Need some help here.
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mikeiniowa
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Need some help here. - 12-03-2019, 07:26 PM

https://youtu.be/8Y3XCKkbZHo
https://youtu.be/AxVD5mZfris
https://youtu.be/UKqgJI5_OFU





I'm trying to figure out what is going on here. I know I have the elbow drop. But I have a "little" something else in the middle of my stroke.
I finish to the left Alot. My warm up strokes can be on line but I finish Alot with cue to the left a bit.
My digicue scores are bad on straightness and tip steer right.

What are some things I need to be working on too fix these errors?

Last edited by mikeiniowa; 12-03-2019 at 07:54 PM.
  
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12-04-2019, 05:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeiniowa View Post
https://youtu.be/8Y3XCKkbZHo
https://youtu.be/AxVD5mZfris
https://youtu.be/UKqgJI5_OFU





I'm trying to figure out what is going on here. I know I have the elbow drop. But I have a "little" something else in the middle of my stroke.
I finish to the left Alot. My warm up strokes can be on line but I finish Alot with cue to the left a bit.
My digicue scores are bad on straightness and tip steer right.

What are some things I need to be working on too fix these errors?
mike i am not an instructor
but in your last video it seems to me your forearm wrist angle is bowed out
but on your finish it is neutral
you may be turning your wrist in as you stroke causing the cue to go off course
jmho
icbw
btw
i see you have the stroke aiming system
try to get your cue so the dotted lines are in the middle of the cue and shoot balls into a pocket trying to get the cue tip to a dotted line several inches past where the cue ball starts
ie you are trying to visualize a straight line from contact to finish using the dotted lines as your straight line visual to groove the stroke
i hope this makes sense and more important helps...
  
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BilliardsAbout
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12-04-2019, 05:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeiniowa View Post
https://youtu.be/8Y3XCKkbZHo
https://youtu.be/AxVD5mZfris
https://youtu.be/UKqgJI5_OFU





I'm trying to figure out what is going on here. I know I have the elbow drop. But I have a "little" something else in the middle of my stroke.
I finish to the left Alot. My warm up strokes can be on line but I finish Alot with cue to the left a bit.
My digicue scores are bad on straightness and tip steer right.

What are some things I need to be working on too fix these errors?
On the first link, watch your head for the entire clip. See what you did during the backstroke and forward stroke? Where is your vision center/best head and eyes position when you play?

On the second link, your head moves less, but moves because your backstroke grinds into your chin. Did you play snooker before pool? Sometimes the optimum head position is higher above the cue stick.

On the third video, you open your stroke hand on the backstroke and close it again on the forward stroke--and old school move that isn't optimal for most players. You also closed down on the cue hard and it moved sideways--how hard is your grip on the cue? That is a likely culprit for your sideways movement.

So I'd start with 1) raise your hand a few inches above the cue, even one or two would be a help 2) find the "vision center" and commit to that head position for all shots, providing your personal best eye/vision alignment 3) lighten the grip

Let us know how you proceed from there and I'll help more if I can.


-- Matt Sherman

Guide to Pool and Billiards, About.com
Instruction Staff, InsidePool Magazine
Author, book/DVD combo, Picture Yourself Shooting Pool
  
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BC21
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12-04-2019, 08:15 AM

Front view: Head moves to the right on your delivery stroke. And you actually hit the cb right of center. It's like your body is making a last second adjustment to "fix" the final stroke based on the change of perspective caused by moving your head off line. Are you standing with your back foot on the shot line? I only ask because it seems like you're standing off line and reaching out a bit.

Side view: Looks like your stance is little too far away, and with a long bridge length it causes you to grip the cue too far back. It also looks like on your practice strokes the tip is pretty far away from the cb, at least it looks like 3 or 4 inches.

Back view: Are you super tall? Grabbing the very end of the cue, when you are bringing in that delivery stroke, your palm or pinky finger looks to be applying inward/sideways pressure, which would cause the tip end of the cue to move to the right. During your practice strokes your wrist is cocked outward, but on the delivery stroke you straighten it out.


The Digicue is spot on. So trust those results.

Try a shorter bridge. Ensure you are standing on the shot line. Try standing 3 or 4 inches closer, addressing the cb closer, so that you're not gripping the cue on the very end of the butt. Also try keeping your wrist straight from the start. All of this will take deliberate conscious effort. Do it very slowy, paying attention to how each motion feels, which will be awkward at first. But this is an effective way to reprogram body mechanics. With practice you'll start doing these things automatically, not deliberately.


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Last edited by BC21; 12-04-2019 at 01:32 PM.
  
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12-04-2019, 08:29 AM

Mike,

Larry and Matt nailed it, I would recommend you find a PBIA -SPF instructor in your area and have them do a video analysis, template your stroke and give you the tools to correct your deficiencies. This is the fastest way to get on the right track. Templating your stroke will give you diagnostic tools, this will help you identify if you followed your stroke process or not and what you need to do to correct a deficiency on the next stroke. This will keep you from going into a slump.


Jim Baker
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Member of the SPF Family
(573) 433-0386
E-mail: 1jbcuerepair@gmail.com
  
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Scott Lee
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12-04-2019, 12:54 PM

Mike...While I saw the things others were commenting on, I don't think those things (for you) are big problems, and merely representative of what the real issue may be. I watched you play at DCC last year, and saw a lot of what you were doing. I think your problem is more related to timing and process repeatability ...especially the pause from backwards to forwards. How's your PEP? You're definitely twisting the cue a very small amount (nowhere near as much as most others who unconsciously twist). What we don't know is, does the twisting motion begin before contact, at contact, or after contact? That's what slow-motion, frame-by-frame video analysis will show. You can't fix what you don't know about...and you can't fix what you can't measure! I'm coming to Des Moines, but not until March. If you haven't got it fixed by then, we'll get together.

