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CptBurbagio
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06-16-2019, 10:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DecentShot View Post
They have competed against "each other" in international team competitions, yes?

My guess is ...if you took the top 3 PI's vs the top 3 Taiwanese. Taiwan would have an edge. But make it a 10 best vs 10 best, PI would handily win.
Here's how the hypothetical 10 v 10 would look according to Fargo:

Team Philippines
1. Dennis Orcollo 815
2. Carlo Biado 811
3. Lee Van Corteza 809
4. James Aranas 803
5. Jeffrey Ignacio 798
6. Jeffrey De Luna 796
7. Roland Garcia 796
8. Johann Chua 794
9. Anton Raga 794
10. Jerico Banares 793

Avg Fargo = 801.4

vs

Team Taiwan
1. Chang Jun Lin 817
2. Ko Pin Yi 815
3. Chang Yu Lung 807
4. Hsu Kai Lun 805
5. Ko Ping Chung 804
6. Cheng Yu Hsuan ("Kevin") 802
7. Fu Che Wei 796
8. Wu Kun Lin 796
9. Lo Li Wen 791
10. Yang Ching Shun 781

Avg Fargo = 800.9

So, essentially a dead heat through ten. Taiwan may have a slightly higher top end, but my hunch is that if I continued this exercise through a top 20, the Philippines would have a much stronger back end. To wit, Warren Kiamco, Jundel Mazon, Francisco Bustamante, and Roberto Gomez occupy Team PHI numbers 11-14, and each enjoys a higher Fargo than number ten on Team TWN, the legend Yang Ching Shun. I suspect this trend would continue as you moved deeper into each nation's pool ranks.

I believe there was a "King's Cup" or similar hosted between the two a few years ago. I seem to remember Efren and Busty and a couple young guns on Team PHI against the Ko's and others on Team TWN. I believe Team PHI won, but my memory of all the details of this tourney are shaky at the moment. In any case, I would love to see that tournament continued and formalized Mosconi cup style.

Last edited by CptBurbagio; 06-16-2019 at 10:49 AM.
  
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DecentShot
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06-16-2019, 11:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CptBurbagio View Post
Here's how the hypothetical 10 v 10 would look according to Fargo:

Team Philippines
1. Dennis Orcollo 815
2. Carlo Biado 811
3. Lee Van Corteza 809
4. James Aranas 803
5. Jeffrey Ignacio 798
6. Jeffrey De Luna 796
7. Roland Garcia 796
8. Johann Chua 794
9. Anton Raga 794
10. Jerico Banares 793

Avg Fargo = 801.4

vs

Team Taiwan
1. Chang Jun Lin 817
2. Ko Pin Yi 815
3. Chang Yu Lung 807
4. Hsu Kai Lun 805
5. Ko Ping Chung 804
6. Cheng Yu Hsuan ("Kevin") 802
7. Fu Che Wei 796
8. Wu Kun Lin 796
9. Lo Li Wen 791
10. Yang Ching Shun 781

Avg Fargo = 800.9

So, essentially a dead heat through ten. Taiwan may have a slightly higher top end, but my hunch is that if I continued this exercise through a top 20, the Philippines would have a much stronger back end. To wit, Warren Kiamco, Jundel Mazon, Francisco Bustamante, and Roberto Gomez occupy Team PHI numbers 11-14, and each enjoys a higher Fargo than number ten on Team TWN, the legend Yang Ching Shun. I suspect this trend would continue as you moved deeper into each nation's pool ranks.

I believe there was a "King's Cup" or similar hosted between the two a few years ago. I seem to remember Efren and Busty and a couple young guns on Team PHI against the Ko's and others on Team TWN. I believe Team PHI won, but my memory of all the details of this tourney are shaky at the moment. In any case, I would love to see that tournament continued and formalized Mosconi cup style.
Awesome, it would have to go 20 deep. Sick that LVC is outside the top 10.
  
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06-16-2019, 11:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by decentshot View Post
... Sick that lvc is outside the top 10.
lvc ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Quote:
Originally Posted by cptburbagio View Post
... 3. Lee van corteza 809 ...
  
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06-16-2019, 12:18 PM

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Originally Posted by AtLarge View Post
lvc ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Sometimes everyday I do drugs.
  
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06-16-2019, 05:21 PM

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Originally Posted by DecentShot View Post
Sometimes everyday I do drugs.
LOl!!! I was one of many who was wondering where you were going with this!

Freddie <~~~ would join you


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06-16-2019, 05:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CptBurbagio View Post
Here's how the hypothetical 10 v 10 would look according to Fargo:

Team Philippines
1. Dennis Orcollo 815
2. Carlo Biado 811
3. Lee Van Corteza 809
4. James Aranas 803
5. Jeffrey Ignacio 798
6. Jeffrey De Luna 796
7. Roland Garcia 796
8. Johann Chua 794
9. Anton Raga 794
10. Jerico Banares 793

Avg Fargo = 801.4

vs

Team Taiwan
1. Chang Jun Lin 817
2. Ko Pin Yi 815
3. Chang Yu Lung 807
4. Hsu Kai Lun 805
5. Ko Ping Chung 804
6. Cheng Yu Hsuan ("Kevin") 802
7. Fu Che Wei 796
8. Wu Kun Lin 796
9. Lo Li Wen 791
10. Yang Ching Shun 781

Avg Fargo = 800.9

So, essentially a dead heat through ten. .
I think if you include all games including one pocket and Banks, TPE still have a way to go. Iím sure theyíll get there.

