what did you apply on this shot?

whether or not you meant to, you had a lot of top-right spin that held after impact.

Hail Mary Shot said:

what happened here is that pocket the 7 at the lower right corner pocket. CB goes down to it's normal path after the initial impact, hits the rail but was killed almost instantly after the rebound. the CB did a semi-arch or bounced off the opposite angle. by the way, the CB was struck at above moderate speed. how did this happen?

CueTable Help

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Yeah, tons of top right. Those are pretty. If you want to see some really cool stuff, go to youtube and look up the 3-cushion players. Now THOSE GUYS have a stroke! I can double the rail on new cloth from the diagram you showed. Those 3-cushion guys can triple it.

Jude Rosenstock said:

Yeah, tons of top right. Those are pretty. If you want to see some really cool stuff, go to youtube and look up the 3-cushion players. Now THOSE GUYS have a stroke! I can double the rail on new cloth from the diagram you showed. Those 3-cushion guys can triple it.

Click to expand...

agree with Jude, lots of top-right. This shot is VERY useful if you are not confident with the roll of the table and hitting the shot pocket speed. As long as you hit it firm-to-hard with top right the cueball will stick on the rail. This only works, however, if you hit the object ball reasonably thick (ie the shot is close to straight) - a thin cut on the 7ball would mean the velocity of the cue would still overpower the spin element, firing the cue way back down the table. A thick contact means most of the velocity gets transferred to the 7, leaving a bucketload of spin as the cue hits the rail.
Very pretty and very effective!

snookerish said:

agree with Jude, lots of top-right. This shot is VERY useful if you are not confident with the roll of the table and hitting the shot pocket speed. As long as you hit it firm-to-hard with top right the cueball will stick on the rail. This only works, however, if you hit the object ball reasonably thick (ie the shot is close to straight) - a thin cut on the 7ball would mean the velocity of the cue would still overpower the spin element, firing the cue way back down the table. A thick contact means most of the velocity gets transferred to the 7, leaving a bucketload of spin as the cue hits the rail.
Very pretty and very effective!

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You know, it's funny you should say this. I actually saw a guy try to play this shot in a competitive scenario and ended up not hitting it with enough juice. Seriously, although it'd be great to find an application for this type of shot, I can't think of any. Every other options is probably better.

However, I can't think of a single time I hit this shot and didn't get every nearby woman's attention.

I used to put so much top on a shot like this that it would hit the rail bounce out a bit and then back to the rail a total of 2-3 times and run itself over to the 9. Sometimes it would follow the 9 in, sometimes it would hang it, sometimes I made it. Eitherway I felt great about the amount of junk on the ball that I did not care what happened after the shot.

edit: after a recheck of the pic, I think the cue was a bit closer to the rail.

yeah there's 2 things happening there. the reverse english closes the rebound angle and takes some speed off the cue ball. also, there is a force follow effect where the top spin doesn't take effect until after it hits the cushion, that makes it 'stick' to the rail. if you have enough top, you can do what jude was saying where it bounces into the rail 2 or 3 times.

Jude Rosenstock said:

You know, it's funny you should say this. I actually saw a guy try to play this shot in a competitive scenario and ended up not hitting it with enough juice. Seriously, although it'd be great to find an application for this type of shot, I can't think of any. Every other options is probably better.

However, I can't think of a single time I hit this shot and didn't get every nearby woman's attention.

Click to expand...

true, most options are usually better given where the 9 is. I have only ever played this shot once in a competitive game of 8ball on a 9ft table. i proceeded to run the table, figuring my last stripe over the pocket was the best ball to get on the 8, which was tight on the rail at the middle diamond. There was a small window to get at the 8 - i needed to be within about 8 inches of the rail, and after getting a little out of shape i left a long shot at the last stripe. now, trying to hit the hanging ball dead weight to land in the window was tough. there was a line through his remaining solids, but i fugured that even the slightest roll offline by the table would have ended up with me either cutting the ball too thin and coming up out of my target window, or hitting too full and following in. I decided what the heck. I figured that I'd take the possible table roll out of the equation, so I nailed the cue with tons of top, it came back off the rail then spun back, probably nudging against the rail another couple of times.
It looked nice, and worked out great. Incidentally I tried it again after the match and got the same result. Its not something I'd want to play much, but i know i can hit it if i need to.
By the way, I did see the shot first watching 3 cushion.

Jude Rosenstock said:

You know, it's funny you should say this. I actually saw a guy try to play this shot in a competitive scenario and ended up not hitting it with enough juice. Seriously, although it'd be great to find an application for this type of shot, I can't think of any. Every other options is probably better.
However, I can't think of a single time I hit this shot and didn't get every nearby woman's attention.

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I have only seen it used from time to time in specific safety situations.....

