Table Difficulty Factor (TDF) for measuring table "toughness"

Sloppy Pockets said:

Dave, there is an error in your "Pocket Angle" table. The range of angles that corresponds to a mouth-throat difference of >7/8" and ≤ 1" is listed in the table as creating facing angles that are >142.6º and ≤145.3º. The actual range should be >142.6º and ≤143.5º.

Click to expand...

Thank you for spotting the error. It's fixed now.

Sloppy Pockets said:

Also, for the record, my table is listed as a "League" table. It is, in fact, a factory-spec A.E. Schmidt table that I bought used from (and had reconditioned by) a certified Schmidt dealer nearby. I personally don't care how it is listed, but I thought you might want to change that so anybody interested in A.E. Schmidt tables might know how they play before ordering one.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. I've update your table info. Here's the latest updated list:


Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- TSF -- PSF -- PAF -- PLF -- TDF
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 ("money table" Diamond at Pool Sharks in Vegas)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.00 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.98 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (typical Brunswick Gold Crown)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (typical Valley/Dynamo "bar box")

dr_dave said:

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- TSF -- PSF -- PAF -- PLF -- TDF
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 ("money table" Diamond at Pool Sharks in Vegas)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.00 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.98 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (typical Brunswick Gold Crown)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (typical Valley/Dynamo "bar box")

Click to expand...

The best way to test these TDF numbers would be to compare results from actual play on different tables. The BU Exams would be an efficient and fun way to do this. Is anybody out there willing to try the BU Exams on the different tables reported? It would be interesting to see how the BU scores would vary based on the reported table difficulty factors. If you do run through the BU exams on different tables, please post your results both here and on the BU thread.

Thanks,
Dave

dr_dave said:

Click to expand...

FYI, if anybody is curious how to relate facing angles to mouth-throat differences and cushion width, the math and examples can be found here:

TP B.15 - Pocket geometry calculations

Warning, if you don't like geometry and math, you probably won't want to click on this link.

Regards,
Dave

Sloppy Pockets said:

That's pretty much exactly how I did it... except for I used this instead:


http://www.harborfreight.com/multipurpose-angle-finder-1028.html


After a previous poster mentioned this device, I dropped by the local HF store and picked one up for $3.49. Works like a charm and it is very accurate. I can already see many other uses for it around the shop.

Using this little contraption, it is not necessary to do all those difficult measurements of the pocket throat and mouth. For the purposes here, a good eyeballing of the mouth opening using a ruler is close enough. It's when you are trying to measure the difference between the two to get the facing angle that you run into trouble.

Since most folks lack the proper photographic equipment to take undistorted photos of their pockets, the AutoCAD measuring method is problematic and will likely lead to inaccuracies. If you are really curious about your table (and especially if you want to measure several other tables), order one of these and you can save yourself a lot of frustration.

Click to expand...

I agree with you 100% that a direct angle measurement of the pocket facing is the way to go. That's why I did the math to figure out how everything is related, so I could list both sets of values (2"-back-mouth-throat-difference and facing angles) on the PAF table.

Catch you later,
Dave

PS: Thanks for pushing the angle-measurement thing. Hopefully, you've convinced the people who want to be more accurate to purchase an angle finder or protractor. BTW, I agree with you about the photo/Autocad approach being problematic.

The latest data is below. If you have access to any tables not on this list, please take the measurements and report them here so we can expand the list to include as many different table brands and models as possible.

Thanks,
Dave

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- table_size:TSF -- pocket_mouth_sizeSF -- mouth-throat_differenceAF -- shelf_depthLF -- TDF
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 ("money table" Diamond at Pool Sharks in Vegas)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.00 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.98 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (typical Brunswick Gold Crown)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (typical Valley/Dynamo "bar box")

Bob Dixon said:

I also suggest that the description of the table I reported have my name removed since it isn't my table. Suggestion 'Pool Sharks, Las Vegas-money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified'.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. I prefer including the user names so we will know where the data came from. However, it would be nice if the table descriptions were as complete as yours. Thank you for setting a good example for others.

Here's the latest updated list:

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- table_size:TSF -- pocket_mouth_sizeSF -- mouth-throat_differenceAF -- shelf_depthLF -- TDF (table description)
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 (Pool Sharks, Las Vegas, money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II at MatchUps, Fort Collins)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.00 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.98 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (Brunswick Gold Crown home table)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly home table)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley/Dynamo "bar box" at West End, Fort Collins)

Bob Dixon said:

dr_dave said:

Neil,

Based on the info you've provided recently, I've updated your table data to:

Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")

Do you think the 1.08 TDF is appropriate? That seems a bit high to me for a 7' table, even a tough 7' table, but what do you think?