Freddie


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06-16-2019, 06:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cornerman View Post
I think if you include all games including one pocket and Banks, TPE still have a way to go. Iím sure theyíll get there.

Freddie
If you include Chinese 8 ball which many of the best are playing I'd say not so much


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Masayoshi
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06-17-2019, 03:13 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by one stroke View Post
If you include Chinese 8 ball which many of the best are playing I'd say not so much


1
14.1 and 235 carom are also popular in Taiwan. Not so much in the Phillipines.
  
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06-17-2019, 03:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masayoshi View Post
14.1 and 235 carom are also popular in Taiwan. Not so much in the Phillipines.
If we take a look at the list of the top 10 in Taiwan, do they have recognized accomplishments in 14.1, caroms, and Chinese 8-ball?


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06-17-2019, 03:34 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gxman View Post
I like that there are so many good Phillipines 1p players.
Have to disagree here, there are not "many" good 1p players in the Phillipines. The best rotation players have learned one pocket now the last couple of years, since thats where the money is. Just 3-4 years ago, it was only Efren and Django who really knew the game (and Alex if you count him as filipino)

Gambling wise, the filipinos never used to play 1p against eachother, only if they were forced to in order to win money from a foreign fish
  
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Eric.
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06-17-2019, 07:50 AM

Just to add - The Phillipines has a population of about 104mm. Taiwan has a population around 23mm.


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06-17-2019, 03:31 PM

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Originally Posted by Cornerman View Post
This is so funny because itís not really true. I was in the front row of the DCC and was sitting next to a guy who would never been to one of these tournaments. And heís from the Internet (last name is Manning). We are watching Jung Lin Chan play, and at one point the guy I am sitting with gasps.Literally gasped. I asked whatís up, I he said he canít believe how much English this guy plays with even on what looks to be a simple shots . The gasp came on an extremely low left english to the edge of the cue ball, and the cueball was not going to a cushion. And this is Chang!, A player that everybody seems to believe has the best patterns because of his simplicity. And yet in the front row, you could see just how much English he actually uses. Thatís the reality. I know everyone thinks he stays near the center. But heís off-center over 60% of the shots, just like every other professional. And he goes to the ďgobs of english ď well, just like every pro.

I think the Taiwanese stroke mechanics contuse people to make them believe they stay near the center. I read people say the same about Buddy Hall, but Buddy was the guy ai point to that used the most english Iíd ever seen in my life at that point. Watching in person and with intent on their english use proves this over and over.


Freddie <~~~ in praise of reality
Yup. It's true the Taiwanese often play simpler patters, but they often MAKE them simple with loads of english. Wu is another one who spins the cueball like crazy to manufacture angles.

That said, I kinda agree that the top Taiwanese might be a hair above the top Philipinos. Not by much though. Would make an awesome Mosconi style match up. Who would like to see say Dennis, Carlo, James Aranas, Jeffrey DeLuna, and maybe Lee Van vs Chang Jung Lin, Wu, Hsu Kai Lun, Ko Pin Yi, and maybe Chang Yu Lung. That would be amazing.

KMRUNOUT
  
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06-18-2019, 01:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMRUNOUT View Post
Yup. It's true the Taiwanese often play simpler patters, but they often MAKE them simple with loads of english. Wu is another one who spins the cueball like crazy to manufacture angles.

That said, I kinda agree that the top Taiwanese might be a hair above the top Philipinos. Not by much though. Would make an awesome Mosconi style match up. Who would like to see say Dennis, Carlo, James Aranas, Jeffrey DeLuna, and maybe Lee Van vs Chang Jung Lin, Wu, Hsu Kai Lun, Ko Pin Yi, and maybe Chang Yu Lung. That would be amazing.

KMRUNOUT
it happened within the last 6 months to a year.
  
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06-18-2019, 01:56 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilosopherKing View Post
it happened within the last 6 months to a year.

I bet those were some good matches. What was the outcome, team vs team?


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06-18-2019, 07:25 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 9 Ball Fan View Post
Is Taiwan on the same level, talent-wise?
The short answer - Yes! If their top players came over here and competed in our tournaments like so many Pinoys do, they would upset the apple cart so to speak. It would no longer be the same Filipino domination as we see now. It would be be Philippine-Taiwan domination and all the U.S. players would be left behind, except for Shane of course. Shane already has his hands full dealing with all the great Pinoy players who come here on a regular basis. They are his chief rivals. The above statements do not hold true for One Pocket events, which is the last domain of American pool players. Even here, the Pinoys pick up this game quickly and players like Alex and Dennis are threats in any One Pocket event they compete in, just like Efren and Bustie before them (who still play at a high level). The creativity of One Pocket is a good complement for the Pinoys who grew up playing Rotation. The Taiwanese players have not caught onto One Pocket yet for some reason and that's telling to me.


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