2018 US International Open - Observations

good point about the players info on index cards for commentators. Pat will surely pay attention to this comment as it is a good one. I would bet that happens next year.

It is a great tournament and I want to acknowledge all the things he has done right. Great commentating, great play, great sponsorship!!!!

inside_english said:

I think the commentators should have information on every player with basic information like age, place of birth or residence, recent accomplishments, type of cue, favorite game, etc.

Danny Diliberto just asked how old James Aranas was, and Mark Wilson did not know. These players are on the Live PPV stream, so if they want people to pay to watch matches they should possess some information in order to popularize the players.

There were a few instances where they did not know the ages of other players and Mark Wilson claimed we have "the greatest fans in the world" because they would update him either via chat or whatever.

Accu-stats should have done their due diligence by collecting the basic information for each player and having it at the ready for the folks in the booth, or even on index cards. Last I checked you could buy index cards at the dollar store.

It is now 10:40 AM and the website still has not been updated with the Stream schedule, for which they want payment.

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I couldn't agree more with you! No wonder pool is in such a horrible state over all.
It still baffles me they let Danny in the booth and I know many will bash me but his time has been up for years as far as announcing. He just keeps getting worse!

inside_english said:

I think the commentators should have information on every player with basic information like age, place of birth or residence, recent accomplishments, type of cue, favorite game, etc.

Danny Diliberto just asked how old James Aranas was, and Mark Wilson did not know. These players are on the Live PPV stream, so if they want people to pay to watch matches they should possess some information in order to popularize the players.

There were a few instances where they did not know the ages of other players and Mark Wilson claimed we have "the greatest fans in the world" because they would update him either via chat or whatever.

Accu-stats should have done their due diligence by collecting the basic information for each player and having it at the ready for the folks in the booth, or even on index cards. Last I checked you could buy index cards at the dollar store.

It is now 10:40 AM and the website still has not been updated with the Stream schedule, for which they want payment.

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Just curious here but did you think of just sending Accu-stats a msg/email about this? They bust ass to do these streams and i think we all understand mis-steps can/will be made. Just sayin.

inside_english said:

I think the commentators should have information on every player with basic information like age, place of birth or residence, recent accomplishments, type of cue, favorite game, etc.

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I've had this complaint for at least a decade. Let me add to your list with

1) result of recent matches, if any, between the two players
2) if it's their first meeting in competition, say so
3) basic style, strengths and weaknesses of each of the two players
4) whether 2018 has been a good year for each of the players
5) biggest major 9/10 ball title(s) won (such as WPA titles, US Open 9-ball, Derby City 9-ball, Eurotour titles, World Pool Masters, World Cup of Pool, etc.)

Pool commentators, in most cases, don't seem to follow the pool scene very closely and, for that reason, just as you suggest, need to be armed with this kind of information. Few of them could tell you who has won a tourney even in the last month, let alone the last year.

For whatever reasons, commentators offer little in the way of framing a match properly and, as you suggest, it's because they lack the information.

garczar said:

Just curious here but did you think of just sending Accu-stats a msg/email about this? They bust ass to do these streams and i think we all understand mis-steps can/will be made. Just sayin.

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Contact info: 973-838-7089 patscue@yahoo.com They also have a FB page. Let 'em know. Pat is a great guy and will listen/respond to helpful feedback.

sjm said:

I've had this complaint for at least a decade. Let me add to your list with

1) result of recent matches, if any, between the two players
2) if it's their first meeting in competition, say so
3) basic style, strengths and weaknesses of each of the two players
4) whether 2018 has been a good year for each of the players
5) biggest major 9/10 ball title(s) won (such as WPA titles, US Open 9-ball, Derby City 9-ball, Eurotour titles, World Pool Masters, World Cup of Pool, etc.)

Pool commentators, in most cases, don't seem to follow the pool scene very closely and, for that reason, just as you suggest, need to be armed with this kind of information. Few of them could tell you who has won a tourney even in the last month, let alone the last year.

For whatever reasons, commentators offer little in the way of framing a match properly and, as you suggest, it's because they lack the information.

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And mentors...age started playing....favorite cue...first cue...best game...worst game...
...most feared opponent....noted write-ups..etc

I don’t think Pat should have to handle this...each commentator should do pre-match
interviews.

PGA golf commentators should be the model, IMO...they even know the history of the
course and significant events on certain holes

Why does that matter?

This not ESPN! Pat and all of the other streamers work with limited resources to bring Pool to the masses.

There's no research department at Accu-Stats with interns that spend all day researching player stats and backgrounds.

Just as there is no Money in Pool for the players, there's no Money in Pool for the broadcasters of the events.

These guys love the game and bring it to us for that reason.

King T said:

This not ESPN! Pat and all of the other streamers work with limited resources to bring Pool to the masses.

There's no research department at Accu-Stats with interns that spend all day researching player stats and backgrounds.

Just as there is no Money in Pool for the players, there's no Money in Pool for the broadcasters of the events.

These guys love the game and bring it to us for that reason.

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Totally agree. I do think that having some basic background info. on the players would not be that hard to do. I also think that contacting them directly is more productive than doing it here. Just my $.02 on this, nothing more.

King T said:

This not ESPN! Pat and all of the other streamers work with limited resources to bring Pool to the masses.

There's no research department at Accu-Stats with interns that spend all day researching player stats and backgrounds.

Just as there is no Money in Pool for the players, there's no Money in Pool for the broadcasters of the events.

These guys love the game and bring it to us for that reason.

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This is all low tech that could be done by the commentators before the match...
...the efforts are basically costless....no research staff needed.

