Breakdown of Earl Strickland Shot

Catalin

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's normal for the CB to have some forward momentum until the backspin catches, especially that it's a cut and not a direct hit. That's why drawing near the side pocket and not scratching is tricky.

It also depends on the cloth type and condition, humidity...

Julian
 

ShootingArts

Smorg is giving St Peter the 7!
Gold Member
Silver Member
this

Its not going 'forward', its sliding down the tangent line a good distance because of new/clean cloth and balls.



This is what is happening. Earl took advantage of having a big pocket to work with by shooting the ball into the far side of the pocket to get more angle. This added to the illusion that the cue ball went forward a little bit or took an unnatural forward angle. Just the tangent line with the angle Earl created.

Hu
 

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Cool video of someone analyzing a great draw shot by Earl.

My question is if he's hitting low left on the cueball, how does the cueball end up going forward a little?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anKb4pwLLPU
There was clearly a slight cut angle on the shot, combined with the new cloth and the hard pace of the stroke, is what resulted in the cue ball heading towards the left down the tangent line before the extreme bottom outside draw really took on the cloth.
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
It's normal for the CB to have some forward momentum until the backspin catches, especially that it's a cut and not a direct hit. That's why drawing near the side pocket and not scratching is tricky.

It also depends on the cloth type and condition, humidity...

Julian
As others have said, it's not "forward momentum", the CB does not go forward, and that wouldn't be "normal".

The CB goes directly along the 90-degree tangent line, as expected.

pj
chgo
 

Catalin

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
As others have said, it's not "forward momentum", the CB does not go forward, and that wouldn't be "normal".



The CB goes directly along the 90-degree tangent line, as expected.



pj

chgo
You are either blind or you like to argue The tangent line is an approximation, it will not travel exactly on the tangent depending on speed and spin. If you want to get technical, the CB does not travel straight on *any* cut shot, it curves right after impact.

Julian
 

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
... The tangent line is an approximation, it will not travel exactly on the tangent depending on speed and spin. ....
It looks to me like the tangent line is sufficient to explain the shot, as others have pointed out. Slippery, new cloth helps a lot with the delayed curve.
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You are either blind or you like to argue The tangent line is an approximation, it will not travel exactly on the tangent depending on speed and spin. If you want to get technical, the CB does not travel straight on *any* cut shot, it curves right after impact.

Julian
Don't waste your time dude. He knows everything. Just ask him.
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
You are either blind or you like to argue The tangent line is an approximation, it will not travel exactly on the tangent depending on speed and spin. If you want to get technical, the CB does not travel straight on *any* cut shot, it curves right after impact.

Julian
If you want to get technical:

1. The tangent line isn't an approximation, and the CB will travel exactly on it immediately after impact with the OB for every shot, regardless of spin.

2. Depending on the CB's (forward/reverse) spin, it will curve forward or back from the tangent line after sliding straight along it a greater or shorter distance depending on speed.

3. When the CB hits the OB with no forward or reverse spin, it continues straight along the tangent line without curving forward or back.

4. On Earl's shot (and every cut shot with draw, unless the CB is heavier than the OB) the CB never goes forward of the tangent line (despite forward momentum) because it has no forward spin. It travels straight along the tangent line until the draw spin takes effect and then it curves back off the tangent line (toward the shooter).

pj
chgo
 

Catalin

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If you want to get technical:



1. The tangent line isn't an approximation, and the CB will travel exactly on it immediately after impact with the OB for every shot, regardless of spin.

The CB will curve around the OB on a no spin cut shot. Please allow me to elaborate. From a physics perspective, the newtonian law of action and reaction applies. When the CB strikes the OB, the OB responds with an equal and opposite force. But the CB still has forward momentum and the result of it wanting to travel forward and being pushed to the side causes it to curve. Please refer to the short video below for further explanation and slow motion evidence.

