why????????
"Diamondizing" A Table Thread
- Thread starter DrCue'sProtege
- Start date
why????????
Maybe he just missed you Glen .. :grin:
Maybe...LOL just makes no sense to bring back a thread 8 years old.....and then not have anything to say while doing so!!
DrCuesProtege: Until you post a video on your GC4 with your new cloth beating the 9 ball ghost, no more Diamond vs GC discussions allowed for you:grin-square::grin-square::grin-square:
Now, get to it!
Edit: And please use a magic rack, freshly vacuumed cloth, and freshly polished balls, so you have the best chance.
Now, get to it!
Edit: And please use a magic rack, freshly vacuumed cloth, and freshly polished balls, so you have the best chance.
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Your mentor must be pleased.
Well, lets see. This thread is eight (8) years old. I was thinking that perhaps there might be new info regarding this over the last several years so I thought I would bump.
But, once again, I see some people chose to act like idiots and/or moderators and start the trashing and bashing again. If there wasn't anything new with regards to "Diamondizing" a table it seems logical nobody should have responded. But, like I said, some people decided to start a war over one thread being bumped.
r/DCP
But, once again, I see some people chose to act like idiots and/or moderators and start the trashing and bashing again. If there wasn't anything new with regards to "Diamondizing" a table it seems logical nobody should have responded. But, like I said, some people decided to start a war over one thread being bumped.
r/DCP
I don't know Glen. That's why I was asking. Somebody suggested rather than spending several thousand $$$ to get a Diamond I should just have my GCIV Diamondized. So I searched, found this old thread, and decided to bump in case there was anything new and different regarding this subject that has come to light over the last eight years.
r/DCP
Don't do it
Dude, you are not paying attention. That is why everyone is busting your balls. We just had 3 or 4 threads of Diamond vs GC arguments. YOU were in at least 2 of those threads. They are like aiming threads. We all end up yelling at each other. They finally simmered down, and now you bump this thread from a decade ago. That's why everyone is giving you a hard time, me included.
There is no new information. Its the same stuff.
You can't keep switching tables until you find one you think you can make balls on.
Your practice routines aren't good, and you have incredibly unrealistic expectations on equipment and where your ability should be.
Adjustments have to be made for balls, tables, who you are playing, etc.
If you can't do that, then you are destined to repeat failure.
Your practice routines aren't good, and you have incredibly unrealistic expectations on equipment and where your ability should be.
Adjustments have to be made for balls, tables, who you are playing, etc.
If you can't do that, then you are destined to repeat failure.
I'd like to see a GoldCrownized Diamond.
What he obviously needs is a certain table that used to be in Springfield, Ohio. Maybe it's still there. On that table there are no excuses.:groucho:
I've owned several gold crowns. I've had one GC I, two GC II's, one GC III, three GC IV's.
I've played several GC V's. Not my opinion, its fact..... pretty much all GC's play a little different straight from factory. Not just from the I to II to III ....etc. very few GC IV play the same as the next GC IV. Same with the I, II, III, IV and V.
All diamonds play extremely close to the same. Almost all red labels play alike and almost all blue labels play alike, if they are not modified from factory and setup is correct.
Table conditions, weather etc...etc... is obvious reasons why any table may act funny but like I said, it's hard to find a table that will be as consistent as the blue label diamond that has not been modified and has been maintained. Just the way they are.
Now, it sounds like I don't like Gold crowns. Lol, nothing could be further from the truth.
I freaking LOVE to play on gold crowns that are in good shape. Why? Well, to me they are much easier to play on. Balls pocket easier, simple as that.
I can beat the ghost on either table but on standard GC IV lol.... I feel like I'm cheating. Balls pocket wwaaayyyy easier on GC compared to diamonds. Again, assuming both tables are factory condition.
Why did I choose the diamond over GC this time? Well, in my area and most other areas, rooms are full of diamonds, not GC's. I really wish it was the opposite but it is what it is.
Practice on the table you will be playing on in tournaments/gambling etc.
. Etc...
If rooms switch back to gold crowns, I'm one player that will buy a GC so fast it would make your head spin.
