Break cue as primary playing cue?

Push&Pool

Professional Banger
Silver Member
This is something I've been wondering about for a time. I've decided to get myself a new cue and give the old one to a friend. So naturally, I've spent a lot of time browsing hundreds of different models. I've already settled on a particularly beautiful specimen I'll soon get my hands on. It's a regular cue, not a break cue, but since I noticed a number of well-designed and quite affordable break cues while searching, it crossed my mind to give one of those a try as well. Definitely not soon, as I'm planning to stick to the cue I'm about to get for a long time. But one day, when I'm ready for a new investment, I'll want to know the following: Can a break cue be efficiently used for every single shot? Has anyone tried it? Since I like to shoot hard at least once or twice per game outside of breaking, would I actually profit from doing so using a break cue?
 

mark187

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well, break cue's going to have a rock hard tip, so you'd have to take that off for a start. Then, you don't really have a break cue anymore, just a heavy stiff cue. Don't really see the point.
 

Johnny Rosato

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Get an Andy Gilbert Jump/Break cue. It will be the only cue you need. Lepro or Triangle tip, maybe even a harder Water Buffalo.
I use Lepro's, Triangles and Milkduds, (Dawgduds), and I break with any of my cues, even my Ivory jointed & ferruled Rick Howard.
 

aaronataylor

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I predict the responses to this thread will make me laugh at least a few times. I’m running to the store for some popcorn! :D
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
OP:

In short, yes, you "can" play with a break cue. Heck, you can use a jump cue as player if you want but, i would advise against it.

Now, here is what i would do:

Buy "whatever cue" you like as a "playing cue"......then, put a slightly harder tip than hou normally use and your off to the races.
 

9 Ball Fan

Darth Maximus
Silver Member
You can buy a new break cue that doesn't have a phenolic tip.

Just make sure you buy one with a leather tip to start with.

If it's marketed as a break cue, give it a try.
 

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Gold Member
Silver Member
This is something I've been wondering about for a time. I've decided to get myself a new cue and give the old one to a friend. So naturally, I've spent a lot of time browsing hundreds of different models. I've already settled on a particularly beautiful specimen I'll soon get my hands on. It's a regular cue, not a break cue, but since I noticed a number of well-designed and quite affordable break cues while searching, it crossed my mind to give one of those a try as well. Definitely not soon, as I'm planning to stick to the cue I'm about to get for a long time. But one day, when I'm ready for a new investment, I'll want to know the following: Can a break cue be efficiently used for every single shot? Has anyone tried it? Since I like to shoot hard at least once or twice per game outside of breaking, would I actually profit from doing so using a break cue?

When Predator came out with their BK break cue ~15 or so years ago, I picked one up. I got coaxed into playing a pretty decent pool tournament (9’ tables with tight pocket), and I easily won the tournament using only the BK. I posted the story way back.

I saw a lot of players doing the same thing at SBE on bar tables.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I break with ALL my playing cues...production and custom.

Who needs a break cue?

Some do, zome don't.

I know several people that play with ext3soft tips that mushroom etc...etc when they shoot even firm shots.

If they break with them, it literally destroys their game due to them spending all thsir time "reshaping" the tip, which leads to replacing the tip more often.

Thise players are better off having a break cue.

If your tip will hold up to breaking, your correct. If it won't, well, read above.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When Predator came out with their BK break cue ~15 or so years ago, I picked one up. I got coaxed into playing a pretty decent pool tournament (9’ tables with tight pocket), and I easily won the tournament using only the BK. I posted the story way back.

I saw a lot of players doing the same thing at SBE on bar tables.

Hey Freddie, i know at least two people that use their BK Rush as a playing cue.

I tried it but, i just couldn't get there with it.

Have you experimented with different tips on your Rush?
 

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Gold Member
Silver Member
Hey Freddie, i know at least two people that use their BK Rush as a playing cue.

I tried it but, i just couldn't get there with it.

Have you experimented with different tips on your Rush?

Just to be clear, I was talking about the original Predator BK cue back in 2004, not the BK Rush. In either case, I didn’t change the tip.

This was the post from 4/4/2004. The funny string of symbols was for the Wei Table.

———————————-
Ater hearing much raving about the Predator BK at its first arrival
at the Derby City Classic a couple of years ago, I had wanted to get
one to see if there was any hope whatsoever in helping my pathetic
break.
My break is similar to others who have reported here of of accidental
unwanted spin left on the cueball. On firmer shots, my tip tends to
arc right to left. Depending on the time of day and how much breaking
I've done, it gets better (or I time the arc better). That is, I'm
usually breaking better at the end of the tournament. Someone please
give me a good way to harness the end of the tournament results and
put it at the beginning.

Anyway, on to the Predator BK. Did it make my break into something on
the order of a professional? Not even close. My break was as weak as
ever. However, what I got out of the Predator BK was consistency. I am
always hitting to the right of the head ball a little, with a lot of
right-hand spin leftover. Normally, with my other cues, I'll have a
little right-hand, but because of squirt, I hit the left side of the
head ball or the right side of the head ball depending on where I
broke from. So with the BK, the adjustment was one way. And, the
adjustment was consistent. I'll have to keep working on this, but
since the adjustment makes some sort of sense, I've got a starting
point. Maybe I need to get the StrokeTrainer to get the stroke
straight. Of course, I'll break my fingers trying to get me break
stroke straight hitting that aluminum plate.