Maybe if other people take their measurements more carefully, the TDF for their table would increase also.

Thanks,
Dave

Click to expand...

That TDF on Neil's table sounds a lot more accurate than the 90 something it was before. Even though it's a seven footer I knew a factor in the 90's wasn't realistic with those pockets.

I'm going to get one of those angles and remeasure all four corner pockets on the one I reported.

Click to expand...

I'm glad the number seems more reasonable now. This example shows how important it is to take accurate measurements. As others have suggested, maybe more people should use an angle-measuring device instead of the throat measurement to get a more accurate pocket angle factor (PAF).

Regards,
Dave

Bob Dixon said:

Is anyone going to measure table one at Hard Times in Bellflower, CA? That's reported to be the toughest one there.

Click to expand...

I was hoping to see this also. Maybe the person who offered to do this will post the measurements soon.

Thank you for reminding him,
Dave

oldschool1478 said:

Due to revised chart (as I understand it) using pocket angle of 141 deg.I have revised my table to:
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.02 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.02 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)

Click to expand...

Thanks for the update. Here's the latest list:

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- table_size:TSF -- pocket_mouth_sizeSF -- mouth-throat_differenceAF -- shelf_depthLF -- TDF (table description)
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 (Pool Sharks, Las Vegas, money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II at MatchUps, Fort Collins)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 141 deg:1.02 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.02 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.98 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (Brunswick Gold Crown home table)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly home table)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley/Dynamo "bar box" at West End, Fort Collins)

JC said:

My pocket angle is 143 degrees. Always has been. This changes the PAF from 1.0 to 1.08 according to the new table. Not even close to the jaw/throat comparison measure table which was and continues to be like the ten blind men and the elephant.

That changes my table to a 1.06 over all which is more accurate. I've played on enough tables to know mine is not slightly easier than average as the other table suggested at .98

Click to expand...

Thank you for the update. I'm glad the TDF of 1.06 is more in line with what you expected. This is yet another example where if the throat measurement isn't taken carefully as described, the pocket angle factor (PAF) will be way off.

When I take the measurements on my table, the 2"-back-mouth-throat difference and the direct angle measurement both agree (giving the same PAF), as should be the case.

Here's the latest:

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- table_size:TSF -- pocket_mouth_sizeSF -- mouth-throat_differenceAF -- shelf_depthLF -- TDF (table description)
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 (Pool Sharks, Las Vegas, money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 143 deg:1.08 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II at MatchUps, Fort Collins)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 141 deg:1.02 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.02 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (Brunswick Gold Crown home table)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly home table)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley/Dynamo "bar box" at West End, Fort Collins)

mamics said:

Sloppy Pockets said:

http://www.harborfreight.com/multipurpose-angle-finder-1028.html

After a previous poster mentioned this device, I dropped by the local HF store and picked one up for $3.49. Works like a charm and it is very accurate.

Click to expand...

Nice - I just ordered myself one also. ;-p

Click to expand...

Let me know if your direct angle measurement gives a difference pocket angle factor (PAF) than your current mouth-throat difference so I can update your data.

Catch you later,
Dave

Bob Dixon said:

I asked a Bonus Ball player which of these two tables is the harder one to play on:

Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)

Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 (Pool Sharks, Las Vegas, money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified)

He said the Bonus Ball table was harder but only due to the table being fast. The balls just keep rolling. No mention of mouth size, angle, shelf, balls jawing more or less on one table or the other, etc.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Cloth speed is definitely a factor in how a table plays. Depending on the player and the game being played, "very fast" can be quite difficult. The same can probably be said for "very slow."