Again, I grew up around GC's and love them but the money is on the diamond.
I've played several GC V's. Not my opinion, its fact..... pretty much all GC's play a little different straight from factory. Not just from the I to II to III ....etc. very few GC IV play the same as the next GC IV. Same with the I, II, III, IV and V.
All diamonds play extremely close to the same. Almost all red labels play alike and almost all blue labels play alike, if they are not modified from factory and setup is correct.
Table conditions, weather etc...etc... is obvious reasons why any table may act funny but like I said, it's hard to find a table that will be as consistent as the blue label diamond that has not been modified and has been maintained. Just the way they are.
Now, it sounds like I don't like Gold crowns. Lol, nothing could be further from the truth.
I freaking LOVE to play on gold crowns that are in good shape. Why? Well, to me they are much easier to play on. Balls pocket easier, simple as that.
I can beat the ghost on either table but on standard GC IV lol.... I feel like I'm cheating. Balls pocket wwaaayyyy easier on GC compared to diamonds. Again, assuming both tables are factory condition.
Why did I choose the diamond over GC this time? Well, in my area and most other areas, rooms are full of diamonds, not GC's. I really wish it was the opposite but it is what it is.
Practice on the table you will be playing on in tournaments/gambling etc.
. Etc...
If rooms switch back to gold crowns, I'm one player that will buy a GC so fast it would make your head spin.
Again, I grew up around GC's and love them but the money is on the diamond.
perfectpocketz
Banned
This is the truth about the diamondize bullshit......diamond tables had a rail thickness of 1-3/4” and a subrail thickness of 1-3/4” so they put the Artemis cushions flat side up as to not have a hump side of the cushion to shoot over and not see as much of the ball when against the rail.
That subrail thickness made the rails springy and bank short.
Brunswick has always had the 1-3/4” rails with the subrail thickness being 1-11/16” witch is correct for the Brunswick super speed cushions....but the perfect subrail height for pool.
That’s the change diamond made to there tables....they went from a subrail height of 1-3/4” to a subrail height of 1-11/16 the same as the Brunswick specs.
I know I told Greg to make the changes....as did Glen.
SO HOW THE HELL DID THE DIAMONDIZE A GOLD CROWN START.....GLEN STARTED IT.....WHERE THE SAYING SHOULD BE GOLD CROWNIZE A DIAMOND TABLE.....CAUSE THE GOLD CROWN TABLE HAS NEVER BEEN MODIFIED.
THE DIAMOND TABLE WAS MODIFIED TO THE BRUNSWICK SPECS PERIOD.
THE DIAMONDIZE THE GLOD CROWN STARTED WHEN WE PUT THE ARTEMIS CUSHIONS ON A GOLD CROWN....WITCH IS A BAD IDEA.....THE SUPER SPEED CUSHIONS INSTALLED CORRECTLY ARE THE BEST FOR GOLD CROWNS.
SO NOW THIS THREAD CAN BE PUT TO BED......YOU WANT ARTEMIS CUSHIONS.....BUY A DIAMOND....YOU WANT THE TRUEST PLAYING TABLE BUY A GOLD CROWN.....THE ARTEMIS CUSHIONS ARE A STRAIGHT RAIL BILLIARD CUSHION......NOT A POOL CUSHION.
I CAN’T BE ANY CLEARER......THATS THE TRUTH.....LIKE IT OR HATE IT.
Mark Gregory
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Very true.
But until rooms all over the country change their diamond tables for gold crowns most any pool player is better off to go with diamond since that is what he/she will be forced to play on when at most all tournaments these days.
Only the best of the best players can make the adjustment from a gc to a diamond and still be competitive enough to take the cheese from very, very strong competitors that play on diamonds fulltime.
What you said is spot on but it does not change the fact that most all rooms are full of diamonds with very, very few rooms having gold crowns.
It would be nice if they did but it's not the case eventhough the correctly setup GC plays much better/ easier.
As you said, like it or hate it.... that's the facts for us room goers that like to practice at home on the very same setup that will be at most all tournaments.