Also, we have a great source called AZ Billiards

sjm said:

I've had this complaint for at least a decade. Let me add to your list with

1) result of recent matches, if any, between the two players[...]

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Fedor vs Billy

Are you kidding? This information is at least 30 years behind identifying which ball is which. Is there a single commentator who can ID all the 3,4,5,6,7,10,11,12,13,14 n 15 numbered balls from ANY set from the booth? Not to my knowledge!

I find this thread interesting because I've been in the same spot as these coms many times. Only SkySports ever provided me any background info on players, so other than that it was up to me. My strategy was first to check their records on AZ for how they did in tournaments during the current year. I would also look for any major victories. Then I would spend maybe five minutes with each player prior to the match chatting about their most important wins, their prior record against their opponent, sponsors, cues, etc. Age and hometown is a given. Any other background I could glean in a short time was also helpful. Many players I knew pretty well already, but there were always new guys coming up.

I liked to see how they view their opponent and what strategy it might take to win. Then I would stand back and watch how they interact before the match began. I liked to see that dynamic because it told me a lot about how they felt about each other and the importance of the match. Sometimes I would see them discussing "deals" (believe me I could tell) and I knew that would have a bearing on how they played. Some guys have a well cultivated rivalry (Dennis and Shane for instance) and others may even travel together.

One other thing that I think is very important and is often left out of the commentary by some of these guys is what's at stake in this match! Is it winners or losers side? How much money is on the line? Who will the winner (and loser) play next and when? Everything that makes this match important (Mosconi Cup rankings could be very important this week!) is worth sharing with your audience imo.

I like the new resource that Fargo provides with previous match records and I would advise the current crop of coms to take advantage of it.

or1pkt said:

I couldn't agree more with you! No wonder pool is in such a horrible state over all.
It still baffles me they let Danny in the booth and I know many will bash me but his time has been up for years as far as announcing. He just keeps getting worse!

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Love Danny, but.....

Danny: He's gonna bank it 9 rails, no, he shot it straight in

Danny: This guy is really tall, he should play basketball. Meanwhile his opponent is a foot taller lol.

There has Never been a set criterior of ''who's in the booth'' other Than Tommy during the Camel Pro events, he was GREAT. Professional.

Ya get what ya Play/Pay for.:thumbup:

It would take a minute to send someone to the players who are about to play on the stream to fill-out an index card.

And on that note, if there are two commentators , I'd really prefer one just do the play by play, then the other one can do the color . And that the color guy does not talk over the play by play man.

Nostroke said:

Are you kidding? This information is at least 30 years behind identifying which ball is which. Is there a single commentator who can ID all the 3,4,5,6,7,10,11,12,13,14 n 15 numbered balls from ANY set from the booth? Not to my knowledge!

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This one is not as easy as you think. First of all the coms usually are not sitting in the best seat to see the table directly and have to rely on monitors in the booth, and they are not that big. You can forget about it when the overhead camera is on. This is a one dimensional view of the table from a distance above and it's even more difficult to distinguish the balls from up there. Then there are the new balls being used in many tournaments with new colors that can be hard to differentiate.

The cure for all this is the great cameras we are using today. I don't know how many times I've tried to explain "the rhythm" of a 9-Ball match to a director. There is the preparation for a shot, then there is the shot, then there is a lag time while the player prepares for the next shot. During this lag time, the director (and the camera operators) has the opportunity to close (zoom in) on the balls, particularly the ones he will be shooting at next and any other trouble balls. This lets the viewer (and the coms) know where the balls are and what to look for next. When the camera closes in, you can see each ball clearly. Not many directors know how or when to do this, perhaps because they are not pool players and don't see the ebb and flow of the match the way we do.

In my perfect world, I would be directing the cameramen and telling them what to focus on and when to zoom in for a closer look. Believe me, that's how it works in any televised production, the director calls the camera shots and is talking to each cameraman.

jay helfert said:

This one is not as easy as you think. First of all the coms usually are not sitting in the best seat to see the table directly and have to rely on monitors in the booth, and they are not that big. You can forget about it when the overhead camera is on. This is a one dimensional view of the table from a distance above and it's even more difficult to distinguish the balls from up there. Then there are the new balls being used in many tournaments with new colors that can be hard to differentiate.

The cure for all this is the great cameras we are using today. I don't know how many times I've tried to explain "the rhythm" of a 9-Ball match to a director. There is the preparation for a shot, then there is the shot, then there is a lag time while the player prepares for the next shot. During this lag time, the director (and the camera operators) has the opportunity to close (zoom in) on the balls, particularly the ones he will be shooting at next and any other trouble balls. This lets the viewer know where the balls are (and the coms) and what to look for next. When the camera closes, you can see each ball clearly. Not many directors know how or when to do this, perhaps because they are not pool players and don't see the ebb and flow of the match the way we do.

In my perfect world, I would be directing the cameramen and telling them what to focus on and when to zoom in for a closer look. Believe me, that's how it works in any televised production, the director calls the camera shots and is talking to each cameraman.

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Or they could just place 4 overhead UHD cams for the commentators .

JoeyInCali said:

Or they could just place 4 overhead UHD cams for the commentators .

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There's nothing wrong with the camera set ups they use now, if they were used for maximum efficiency, as stated in my post.

Denis The Kid said:

good point about the players info on index cards for commentators. Pat will surely pay attention to this comment as it is a good one. I would bet that happens next year.

It is a great tournament and I want to acknowledge all the things he has done right. Great commentating, great play, great sponsorship!!!!

Click to expand...

Is there anything to lead you to believe here on AZB that Pat will read and respond to a comment on here?