Jude Rosenstock said:

You know, it's funny you should say this. I actually saw a guy try to play this shot in a competitive scenario and ended up not hitting it with enough juice. Seriously, although it'd be great to find an application for this type of shot, I can't think of any. Every other options is probably better.

However, I can't think of a single time I hit this shot and didn't get every nearby woman's attention.

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I totally agree with this post. People claim this is a useful alternative to hitting the ball softly, but I can't imagine ever thinking this shot is more reliable than hitting the ball softly. Just hitting the 7 into the wrong half of the pocket makes the shot impossible. It's a cool shot, and not as difficult as it is visually impressive, but still never the right play in my opinion.

-Andrew

Yeah, I once did THIS against a friend on new cloth. We laughed about this for the rest of the set.

CueTable Help

Jude Rosenstock said:

Yeah, I once did THIS against a friend on new cloth. We laughed about this for the rest of the set.

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My local favorite pool hall just re-opened with all the tables recieveing fresh Simonis 860. I've seen several similar shots in league over the last couple of weeks, and while the shot is strange enough with all that slippage, the looks on the players face is priceless (the classis "WTF?" look). I've been very happy to see them however This action should diminish over the next couple of weeks as the cloth gets broken in ... ah well.

Dave

fun stuff

It might be hard to think of a situation where the original shot is necessary, but the same principal can be useful on a variety of other shots. Here is a common one that comes to mind...

CueTable Help

Cuebacca said:

It might be hard to think of a situation where the original shot is necessary, but the same principal can be useful on a variety of other shots. Here is a common one that comes to mind...

CueTable Help

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Actually, it's important to know this shot. Ironic you should bring this one up. I did this by accident against the same friend I played the previous shot I posted in this thread. I honestly believe every person who knows this shot learns it by accident.

Cuebacca said:

It might be hard to think of a situation where the original shot is necessary, but the same principal can be useful on a variety of other shots. Here is a common one that comes to mind...

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

I don't use the force-follow with top right like you're talking about... If I had this shot, I would've slowrolled the 8 in the side with some top, cheating the pocket as much as possible.

Would that work? Contrary to everything I'm supposed to do as a new guy, I tend to hit softly whenever that's an option vs. a hard shot...

-J

the real trick

The real trick is still having follow on the ball after contacting and leaving the rail. Many people just fail to understand that once the ball changes direction the effect is now draw. So, if you were standing at the rail the cue ball hits, it is follow coming towards you, but, draw leaving the rail which makes the cue come back at you although the cue is spinning the same. Not sure I explained that well. Anyway, seen a lot of people scratch there head on that one and they just did not take the change of direction into account.

Jude Rosenstock said:

Actually, it's important to know this shot. Ironic you should bring this one up. I did this by accident against the same friend I played the previous shot I posted in this thread. I honestly believe every person who knows this shot learns it by accident.

Click to expand...

Hey, maybe today we changed that!

James said:

I don't use the force-follow with top right like you're talking about... If I had this shot, I would've slowrolled the 8 in the side with some top, cheating the pocket as much as possible.

Would that work? Contrary to everything I'm supposed to do as a new guy, I tend to hit softly whenever that's an option vs. a hard shot...

-J

Click to expand...

I meant to diagram it to where cheating the pocket and following straight down isn't an option. Try setting it up to where you cannot cheat it enough to make the cue ball go up table towards the 9 on a slow roll. Cut that option off completely, and then give this route a try.

I think it should work fine with just top, but maybe a tad of left works better; I'm not sure.

If you can't get the cue ball to bend off the cushion, put the 8 a little closer to the pocket. Like someone said earlier, you want to hit the 8 thick enough to where it takes a lot of the speed off. If you're playing on nap cloth, you may also need to be careful to hit it thin enough to where the spin hasn't completely "caught" until after the cue ball hits the rail.

As Jude showed in that shot where he scratched, you can hit it super thick on new Simonis and still the spin may go for a while before completely taking.

Cuebacca said:

Hey, maybe today we changed that!

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Nah. They're going to forget this thread and one day, they'll be in the poolroom, need to use a lot of follow with inside and the cueball is going to take a sharp bend toward the corner pocket and they're going to say, "HOLY ****, THOSE AZB FOLKS ARE ON TO SOMETHIN'!"

Jude Rosenstock said:

Nah. They're going to forget this thread and one day, they'll be in the poolroom, need to use a lot of follow with inside and the cueball is going to take a sharp bend toward the corner pocket and they're going to say, "HOLY ****, THOSE AZB FOLKS ARE ON TO SOMETHIN'!"

Click to expand...

Hehe. Very true. This is more reason for anyone who hasn't tried this shot before to set it up when you get a chance (if you remember). I've probably forgotten a lot of shots that I've seen too. More reason why this is a great game. Always new stuff to learn, or old stuff to re-learn. LOL.