Is it poor sportsmanship to celebrate a mistake by the other player?

hang-the-9 said:

So something happened in league last night that really upset me.

I had this in the 'how you are doing in league' post also but I think it's a good enough post on it's own.

My team-mate was going to 4, other guy going to 2.

The score is 3-1, and our guy is shooting the 8 in the side, tough cut. He missed, but the cueball hits off the side rail and goes across into the corner to scratch and we lose the set.

The other guy is waving his hands in victory, pumping his fist, jumping off his chair all happy. I found that to be in really poor taste. You did not earn the win, you did not play good enough to even have an even game with the player, you should not be celebrating that the other guy had the misfortune to scratch in a odd way (it was not an obvious scratch by any means). He started to say how he keeps beating the good players and I told him "you did not beat anyone today, you had to win half the games the other guy did and the only reason you even won that was because he scratched and it was crappy of you to be happy at his loss".

I consider it bad manners to celebrate a mistake by the other guy or root for someone to mess up. Don't know why so many players, even some good ones I have seen, get all worked up when they get an un-earned win.

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Agree with you. Poor manors and bad sportanship!

That being said I saw it many times when my team went to Vegas and even some of my team mates did it in the third round. They both were very good people that just got carried away in the moment. We had a team meeting so it would never happen again.

Ray

Yes, it is. I consider it to be one of the lowest things an opponent can do. Everyone jumps up and down and runs around town naked inside when your opponent screws up, but its another to let that emotion filter out for all to see.

But this is just me. I also find it off putting when an opponent congratulates you on every nice shot you play. Why do people struggle so much with keeping quiet and not interacting with the shooter when sat in the seat?

People who celebrate another person's mistake or misfortune are immature. The world is full of immature, childish people. Unfortunately, this will never change.

League administrators should try to do more than just schedule matches and collect money and deal with conflicts. They should offer regular discussion sessions with their league members to review scenarios and address questions.

Educating league members is key to everyone having a great time and experiencing healthy competition.

I don't like it.

But at the tap event at SBE, after my player was being sharked, I was told if he can't handle it, he shouldn't be playing at such a big tournament. I've come to the conclusion that I might be in the minority when it comes to table conduct.

I agree with you. When something like that happens to me I am typically happy about my win, but I don't really like winning like that. I want to beat you. So typically I am happy inside. I do not celebrate the win and typically shake hands with a few words like "wow tough break" or "man I never saw that scratch, tough roll"

FranCrimi said:

People who celebrate another person's mistake or misfortune are immature. The world is full of immature, childish people. Unfortunately, this will never change.

League administrators should try to do more than just schedule matches and collect money and deal with conflicts. They should offer regular discussion sessions with their league members to review scenarios and address questions.

Educating league members is key to everyone having a great time and experiencing healthy competition.

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Well said, on all counts.

One of the guys in my playing crowd let's out a little chuckle anytime his opponent misses a shot, and sometimes follows up the chuckle with "Aw, I thought for sure you had that!" Not loud; almost under his breath.

I don't get upset by it because I honestly don't think he even knows he does it -- it's just kind of reflexive.

An obvious and obnoxious celebration would bother me though. But I doubt I'd say anything about it because that would let my opponent know that it's getting to me. Better to re-channel the emotion to "yeah, well let me at the table one more time and you're history."

ChicagoJoe said:

I don't like it.

But at the tap event at SBE, after my player was being sharked, I was told if he can't handle it, he shouldn't be playing at such a big tournament. I've come to the conclusion that I might be in the minority when it comes to table conduct.

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Unfortunately, you are in the minority. It shouldn't be that way, and you can blame the tournament administration entirely for that.

hang-the-9 said:

So something happened in league last night that really upset me.

I had this in the 'how you are doing in league' post also but I think it's a good enough post on it's own.

My team-mate was going to 4, other guy going to 2.

The score is 3-1, and our guy is shooting the 8 in the side, tough cut. He missed, but the cueball hits off the side rail and goes across into the corner to scratch and we lose the set.

