconscious realizing that my timing is a bit off and I use my wrist in order to try to make a correction at the last second. I also think it comes into play when a player is attempting to "muscle" the shot with a bit of BHE to get some extra OOMPHH on the cue ball.

I think timing is one of the most important things when it comes to controlling the cue ball. If your timing is off, your stroke won't have the OOMPHH it needs to carry through the ball for a "pure" hit feeling.
 
N

Neil

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
philly said:
Exactly. I have said this before: If you analyse every little thing that it takes to walk you probably would fall over. When you are playing in the zone, for lack of a better phrase, it's like breathing. Some players are able to fall into it better than others and have what we call consistency. Me, well, I call it getting in my own way or stepping on my own d**k.
Click to expand...

And, that is something I don't think you will find anyone to disagree with. Analyzing is for the practice table. Playing is for allowing your subconscious to do what you trained it to do.

On the flip side- when you know exactly what you do, because of training, then when something goes awry you usually are very quickly able to identify it and correct it immediately. That is a huge benefit to have.
 
N

Neil

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
HawaiianEye said:
I've had people ask me the same thing and it is something I rarely notice.

I think sometimes it is my subconscious realizing that my timing is a bit off and I use my wrist in order to try to make a correction at the last second. I also think it comes into play when a player is attempting to "muscle" the shot with a bit of BHE to get some extra OOMPHH on the cue ball.

I think timing is one of the most important things when it comes to controlling the cue ball. If your timing is off, your stroke won't have the OOMPHH it needs to carry through the ball for a "pure" hit feeling.
Click to expand...

I think the biggest part is to not even think about hitting the cb, but just have a smooth, accurate stroke. I think all the feeling of a pure stroke is just how one feels when what they expect to happen actually happens. And, that comes from hitting the cb where one intends to at the speed and angle one intends to, and knowing what will happen when they do that.
 
philly

philly

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
HawaiianEye said:
I've had people ask me the same thing and it is something I rarely notice.

I think sometimes it is my subconscious realizing that my timing is a bit off and I use my wrist in order to try to make a correction at the last second. I also think it comes into play when a player is attempting to "muscle" the shot with a bit of BHE to get some extra OOMPHH on the cue ball.

I think timing is one of the most important things when it comes to controlling the cue ball. If your timing is off, your stroke won't have the OOMPHH it needs to carry through the ball for a "pure" hit feeling.
Click to expand...

I don't know. Follow through and stroke should be enough to give it oomph.
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
Like others have said, timing and acceleration are key, but difficult to consciously control outside of practice. Personally, I like to use imagery to help get the timing down or fix whatever issues I may be having.

For example, I find the image the cue tip "biting" into the cue ball prevents deceleration and improves the consistency and quality of spin. I also tend to rush on the backswing when nervous, so when that starts happening, I'll imagine the backswing as like pulling back on a bow and then releasing to let the cue shoot forward like an arrow.
 
D

dawgcpa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Tempo

Here is one thing I've been pondering lately. Is there a set tempo ratio for good players? I read the tour tempo book for golf that said good players swing with the same backswing and forward swing ratio. They may be faster or slower overall but the ratio would be very close. Do good pool players do the same thing when they are playing well?
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
dawgcpa said:
Here is one thing I've been pondering lately. Is there a set tempo ratio for good players? I read the tour tempo book for golf that said good players swing with the same backswing and forward swing ratio. They may be faster or slower overall but the ratio would be very close. Do good pool players do the same thing when they are playing well?
Click to expand...

I think most good players tend to use a slow, deliberate backswing, even on power shots. In pool (and snooker for that matter), I believe it's the length (not the speed) of the backswing that determines the speed of the shot.
 
Patrick Johnson

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
I think some of these descriptions are more vague and abstract than they need to be. The essential ingredients of a "pure" (or whatever) hit are more mundane and, dare I say, fundamental, than most think.

I think a "pure" hit is mostly about tip/CB precision with a smooth, accelerating stroke that reaches the right speed at contact - and the outcome matching what was envisioned. The pieces are common; what's uncommon, and can make it all seem unusually effortless, is when they come together exactly as planned.

pj
chgo
 
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