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FranCrimi
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01-16-2018, 07:04 AM

Based on your diagram and comments: In effect, aren't you saying that if the back hand is past the base of the pendulum at impact, then it's possible that the straightness score will not be high. Doesn't that mean that cue elevation affects the player's straightness score?


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01-16-2018, 03:22 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
Based on your diagram and comments: In effect, aren't you saying that if the back hand is past the base of the pendulum at impact, then it's possible that the straightness score will not be high. Doesn't that mean that cue elevation affects the player's straightness score?
I was referring to static elevation.

You are using the word elevation to describe in a dynamic sense. In this case, yes it does affect the player's straightness score, because in order to put the cue into a different "elevation" during the forward stroke, a vertical force is applied by the hand to the but of the cue.

The DigiCue BLUE only measures a fraction of a second before impact. For a proper pendulum or piston stroke, there should be no vertical force applied by the hand at this time. After impact is when you want to finish your pendulum stroke by swinging your forearm upwards into your chest.

In other words, dive-bombing the cue ball with the tip is not good practice.


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01-16-2018, 03:42 PM

I tried it today with my arm swinging up and down ( raising my elbow and shoulder) and then delivering the cue. Then did it as level as i could looking in a mirror also and got a better score moving my arm everywhere. That straightness stat really does kill me. I did take it off for practice today which may be best but in my opinion in order to deliver great english to the ball shouldn't you have a level cue which straightness is where you need to score high???.... Im so confused lol.
  
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BC21
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01-16-2018, 04:24 PM

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Originally Posted by Hinekanman View Post
I tried it today with my arm swinging up and down ( raising my elbow and shoulder) and then delivering the cue. Then did it as level as i could looking in a mirror also and got a better score moving my arm everywhere. That straightness stat really does kill me. I did take it off for practice today which may be best but in my opinion in order to deliver great english to the ball shouldn't you have a level cue which straightness is where you need to score high???.... Im so confused lol.
The cue is never actually level or parallel to the table unless we are hitting high on the CB. I mean, the rail height prevents a perfectly level cue, and on shots where your cue is fully inside the rails, your knuckles would rub the cloth if you tried a level draw shot or even a level center cb hit. So that's not a realistic stroke goal.

I believe any stroke, be it pendulum or piston (which is so rare I don't think I've ever seen a true one), can produce a good straightness result with digicue. The key probably lies in the grip hand on that final stroke through the CB. You want to strive for sending the cue tip into the cb at the exact spot you intend to hit within 1mm, letting the cue stick do the work. That's a tight target, but a very worthy goal. Anyway, to me it feels like my grip hand is allowing the cue to flow correctly into the cb, rather than making it flow correctly, if that makes any sense.


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01-16-2018, 09:56 PM

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Originally Posted by BC21 View Post
The cue is never actually level or parallel to the table unless we are hitting high on the CB. I mean, the rail height prevents a perfectly level cue, and on shots where your cue is fully inside the rails, your knuckles would rub the cloth if you tried a level draw shot or even a level center cb hit. So that's not a realistic stroke goal.

I believe any stroke, be it pendulum or piston (which is so rare I don't think I've ever seen a true one), can produce a good straightness result with digicue. The key probably lies in the grip hand on that final stroke through the CB. You want to strive for sending the cue tip into the cb at the exact spot you intend to hit within 1mm, letting the cue stick do the work. That's a tight target, but a very worthy goal. Anyway, to me it feels like my grip hand is allowing the cue to flow correctly into the cb, rather than making it flow correctly, if that makes any sense.
This is all correct.

Don't worry about level or elevation. As long as your hand is not applying radial forces to the butt of the cue at the moment of impact, you should get a high score.


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01-17-2018, 08:39 AM

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Originally Posted by nataddrho View Post
This is all correct.