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FranCrimi
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12-07-2019, 02:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeiniowa View Post
https://youtu.be/8Y3XCKkbZHo
https://youtu.be/AxVD5mZfris
https://youtu.be/UKqgJI5_OFU





I'm trying to figure out what is going on here. I know I have the elbow drop. But I have a "little" something else in the middle of my stroke.
I finish to the left Alot. My warm up strokes can be on line but I finish Alot with cue to the left a bit.
My digicue scores are bad on straightness and tip steer right.

What are some things I need to be working on too fix these errors?
Your stroke timing is a little off. You've got a little bit of a poke going on. Try this: Increase your follow through by two inches. It may sound funny because that's after the ball is struck, but if you focus on that from the beginning of your stroke, it'll help your timing.
  
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Question 12-10-2019, 07:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
Your stroke timing is a little off. You've got a little bit of a poke going on. Try this: Increase your follow through by two inches. It may sound funny because that's after the ball is struck, but if you focus on that from the beginning of your stroke, it'll help your timing.
Most instructional videos when the instructor is teaching a student the importance of keeping the elbow from dropping, it appears to me, that he/she'll will do an exaggerated follow through with a tip dipping into the table. My question: Is that for teaching purposes, as a visual for the student to continue when practicing stroke fundamentals?
  
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12-11-2019, 05:01 AM

i am not an instructor
the tip naturally goes toward the table bed on the follow thru with a pendulum (no elbow drop ) stroke
  
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12-11-2019, 03:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb View Post
i am not an instructor
the tip naturally goes toward the table bed on the follow thru with a pendulum (no elbow drop ) stroke
Right. I guess i should'be put it differently. When you watch the professionals play, you don't see the cue dip to that extent. So i was wondering is that only for teaching purposes for amateurs, or should it be repeated for each stroke. For instance, i'm trying to implement that when practicing, i'm forcing myself to make the cue dip into the table on every shot. I know the cue tip will naturally dip into the table, (for me) it's natural on draw shots, and some shots i have to shoot hard, center ball shots.
  
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12-11-2019, 03:56 PM

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Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
Right. I guess i should'be put it differently. When you watch the professionals play, you don't see the cue dip to that extent. So i was wondering is that only for teaching purposes for amateurs, or should it be repeated for each stroke. For instance, i'm trying to implement that when practicing, i'm forcing myself to make the cue dip into the table on every shot. I know the cue tip will naturally dip into the table, (for me) it's natural on draw shots, and some shots i have to shoot hard, center ball shots.
I've been paying attention to them for years.
Almost all have a small elbow drop.
And a great number do let the cue slip a little.
That includes SVB.


  
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12-12-2019, 04:51 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EimcvLCo6p8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBvlmdglZZw
allison fisher last 2 shots in particular you can see the tip finish on the table
hunter lumbardo who has a beautiful pendulum stroke you can watch his follow thru
  
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12-12-2019, 07:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieBme View Post
Right. I guess i should'be put it differently. When you watch the professionals play, you don't see the cue dip to that extent. So i was wondering is that only for teaching purposes for amateurs, or should it be repeated for each stroke. For instance, i'm trying to implement that when practicing, i'm forcing myself to make the cue dip into the table on every shot. I know the cue tip will naturally dip into the table, (for me) it's natural on draw shots, and some shots i have to shoot hard, center ball shots.
Dont get caught up in "what the PRO's are doing" Consistency is the key in your PSR, do everything the same for every shot. Allison Fisher and John Mora have the best pendulum stroke in the game if you want to copy a PRO for fundamentals they are the best.

With a pendulum stroke you tip will not always be on the table at the finish position I.E. with top spin 3 tips high your tip will be pointing down towards the table and at 3 tips low on the cue ball or draw shot the tip will be on the table at the finish position and a center ball hit the tip might be touching the table and it might not.


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12-12-2019, 08:50 AM

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Originally Posted by SFC9ball View Post
Allison Fisher... the best pendulum stroke in the game...
Allison Fisher has a pendulum stroke?
  
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12-12-2019, 04:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb View Post
mike i am not an instructor
but in your last video it seems to me your forearm wrist angle is bowed out
but on your finish it is neutral
you may be turning your wrist in as you stroke causing the cue to go off course
jmho
icbw
btw
i see you have the stroke aiming system
try to get your cue so the dotted lines are in the middle of the cue and shoot balls into a pocket trying to get the cue tip to a dotted line several inches past where the cue ball starts
ie you are trying to visualize a straight line from contact to finish using the dotted lines as your straight line visual to groove the stroke
i hope this makes sense and more important helps...
I am not an instructor, just a 50 year player who has had a ton of professional lessons and owns every cd known to man on Pool.

You do something my playing partner does a lot, especially when needs a lot of draw. We call it "screwing the ball in". The back hand twists to the right in a screw driver motion. I don't think you do that all the time, as my friend also does not.

If you end up just a little left of straight, consistently, it is very hard to change. I end up a hair left of center. I am always told I need to fix it but it is so much a part of my aim and overall game I am not sure it is worth the effort. anything you can repeat consistently is reliable. I know that is heresy but it is the ability to do exactly the same thing each time that makes consistency. If you ever figure out how to get that stroke perfectly straight let me know how you did it.

I see a lot of pros who finish slightly off to one side consistently. They don't finish off randomly left then right, it is always to one side and most commonly a touch to the left. It might be they slightly favor one side of the cue ball, inside or outside, and the force of impact off dead center results in a slight deflection from the impact.

Do you finish slightly off on very soft hits?
  
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