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sixpack
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06-19-2019, 01:44 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
OK, so now that we got that out of the way I just have a simple question. Based on the video I posted and the ensuing discussion do you think Stan has made an error when he says that speed does not affect throw when using his version of CTE? Note that Stan made a second video with triple shimmed pockets and demonstrated the same shots at different speeds and made all of them. Of course as a scientist yourself it should be clear that this second video is invalid as the test subject (Stan) knows what he is trying to achieve (center pocket for all shots). In the first video he was concentrating on shooting exactly the same way each time except with different speed and I believe he did not realize that the ball really was throwing. Another potential problem with the second video is that the cut angle was shallow and there is an angle somewhere around 10 or 15 degrees (Brian would know) where speed really does not affect the amount of throw. But, this is a special case and has nothing to do with CTE.

Again, pm if fine if you don't want to discuss publicly.
I really canít speak to what Stan was trying to do or not do and I donít remember the videos that well.

As Iím not a CTE proponent but more of an interested observer, what would my opinion mean? Not much.

We all know how throw, swerve and deflection work. What we donít know is how or why CTE works. Or even if it does.

Iíve tried what I think is CTE on a very limited basis and had very good success with it. Enough that I want to know more.

Because of some life things that came up just as I was exploring CTE I havenít put the effort into understanding that I had planned to. So right now I am just waiting for more info like practically everybody else.

Also, for the record, Iím not a scientist now. Iím a business person and use my math/sci background to that end. Iím not sitting in a lab somewhere. I hate sitting. And labs.


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Dan White
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06-19-2019, 01:55 PM

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Originally Posted by sixpack View Post
I really canít speak to what Stan was trying to do or not do and I donít remember the videos that well.

As Iím not a CTE proponent but more of an interested observer, what would my opinion mean? Not much.

We all know how throw, swerve and deflection work. What we donít know is how or why CTE works. Or even if it does.

Iíve tried what I think is CTE on a very limited basis and had very good success with it. Enough that I want to know more.

Because of some life things that came up just as I was exploring CTE I havenít put the effort into understanding that I had planned to. So right now I am just waiting for more info like practically everybody else.

Also, for the record, Iím not a scientist now. Iím a business person and use my math/sci background to that end. Iím not sitting in a lab somewhere. I hate sitting. And labs.
OK. If your interest gets sparked some day then just watch Stan's video and then my video. It's all pretty much 101 type stuff.


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06-20-2019, 05:32 PM

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Originally Posted by Get_A_Grip View Post
Okay, I will switch gears. I will give you a aiming system that I developed myself for your consideration. (At least I haven't heard any other person mention this).

However, it doesn't address finding the contact point on the object ball. So you will be able to use this system WITH your CTE system to improve the accuracy of your shooting.

You might be thinking, wait, get a grip just said that aiming systems are unnecessary. I did. But here is what I discovered.

There is a way to aim with your "minds eye" to the contact point on object ball that "feels like" aiming when shooting a gun.

What I do is that I imagine in my "minds eye" the contact point with the cue from my Ring Finger of my grip hand to the contact point more forward on my grip hand with the cue (could be contact point with tip of Index Finger or some other point) and I align that with the path to the cue tip to the contact point on the object ball. All in a straight line.

On my final stroke I just focus on the contact point from the most forward spot on my grip hand with the cue to the contact point on the object ball. And that's it.

The cue ball hits the exact spot on the object ball that I'm focusing on.

The only thing that you need to do is to find the 1 or 2 contact points on your grip hand to use to get the most accurate results. I did this by shooting long, straight shots, corner to corner, using pocket reducers.

All I know is, it works. Although, upon first glance, it feels like it shouldn't, because you are literally aiming using points on your grip hand that are behind your actual eyes. But it's your subconscious that is doing the visualizing and the aiming.

Try it out.


_______
This is actually an interesting post on how to work with contact points. No wonder it gets ignored and ridiculed.

It helped dial me in for my small snooker challenge match, got a couple good breaks. I allready use contact points, combined with ghost ball elements (it's a bit complicated but it works for me) but this is something new to work on. I feel that for snooker, contact points really is the way to go, though many of my friends use back of ball instead. It certainly worked ok this time. Thanks for posting it.

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06-20-2019, 05:38 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
This is actually an interesting post on how to work with contact points. No wonder it gets ignored and ridiculed.

It helped dial me in for my small snooker challenge match got a couple good breaks. I allready use contact points, combined with ghost ball elements (it's a bit complicated but it works for me) but this is something new to work on. It certainly worked ok this time. Thanks for posting it.
No problem. I figured that if someone actually tried it, they would realize that it actually works really well. It basically takes care of the aligning and aiming part. For a large majority of the shots that I shoot now and miss, it's because I simply chose the wrong spot on the object ball to aim at. The cue ball almost always goes where I aimed it.