But on to what the stick did not intend. The BK has a 314 shaft on it.
I've shot with these shafts before, but only onesie twosie shot. And
the test shots were always with english. Afterall, isn't that what the
Predator is geared towards? Well, because I was lazy, after breaking
the balls, I'd shoot them in with the Predator. Is there a difference?
And what is the difference? For putzes like me who can't hit the ball
in the center (how I've gotten this far with my game, I'll never
know), certain shots are always a lower percentage. Particularly, firm
center shots like these:

Power draw:

START(
%A_8X1%PN6U7%Up8Z2%V`6X2%W]8W9%XP8V2%YE2U4%Z^1W9%[X8M5%\E1U2
%eB5b2
)END

and jacked up stop shot:

START(
%AX5P1%BY7U5%PD7W8%Ur4C9%VY6O4%[V7P8%\E9W2%eB5b2

)END

I'm normally 50% on making these shots, but to my amazement, I was
hitting these in the heart. It should be no surprise that I normally
miss these given my break shot problems.

Now, say what you will about new cue syndrome. This isn't it. This
stick sounds and feels awful when I hit normal shots. It's entirely
too butt heavy for regular shooting. The butt is too thin for my
taste. The wrap is so tight, it feels fake. But I can't deny that the
strength in it so far is not on the english shots, but the centerball
shots, for those of us who simply can't hit the center of the cueball.
For those of you who can hit the center, it might not be a noticeable
difference.

How will it work under the gun? I decided to play in a tournament last
night at a pool hall that I've never done well. The tables are tight
"don't even think about touching the cushion" Olhausens with
too-much-bounce cushions. The winner of these tournaments is always
the best shotmaker. Tactics and runout pattern skills are diminished
because the tables just take away so many shots. That's why I normally
don't play because all of my skill if I have any is focused on runout
patterns in 8-ball.

Last night's results: no contest. I blew away the
field, made up mostly of SL-6's and SL-7's. The Schuler never got out
of the bag. It was all Predator BK. I'm not saying I made every shot,
but the tight tables had less effect on me than anyone else there by
far. It was almost like playing on normal tables. It was almost
surreal. I'm simply not that good of a shotmaker, though I'm certainly
far from bad.

Where doesn't the shaft work? Well, so far, the subtle soft and/or
long english shots I'm a little lost. Not too lost. Lost in that I
have to fight my natural tendency to adjust for squirt, and often it's
an afterthought. I almost scratch a couple times on this:

START(
%A\3F5%BD7N2%P]8O1%U\8H9%V]4M9%[P1Y7%\]3D1%eA7a2%_]0D5%`\9F2
%a\7G7
)END

The subtle inside-english follow. I hit too full in the face, catching
the point (or worse). If I were to continue with these shafts, it
would be quite a commitment.

—————————————-

The follow up was that I had a 314 fit for my Schuler, and I used it for 18 months before returning to normal squirt. I won many tournaments but never could get that natural feel (see last paragraph). I already had a working system for inside and outside english, and that method was too ingrained at that point. Going back to regular squirt was like coming home.

Freddie <~~~ have squirt, will travel
 

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Some do, zome don't.

I know several people that play with ext3soft tips that mushroom etc...etc when they shoot even firm shots.

If they break with them, it literally destroys their game due to them spending all thsir time "reshaping" the tip, which leads to replacing the tip more often.

Thise players are better off having a break cue.

If your tip will hold up to breaking, your correct. If it won't, well, read above.

I use Ultra-skin soft tips on all my cues and none of them have mushroomed and I've broken hundreds and hundreds of times with them.
 

Chili Palmer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have a guy on my team who has two shafts, one with a phenolic tip and one without. He breaks then swaps shafts. Not really sure if that's breaking with a playing cue or playing with a break cue - but it's an option.

I would not play with a dedicated break cue as it would have a phenolic tip, which is no fun to play with - UNLESS you're working on hitting the CB center ball every time.

I did; however, play for over 20 years with the same stick - break and play.
 

Chili Palmer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I break with ALL my playing cues...production and custom.

Who needs a break cue?

What tips do you use and do you have to deal with mushroomed tip?

When I ride to pool I bring a 1x1 case with my Ned Morris cue that has a Kamui black medium, no issues with mushrooming yet but just curious what you're using.
 

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
What tips do you use and do you have to deal with mushroomed tip?

When I ride to pool I bring a 1x1 case with my Ned Morris cue that has a Kamui black medium, no issues with mushrooming yet but just curious what you're using.

See Post #13.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Just to be clear, I was talking about the original Predator BK cue back in 2004, not the BK Rush. In either case, I didn’t change the tip.

This was the post from 4/4/2004. The funny string of symbols was for the Wei Table.