Rake
Now that the blue-label Diamond's bank the way the pool world has known GC's to bank, what else can be said?
That was the last and final single factor that could give anyone an excuse or reason to prefer a Brunswick over a Diamond in terms of performance. Now, there's no argument to favor a Gold Crown except for aesthetics, nostalgia or whatever....Diamond is superior in every single factor.
Not sure how this qualifies as Brunswickizing a Diamond? Maybe it is just an admission or perhaps at least a response to the market that the earlier rail design with Artemis cushions wasn't what everyone knew and was used to. Or maybe it was just plain wrong. One thing was for sure, it was different. Now it's the same, so it is moot.
The GC pocket design, like I said in this thread years ago - does not lend itself well at all to being tightened. The Diamond was designed for the 4.5" Pro Cut pocket.
To this day I see people, often old-timers that get so excited over a GC that's shimmed down to 4 or 4.25" resulting in pockets that play stupid. In other words, balls that can be shot perfectly into the pocket, cannot be pocketed at certain speeds or when shot at certain angles.
I believe this to be a matter of objectivity that if an object ball has a straight, unimpeded path to a pocket, that pocket should accept that ball if hit perfectly at any speed. A broken table rejects balls that are hit perfectly. This is a defect.
Some of these shimmed down GC's cause "dead zones" or "no go zones" on the table, where an OB sitting in that area, cannot be made in certain pockets.
Should I be able to play safe by putting the OB on the side rail where the available corner pocket is too tight and (because of being a GC designed for larger pockets) has the wrong pocket face angle and thus the ball just will not go in? That's NOT part of the game...
Look I get it, there's that tough-guy, bad-ass syndrome that manifests in a sort of "mine is SMALLER than yours" when it comes to pockets. People wanting a tough table, challenging pockets...
I'm all for that, but only on a properly designed pocket. Most GC's, unless the rail has been modified via extension at the proper angles, which is hardly any of them in the real world, will play terrible. They will be double and triple shimmed junk that spits balls out.
That was the last and final single factor that could give anyone an excuse or reason to prefer a Brunswick over a Diamond in terms of performance. Now, there's no argument to favor a Gold Crown except for aesthetics, nostalgia or whatever....Diamond is superior in every single factor.
Not sure how this qualifies as Brunswickizing a Diamond? Maybe it is just an admission or perhaps at least a response to the market that the earlier rail design with Artemis cushions wasn't what everyone knew and was used to. Or maybe it was just plain wrong. One thing was for sure, it was different. Now it's the same, so it is moot.
The GC pocket design, like I said in this thread years ago - does not lend itself well at all to being tightened. The Diamond was designed for the 4.5" Pro Cut pocket.
To this day I see people, often old-timers that get so excited over a GC that's shimmed down to 4 or 4.25" resulting in pockets that play stupid. In other words, balls that can be shot perfectly into the pocket, cannot be pocketed at certain speeds or when shot at certain angles.
I believe this to be a matter of objectivity that if an object ball has a straight, unimpeded path to a pocket, that pocket should accept that ball if hit perfectly at any speed. A broken table rejects balls that are hit perfectly. This is a defect.
Some of these shimmed down GC's cause "dead zones" or "no go zones" on the table, where an OB sitting in that area, cannot be made in certain pockets.
Should I be able to play safe by putting the OB on the side rail where the available corner pocket is too tight and (because of being a GC designed for larger pockets) has the wrong pocket face angle and thus the ball just will not go in? That's NOT part of the game...
Look I get it, there's that tough-guy, bad-ass syndrome that manifests in a sort of "mine is SMALLER than yours" when it comes to pockets. People wanting a tough table, challenging pockets...
I'm all for that, but only on a properly designed pocket. Most GC's, unless the rail has been modified via extension at the proper angles, which is hardly any of them in the real world, will play terrible. They will be double and triple shimmed junk that spits balls out.
They do ??
I played several hours in a match the other night at Hard Times in Bellflower on table #6. Even though the table definitely needs to be recovered, it was probably the best playing table I have ever been on. That includes my GCV. The tables at Hard Times are Ernesto tables.
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