If he doesn't bust a seam first.
Frozen to the Cushion or not?
- Thread starter ChrisinNC
- Start date
If he doesn't bust a seam first.
Unless this is the key game to win the set, tournament, or the money, I'm not going to lose much sleep over it, no matter which way it is ruled.
For me, I'd say it ISN'T frozen if the ball ISN'T actually touching the rail
Touching just the fibers protruding from the rail doesn't seem like it could be called frozen, because the ball can be MOVED without it actually being rebounded from or touched by the rail in the course of the shot.
There is no way to shoot a ball away from being frozen on the rail without it touching the rail, no matter what the angle is that you shoot it from.
If the ball is ONLY touched by the fibers, you could put the cue ball on the rail near the object ball and shoot it AWAY from the rail, without it ever going down the rail or rebounding from the rail.
For me, I'd say it ISN'T frozen if the ball ISN'T actually touching the rail
Touching just the fibers protruding from the rail doesn't seem like it could be called frozen, because the ball can be MOVED without it actually being rebounded from or touched by the rail in the course of the shot.
There is no way to shoot a ball away from being frozen on the rail without it touching the rail, no matter what the angle is that you shoot it from.
If the ball is ONLY touched by the fibers, you could put the cue ball on the rail near the object ball and shoot it AWAY from the rail, without it ever going down the rail or rebounding from the rail.
I would generally agree, and I suspect that many rule sets would as well. But, for CSI/BCA, I would have to disagree, but only because the rules define it as such. Quoted below.
"Frozen Ball A ball that is touching another ball or a cushion. If loose strands or fibers of cloth extend from a cushion and contact a ball, that does not constitute that ball being frozen to the cushion."
https://www.playcsipool.com/bcapl-rules.html page 15.
[edit: wasn't there an old Earl comment that the ball was touching, but not frozen?]
That quote was attributed to Jonathan archer a few posts ago...so some good player must’ve said it.
It's a trick question. We all know that physics tells us that no two objects ever actually touch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE8rkG9Dw4s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE8rkG9Dw4s
I think that was about the rack not being on the rail. He said the balls could be touching in the rack but not be frozen or tight, something like that.
This is the correct way to call a frozen ball. If you can see light between the ball and the cushion it's not frozen. Sometimes you have put your hand over the ball to block the overhead light to see it better. I always put on my reading glasses on as well.
This is my favorite explanation! I remember Tigerland at Ft. Polk when they put you though the machine gun test. You had to crawl through mud for about twenty five or thirty yards, down on your belly with your rifle cradled in front of you. Meanwhile .30 caliber bullets were flying a couple of feet over your head! That was a "live fire" exercise! I only heard of one guy who panicked and got shot.
I'll never forget the sound of those bullets flying over, like a pack of mad wasps. They made a loud whistle as they went by. Yes I was scared, but I ate mud and liked it! Most of those guys went to Nam two weeks later but I was one of the lucky ones who stayed stateside.
It’s Repulsive
Soooo......every time I thought I made a good hit...it was actually a foul....
That's right, you've actually never made a good hit. Of course, neither have any of your opponents. It turns out the game of pool is just an endless series of fouls.
Actually, physics and especially quantum mechanics tells us that objects extend into each other and have no precisely defined hard surface. Everything is fuzzy.
But why do we still have this horrible frozen/not frozen/maybe frozen ball rule? I think it's time to do away with it. What would be lost if contacting a frozen ball was considered a good rail contact? I see no value in the rule.
Sorry, I'm a little fuzzy on quantum mechanics. That's probably for the best.
If you weren't fuzzy, you wouldn't be real. Or maybe nothing is real. Or maybe everything is real.
To keep people from nudging the cue ball up on the object ball on the rail and then saying they "hit a rail", when the ONLY ball that touched a rail was the ball ALREADY on the rail.
The alternative is to say that the object ball AND the cue ball must touch a rail on every shot.
Correct. Without the rule (you must get a rail after contact) two players could play endless safeties off a ball against the rail.
The stalemate rule, which every pool game now has, avoids this problem.
At WHAT point is the rule in place?
After the 2nd nudge or the 32nd nudge?
Don't need to make the game more complicated.