———————————-
Ater hearing much raving about the Predator BK at its first arrival
at the Derby City Classic a couple of years ago, I had wanted to get
one to see if there was any hope whatsoever in helping my pathetic
break.
My break is similar to others who have reported here of of accidental
unwanted spin left on the cueball. On firmer shots, my tip tends to
arc right to left. Depending on the time of day and how much breaking
I've done, it gets better (or I time the arc better). That is, I'm
usually breaking better at the end of the tournament. Someone please
give me a good way to harness the end of the tournament results and
put it at the beginning.

Anyway, on to the Predator BK. Did it make my break into something on
the order of a professional? Not even close. My break was as weak as
ever. However, what I got out of the Predator BK was consistency. I am
always hitting to the right of the head ball a little, with a lot of
right-hand spin leftover. Normally, with my other cues, I'll have a
little right-hand, but because of squirt, I hit the left side of the
head ball or the right side of the head ball depending on where I
broke from. So with the BK, the adjustment was one way. And, the
adjustment was consistent. I'll have to keep working on this, but
since the adjustment makes some sort of sense, I've got a starting
point. Maybe I need to get the StrokeTrainer to get the stroke
straight. Of course, I'll break my fingers trying to get me break
stroke straight hitting that aluminum plate.

But on to what the stick did not intend. The BK has a 314 shaft on it.
I've shot with these shafts before, but only onesie twosie shot. And
the test shots were always with english. Afterall, isn't that what the
Predator is geared towards? Well, because I was lazy, after breaking
the balls, I'd shoot them in with the Predator. Is there a difference?
And what is the difference? For putzes like me who can't hit the ball
in the center (how I've gotten this far with my game, I'll never
know), certain shots are always a lower percentage. Particularly, firm
center shots like these:

Power draw:

START(
%A_8X1%PN6U7%Up8Z2%V`6X2%W]8W9%XP8V2%YE2U4%Z^1W9%[X8M5%\E1U2
%eB5b2
)END

and jacked up stop shot:

START(
%AX5P1%BY7U5%PD7W8%Ur4C9%VY6O4%[V7P8%\E9W2%eB5b2

)END

I'm normally 50% on making these shots, but to my amazement, I was
hitting these in the heart. It should be no surprise that I normally
miss these given my break shot problems.

Now, say what you will about new cue syndrome. This isn't it. This
stick sounds and feels awful when I hit normal shots. It's entirely
too butt heavy for regular shooting. The butt is too thin for my
taste. The wrap is so tight, it feels fake. But I can't deny that the
strength in it so far is not on the english shots, but the centerball
shots, for those of us who simply can't hit the center of the cueball.
For those of you who can hit the center, it might not be a noticeable
difference.

How will it work under the gun? I decided to play in a tournament last
night at a pool hall that I've never done well. The tables are tight
"don't even think about touching the cushion" Olhausens with
too-much-bounce cushions. The winner of these tournaments is always
the best shotmaker. Tactics and runout pattern skills are diminished
because the tables just take away so many shots. That's why I normally
don't play because all of my skill if I have any is focused on runout
patterns in 8-ball.

Last night's results: no contest. I blew away the
field, made up mostly of SL-6's and SL-7's. The Schuler never got out
of the bag. It was all Predator BK. I'm not saying I made every shot,
but the tight tables had less effect on me than anyone else there by
far. It was almost like playing on normal tables. It was almost
surreal. I'm simply not that good of a shotmaker, though I'm certainly
far from bad.

Where doesn't the shaft work? Well, so far, the subtle soft and/or
long english shots I'm a little lost. Not too lost. Lost in that I
have to fight my natural tendency to adjust for squirt, and often it's
an afterthought. I almost scratch a couple times on this:

START(
%A\3F5%BD7N2%P]8O1%U\8H9%V]4M9%[P1Y7%\]3D1%eA7a2%_]0D5%`\9F2
%a\7G7
)END

The subtle inside-english follow. I hit too full in the face, catching
the point (or worse). If I were to continue with these shafts, it
would be quite a commitment.

—————————————-

The follow up was that I had a 314 fit for my Schuler, and I used it for 18 months before returning to normal squirt. I won many tournaments but never could get that natural feel (see last paragraph). I already had a working system for inside and outside english, and that method was too ingrained at that point. Going back to regular squirt was like coming home.

Freddie <~~~ have squirt, will travel

I was asking about the newer BK Rush in the other post.

Having said that, i found your answer very informative.

Thanks for taking the time,

Jeff
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I use Ultra-skin soft tips on all my cues and none of them have mushroomed and I've broken hundreds and hundreds of times with them.

Hmmm, ive tried 5hise but they always mushroomed on me if i broke with them when using a wooden rack.

Do you always use a template or are you one of the lucky players that break well without breaking hard?

My 10 ball break averages between 22 mph to 26 mph.

Anywhere close to 22ish and the softs fail in my experience.

I have a friend that has a extremely slow (17 mph) 10 ball break but, he usually makes at least one ball, sometimes two...

If i back my speed down, lol...i dont get there.
 
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