Regards,
Dave

Here's the latest:

Measurements and data reported by AZB users for table difficulty factor (TDF), based on the table size factor (TSF), pocket size factor (PSF), pocket angle factor (PAF), and pocket shelf factor (PLF):

name -- table_size:TSF -- pocket_mouth_sizeSF -- mouth-throat_difference (or facing angle)AF -- shelf_depthLF -- TDF (table description)
dr_dave -- 10':1.10 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.33 (fictitious tough 10' table example)
MahnaMahna -- 10':1.10 -- 5 1/2":0.85 -- 2":1.15 -- 2 1/2": 1.15 -- 1.24 (snooker table poorly converted into a pool table)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 7/8":1.03 -- 1.24 (fictitious example "B")
Bonus Ball -- 9':1.00 -- 3 7/8":1.20 -- 1/8":0.97 -- 3/4":0.98 -- 1.14 (Bonus Ball table)
Bob Dixon -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.12 (Pool Sharks, Las Vegas, money table, Diamond Pro-Am, red logo, Ernesto Dominguez-modified)
Qaddiction -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.11 (Diamond)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 3/8":0.98 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.10 (mid to late 50's AMF Commercial Model similar to a Brunswick Anniversary/Sport King)
FatBoy -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 1":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gold Crown)
TATE -- 9':1.00 -- 4":1.15 -- 1/4":0.97 -- 7/8":0.98 -- 1.09 (Ernesto-Dominguez-modified Brunswick Gibson)
cigardave -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1":1.08 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.08 (typical Pro-Cut Diamond)
Neil -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/8":1.10 -- 1 1/4":1.17 -- 1 3/8":0.99 -- 1.08 (modified Valley "bar box")
JC -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 143 deg:1.08 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 ("Cobrasized" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
dr_dave -- 9':1.00 -- 5": 0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.06 (old Brunswick Gold Crown II at MatchUps, Fort Collins)
Sloppy Pockets -- 8'+:0.95 -- 5":0.95 -- 1 1/8":1.14 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 1.03 (A.E. Schmidt)
SloMoHolic -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 1.02 (2005 Diamond Pro with ProCut pockets and Red-label rails)
oldschool1478 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 141 deg:1.02 -- 1 3/4:1.00 -- 1.02 (updated Red Badge Diamond Pro)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 5":0.95 -- 15/16":1.08 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 1.01 (Gandy Big G)
dzcues -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 11/16":1.02 -- 1 15/16":1.03 -- 1.00 (typical League-Cut Diamond)
"standard" table -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/16":1.00 -- 9/16":1.00 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 1.00 (WPA spec "standard")
Kelly_Guy -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.98 (Antique Brunswick Jefferson, circa 1900)
BryanB -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.97 (1931 Brunswick with double shimmed pockets)
mamics -- 9':1.00 -- 4 11/16":0.98 -- 7/8":1.04 -- 1 3/16":0.95 -- 0.97 (no-name "Chinese Cheapie" with Uylin cushions)
12squared -- 9':1.00 -- 4 7/8":0.95 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.95 (Brunswick Gold Crown home table)
rexus31 -- 9':1.00 -- 4 1/16":1.05 -- 1/4":0.95 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.95 (rexus31's friend's Brunswick Gold Crown)
iusedtoberich -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 1":1.06 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.93 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown)
MSchaffer -- 9":1.00 -- 5 1/10":0.90 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 3/4":1.00 -- 0.92 (Brunswick Gold Crown II)
mfinkelstein3 -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 ("loose" Brunswick Gold Crown III)
Vahmurka -- 9':1.00 -- 5 1/8":0.90 -- 7/8":1.03 -- 1 1/2": 0.97 -- 0.90 (Brunswick Centurion)
SloMoHolic league table -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 5/8":1.00 -- 0.90 (old Brunswick Medalist)
BRussell -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 13/16":1.04 -- 1 1/2":0.98 -- 0.87 (Olhausen)
Dopc -- 8':0.90 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/4":0.95 -- 0.87 (Connelly Kayenta)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 5/8":1.00 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.86 (Connelly home table)
dr_dave -- 8':0.90 -- 5":0.95 -- 1/2":0.98 -- 1 3/8":0.98 -- 0.82 (fictitious example "A")
Mooneye -- 7':0.85 -- 4 3/4":0.98 -- 3/4":1.02 -- 1 1/2":0.97 -- 0.82 (Brunswick "bar box")
SloMoHolic -- 6':0.85 -- 4.5":1.00 -- 0":0.95 -- 5/8":0.95 -- 0.77 (old 6' Valley "bar box")
dzcues -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 1/2":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley "bar box")
dr_dave -- 7':0.85 -- 4 1/2":1.00 -- 0":0.94 -- 3/4":0.95 -- 0.76 (Valley/Dynamo "bar box" at West End, Fort Collins)