In spite of our disagreements, this is an useful thread.

https://youtu.be/heaU2bmW5n4

Julian
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
If you want to get technical:



4. On Earl's shot (and every cut shot with draw, unless the CB is heavier than the OB) the CB never goes forward of the tangent line (despite forward momentum) because it has no forward spin. It travels straight along the tangent line until the draw spin takes effect and then it curves back off the tangent line (toward the shooter).

pj
chgo

The cue ball went past the tangent line. Check it again. It was heading to the second diamond instead of the first diamond before it drew .
New cloth.
Also, it might shock you, some cue balls are heavier than ob's.
 

Tony_in_MD

You want some of this?
Silver Member
What I find interesting in viewing the video was a comparison of the tip position by both players at address.

Little things like that interest me.

:wink:

picture.php
 

FeelDaShot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Cool video of someone analyzing a great draw shot by Earl.

My question is if he's hitting low left on the cueball, how does the cueball end up going forward a little?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anKb4pwLLPU

Beiber, it amazes me that you are asking such a silly question. You've been posting on here for as long as i can remember and you still don't understand the tangent line?!? This is Pool 101 and you should have figured it out long before you ever heard of Earl Strickland or AZBilliards.com. This absolutely blows my mind. You've lost all credibility. Stop typing and go hit some balls or read a book...smh. Hopefully this is all a big joke.
 
Last edited:

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
The CB will curve around the OB on a no spin cut shot. Please allow me to elaborate. From a physics perspective, the newtonian law of action and reaction applies. When the CB strikes the OB, the OB responds with an equal and opposite force. But the CB still has forward momentum and the result of it wanting to travel forward and being pushed to the side causes it to curve. Please refer to the short video below for further explanation and slow motion evidence.

In spite of our disagreements, this is an useful thread.

https://youtu.be/heaU2bmW5n4

Julian
In the video Barry Stark is playing the cue ball with full follow. That is why the cue ball curves forward. Your stated reason for the curve shows a misunderstanding of what is going on. Barry does a very poor job of explaining what is going on from a technical perspective.

As for the the initial path of the cue ball being forward or back of the 90-degree line, there are many reasons why that may happen:

1. The balls are not perfectly elastic. If they loose energy on contact, Newton's laws of motion require the angle to be less than 90 degrees. That means that the cue ball will go forward of the perpendicular to the object ball's path. No ball is perfectly elastic. Ivory balls are good to demonstrate this because they are considerably less elastic than cast phenolic balls.

2. There is throw. Throw will change the path of the object ball without changing the outbound direction of the cue ball. If throw is the only non-ideal thing going on, it can make the angle either more or less than 90 degrees.

3. The masses of the balls are not equal. This happens most often with old, worn cue balls which will tend to bounce back from a heavier object ball and make the angle more than 90. If you change that to a new cue ball, it will probably be a little heavier than the object balls and go forward of 90.

4. The cue ball is in the air at contact. This will make the cue ball go forward of 90. The cue ball is in the air for part of nearly every shot. Shoot harder and it is airborne longer.

As for Earl's shot, items 1 and 4 would have taken the cue ball forward while 2 on that shot would have tended to make the angle wider than 90 (equivalent of pushing the cue ball back).
 

BeiberLvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Beiber, it amazes me that you are asking such a silly question. You've been posting on here for as long as i can remember and you still don't understand the tangent line?!? This is Pool 101 and you should have figured it out long before you ever heard of Earl Strickland or AZBilliards.com. This absolutely blows my mind. You've lost all credibility. Stop typing and go hit some balls or read a book...smh. Hopefully this is all a big joke.

I’ll take the 6 for whatever
 

alstl

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
https://youtu.be/anKb4pwLLPU?t=304

Pause the video right there. Earl was using a longer bridge with an longer follow through and his cue was as level as he could get it which reduces the likelihood of the cue ball jumping after contacting the object ball. Earl's bridge hand is almost at the joint after the shot.
 
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