Don't worry about level or elevation. As long as your hand is not applying radial forces to the butt of the cue at the moment of impact, you should get a high score.
After 798 shots on the advanced level nearly all my straightness shots red-lined. My average was 6.87. From reading the above, maybe I need to deliver the que in a "throwing motion" in order to eliminate any radial force from my right stroking hand. I can usually green-line most of the other parameters but straightness escapes me for now. I want to follow this thread to try to figure out the flaw causing straightness red lining. Hope we can get more input here.
  
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01-17-2018, 08:54 AM

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Originally Posted by tableroll View Post
After 798 shots on the advanced level nearly all my straightness shots red-lined. My average was 6.87. From reading the above, maybe I need to deliver the que in a "throwing motion" in order to eliminate any radial force from my right stroking hand. I can usually green-line most of the other parameters but straightness escapes me for now. I want to follow this thread to try to figure out the flaw causing straightness red lining. Hope we can get more input here.
Are you going to the SBE? I'd be glad to show you in person.

I know that I can execute a pendulum stroke and get green on straightness. I should figure out how to better explain why.
I should also consider making a video on this because this is a common question.

Take a look at Jayson Shaw's scores.
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01-17-2018, 09:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nataddrho View Post
Are you going to the SBE? I'd be glad to show you in person.

I know that I can execute a pendulum stroke and get green on straightness. I should figure out how to better explain why.
I should also consider making a video on this because this is a common question.

Take a look at Jayson Shaw's scores.
Yes, please make a u tube video on straightness. I do not know what SBE stands for. Will you be going to the Texas 10 ball open in Round Rock at Skinny Bob's next month? I can make it there. I'm in San Antonio.
  
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01-17-2018, 10:25 AM

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Originally Posted by nataddrho View Post
Are you going to the SBE? I'd be glad to show you in person.

I know that I can execute a pendulum stroke and get green on straightness. I should figure out how to better explain why.
I should also consider making a video on this because this is a common question.

Take a look at Jayson Shaw's scores.
It would be interesting to me to know how many shots he took and if this is an average of all those shots.
  
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01-17-2018, 11:57 AM

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It would be interesting to me to know how many shots he took and if this is an average of all those shots.
SBE = Super Billiards Expo. No I won't be going to Texas.

Here is Jayson's Straightness histogram for 55 shots.
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01-17-2018, 12:17 PM

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Originally Posted by nataddrho View Post
...snip...

Take a look at Jayson Shaw's scores.
Shaw "finishes" for 2.496 seconds! I don't believe that! He's already shot the next 2 shots in that amount of time! I had to turn off my finish score, because it felt like an eternity staying down for even one second and was hard on my back.
  
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01-17-2018, 12:42 PM

I will be there i will have to check you out. Although i think i may have read this a little closer, you said radial force. Is that saying we are all basically twisting the stick when we stroke the cue? I as well am following this thread intently, hoping to get good info.
  
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01-17-2018, 02:45 PM

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Originally Posted by Hinekanman View Post
I will be there i will have to check you out. Although i think i may have read this a little closer, you said radial force. Is that saying we are all basically twisting the stick when we stroke the cue? I as well am following this thread intently, hoping to get good info.
After going to the expo and getting advice and instruction, would you mind posting what you learned. I am having a difficult time with this straightness thing. Thanks
  
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01-17-2018, 03:09 PM

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Originally Posted by tableroll View Post
After going to the expo and getting advice and instruction, would you mind posting what you learned. I am having a difficult time with this straightness thing. Thanks


I will do that but itís a a few months away I think. I was trying something. I tried that radial force. I had someone watch the points on my cue during the stroke and they said it turns slightly on the forward stroke. So consciously I tried not to do it and was able to have better straightness and my tip steer would give me right more which it was always left. So I mean I really have to mess with it more to understand what Iím actually doing.


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01-17-2018, 03:10 PM

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Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
Shaw "finishes" for 2.496 seconds! I don't believe that! He's already shot the next 2 shots in that amount of time! I had to turn off my finish score, because it felt like an eternity staying down for even one second and was hard on my back.
Nick, he finishes for longer. 2.5s is maxed out. Here is his histogram. BTW, hard on your back... Could be something to fix? You should be so comfortable in your shooting position that you could take a nap.
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