The other guy is waving his hands in victory, pumping his fist, jumping off his chair all happy. I found that to be in really poor taste. You did not earn the win, you did not play good enough to even have an even game with the player, you should not be celebrating that the other guy had the misfortune to scratch in a odd way (it was not an obvious scratch by any means). He started to say how he keeps beating the good players and I told him "you did not beat anyone today, you had to win half the games the other guy did and the only reason you even won that was because he scratched and it was crappy of you to be happy at his loss".

I consider it bad manners to celebrate a mistake by the other guy or root for someone to mess up. Don't know why so many players, even some good ones I have seen, get all worked up when they get an un-earned win.

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I think it's incredibly poor sportsmanship to celebrate an unforced error/mistake by the opponent.

Yes, it is poor sportsmanship and bad form.

The only exception I can think of is if both players are good friends and are having fun barking at each other. Even then, if its a match in a competition, it doesn't belong.

hang-the-9 said:

So something happened in league last night that really upset me.

I had this in the 'how you are doing in league' post also but I think it's a good enough post on it's own.

My team-mate was going to 4, other guy going to 2.

The score is 3-1, and our guy is shooting the 8 in the side, tough cut. He missed, but the cueball hits off the side rail and goes across into the corner to scratch and we lose the set.

The other guy is waving his hands in victory, pumping his fist, jumping off his chair all happy. I found that to be in really poor taste. You did not earn the win, you did not play good enough to even have an even game with the player, you should not be celebrating that the other guy had the misfortune to scratch in a odd way (it was not an obvious scratch by any means). He started to say how he keeps beating the good players and I told him "you did not beat anyone today, you had to win half the games the other guy did and the only reason you even won that was because he scratched and it was crappy of you to be happy at his loss".

I consider it bad manners to celebrate a mistake by the other guy or root for someone to mess up. Don't know why so many players, even some good ones I have seen, get all worked up when they get an un-earned win.

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It is poor sportsmanship.

But on the other hand, they should be allowed to celebrate their win.

I think a good rule of thumb would be to wait until after the handshake. Once the two players have shaken hands and returned to their respective corners, then you celebrate the win with your team. Then you're celebrating the win, not the other player's mistake.

-Andrew

Yep, that is a dick move. I don't even celebrate like that after a big win on a stronger player. I am always happy about a win, earned or not but I don't think it's appropriate to ever celebrate at the table.

if i win like that i am happy in the inside and never say "i'm sorry" to the other guy or feel sorry for them. Though i don't rub it on the opponent.

I have lost games like that and I've won games like that.

Pidge said:

But this is just me. I also find it off putting when an opponent congratulates you on every nice shot you play. Why do people struggle so much with keeping quiet and not interacting with the shooter when sat in the seat?

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Ok so we all agree it's bad sportsmanship to celebrate your opponent's bad luck. But what about this other issue mentioned here about complementing the good shots. I am afraid that I do get caught up and when I am truly amazed a good play I verbalize my appreciation of a shot well played. Am I off the mark and just distracting my opponent?

We all have that inner voice that says ..miss,miss,miss, but it's just that, and thats where it should stay. No theatrics, no outburst's (win or lose). Win with class, which means " when you win you don't laugh and when you lose you don't whine".

This is an interesting thread and the issue definitely has two sides.

To say that a behavior reflects poor sportsmanship requires a "Value" judgment. There are always two sides to every coin.

We have to ask if it is appropriate to judge a natural behavioral reaction. Since emotion is often spontaneous and it sounds like this person was clearly overwhelmed with his/her victory, I think we must temper our judgments.

While Jonny Archer might not have been overwhelmed with this type of victory a novice might be much more emotionally tied to achieving a win. Look how frequently we see people celebrate a victory with great emotion. Emotion almost always precedes forethought.

I suspect that the reality of the situation is that the winner who was not necessarily a proficient player got a victory over a stronger player and their emotion got the best of them.

The losing team, unhappy with the way the game ended didn't feel it was appropriate for such celebration since the victory was by default. I doubt that the winner saw it that way.....at least not while in an emotional state. Perhaps later when they were able to reflect on the situation their view might have changed.

In the end I'll bet both parties feel their reaction was appropriate....at the time. Looking in from the outside with no "dog in the fight" I think it all boils down to a matter of perspective.