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06-20-2019, 05:49 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
This is actually an interesting post on how to work with contact points. No wonder it gets ignored and ridiculed.

It helped dial me in for my small snooker challenge match, got a couple good breaks. I allready use contact points, combined with ghost ball elements (it's a bit complicated but it works for me) but this is something new to work on. I feel that for snooker, contact points really is the way to go, though many of my friends use back of ball instead. It certainly worked ok this time. Thanks for posting it.
It is also interesting that you tried it with snooker, where you need to shoot very accurately. The strength of this technique is the accuracy, because to really dial in my grip on the cue and my stroke, I use pocket reducers so I'm shooting into a 3 1/4 inch pocket. When I'm dialed in, I can make 5 to 7 shots in a row from long distance. While I could barely make a ball into these tight pockets without using this technique.


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06-20-2019, 05:50 PM

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Originally Posted by Get_A_Grip View Post
No problem. I figured that if someone actually tried it, they would realize that it actually works really well. It basically takes care of the aligning and aiming part. For a large majority of the shots that I shoot now and miss, it's because I simply chose the wrong spot on the object ball to aim at. The cue ball almost always goes where I aimed it.




_______
I really think that for experienced players, one of the benefits of aiming, or alignment systems is to give you something very detailed and specific to really focus in on, in order to get into the zone. For me that can sometimes be something like the follow through, or the system you just proposed. When you key in on one thing like that, it's easier to shut out the noise of the environment and the negative thoughts.
  
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06-20-2019, 06:00 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
I really think that for experienced players, one of the benefits of aiming, or alignment systems is to give you something very detailed and specific to really focus in on, in order to get into the zone. For me that can sometimes be something like the follow through, or the system you just proposed. When you key in on one thing like that, it's easier to shut out the noise of the environment and the negative thoughts.
Good point. It definitely helps to eliminate side thoughts, because once you realize that if you focus on the line from the contact point on the grip hand to the contact point on the object ball and you always hit that spot, then you stop worrying about many other things about your form and stroke. Trust the aiming technique and the balls go in.




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06-20-2019, 06:01 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Get_A_Grip View Post
It is also interesting that you tried it with snooker, where you need to shoot very accurately. The strength of this technique is the accuracy, because to really dial in my grip on the cue and my stroke, I use pocket reducers so I'm shooting into a 3 1/4 inch pocket. When I'm dialed in, I can make 5 to 7 shots in a row from long distance. While I could barely make a ball into these tight pockets without using this technique.


_______
Snooker really is a beautiful game, it's a shame you don't have more of it in the States. There is just something so satisfying and natural about the "feel" of the game. The pockets are tight but very fair. The wool (match) cloth plays very natural and sweet, even with the nap.

The pocket reducers (I use them myself sometimes for pool) gives you some idea, but they are actually more difficult than most snooker pockets on some shots.

Alignment is key in all cue sports but especially for snooker and it's really tough to consistently line up to the level required to sink the longest shots in the game. Even the pros can't do it all the time. Your system is a very nice tool to have, working on that aspect of the game.

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06-20-2019, 07:05 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
I feel that for snooker, contact points really is the way to go, though many of my friends use back of ball instead.
Is there a quick description of back of ball aiming?

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06-20-2019, 07:16 PM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
Is there a quick description of back of ball aiming?

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It's just another name for the quarters system/fractional.
  
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06-21-2019, 03:52 AM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
It's just another name for the quarters system/fractional.
Oh, OK... thanks.

Any idea what ďback of ballĒ refers to specifically? Which ball? Whereís the back of it?

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06-21-2019, 05:22 AM

"Back of ball" system is best described as Joe Tucker did it-- that s in my opinion exactly the same. A contact to contact.
And Joe s "Aiming by numbers" showing it really "easy to understand"- and if you see how Joe s System works, the "Back of Ball" System (the name of it) makes finally sense


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06-21-2019, 09:19 AM

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Originally Posted by Ratta View Post
"Back of ball" system is best described as Joe Tucker did it-- that s in my opinion exactly the same. A contact to contact.
And Joe s "Aiming by numbers" showing it really "easy to understand"- and if you see how Joe s System works, the "Back of Ball" System (the name of it) makes finally sense
So "back of ball" refers to the far side of the CB? Does the method include a technique for estimating how to match the CB contact point on the "back of (the cue) ball" with the OB contact point?

Tucker's numbers are a guide, but you can't see the numbers on the CB when shooting, so you have to estimate its position...?

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