A family of drills based on running racks

iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
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And boy, you keep making up new ratings. N!? WTF is that? Its Banger, D, C, B, A, Open/Shortshop, Pro.

No offense Dr Dave, but you started playing pool too late. If you started as a teen and gambled your brains out, you would use the real terms;)
 
J

johnnysd

AzB Silver Member
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I think I would fall somewhere in the 10, 11, 12 range on the list. I am not very good, I tend to bounce around between 6/7 in 8 ball and 8/9 in 9 ball. My weakness is losing to much worse players when I have to give up a big spot.
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

Instructional Author
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iusedtoberich said:
Clarification, for #6, #8, do you run out your group (only) plus the 8 next and that is a win and its over? Or do you run out your group first, then the next group, and then the 8 to be a win?
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It is regular 8-ball rules. Run stripes or solids, and then the 8. That's it.
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

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Silver Member
iusedtoberich said:
And boy, you keep making up new ratings. N!? WTF is that? Its Banger, D, C, B, A, Open/Shortshop, Pro.

No offense Dr Dave, but you started playing pool too late. If you started as a teen and gambled your brains out, you would use the real terms;)
Click to expand...
Sorry, "Novice" (N) is insulting enough. I will not change it to "banger."

Regards,
Dave
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
*Edit I had some typos on which ones I thought were harder. Corrected.

My scores below. I'll upload the video later.

W 3-0 1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – never played (N-)
W 3-0 2. 6 balls, BIH on each shot – lower novice (N)
W 2-1 3. 6 balls, BIH after each 2 shots – mid novice (N+)
W 3-0 4. 6 balls, BIH after each 3 shots – upper novice (D-)
W 3-0. No way in hell a D will do this even 1 out of 3. 5. 6 balls, any order – lower beginner (D).
W 3-0 (I think this is easier than #5) 6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid beginner (D+)
L 1-2 (I think this is harder than #8) 7. 9 balls, any order – upper beginner (C-)
W 3-0 8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper intermediate (C)
W 2-1 9. 15 balls, in groups of 5, BIH after each group – lower intermediate (C+)
L 1-2 10. 6 balls, in order – mid intermediate (B-)
L 1-2 11. 15 balls, any order – lower advanced (B)
L 1-2 12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
L 0-3 13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – expert tournament player (A-)
L 1-2 14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – master semi pro (A)
L 0-3 15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – touring pro (A+/AA)
L 0-3 (I hit them super good the first rack and threatened) 16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)
 
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dr_dave

dr_dave

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Silver Member
iusedtoberich said:
*Edit I had some typos on which ones I thought were harder. Corrected.

My scores below. I'll upload the video later.

W 3-0 1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – never played (N-)
W 3-0 2. 6 balls, BIH on each shot – lower novice (N)
W 2-1 3. 6 balls, BIH after each 2 shots – mid novice (N+)
W 3-0 4. 6 balls, BIH after each 3 shots – upper novice (D-)
W 3-0. No way in hell a D will do this even 1 out of 3. 5. 6 balls, any order – lower beginner (D).
W 3-0 (I think this is easier than #5) 6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid beginner (D+)
L 1-2 (I think this is harder than #8) 7. 9 balls, any order – upper beginner (C-)
W 3-0 8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper intermediate (C)
W 2-1 9. 15 balls, in groups of 5, BIH after each group – lower intermediate (C+)
L 1-2 10. 6 balls, in order – mid intermediate (B-)
L 1-2 11. 15 balls, any order – lower advanced (B)
L 1-2 12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
L 0-3 13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – expert tournament player (A-)
L 1-2 14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – master semi pro (A)
L 0-3 15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – touring pro (A+/AA)
L 0-3 (I hit them super good the first rack and threatened) 16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)
Click to expand...
Thank you for the input! I agree with your comments. Bob and I discussed things and settled on the new version below, which I think addresses your concerns and makes all of the lower levels a little easier. Being able to take the extra BIHs when you want can be very helpful. It might also involve more strategic thinking, which we like. There is still BIH after the break on every level.

1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – lower novice
2. 6 balls, any order, BIH on every shot – mid novice
3. 6 balls, any order, 3 extra BIHs – upper novice
4. 6 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – lower beginner (D-)
5. 6 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – mid beginner (D)
6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper beginner (D+)
7. 9 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – lower intermediate (C-)
8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid intermediate (C)
9. 15 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – upper intermediate (C+)
10. 6 balls, in order – lower advanced (B-)
11. 15 balls, any order – mid advanced (B)
12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – lower shortstop (A-)
14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – upper shortstop (A)
15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – semipro / pro (A+/AA)
16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)

I hope others try it out and give us more feedback before we set it in stone.

Thanks again,
Dave
 
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iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I will try to upload the video tonight, had to go to the day job today:(

I like the change to "take BIH as you need it X amount of times". My brain got confused remembering where I was and when to take the BIH, especially the racks with all 15 balls and taking it every 5 balls. And this will eliminate the question of is it BIH when 10 are remaining, and then 5 remaining, or is it BIH every 5 shots. They won't align if balls went in on the break or multiple balls went in on one shot.
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

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dr_dave said:
There is still BIH after the break on every level.

1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – lower novice
2. 6 balls, any order, BIH on every shot – mid novice
3. 6 balls, any order, 3 extra BIHs – upper novice
4. 6 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – lower beginner (D-)
5. 6 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – mid beginner (D)
6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper beginner (D+)
7. 9 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – lower intermediate (C-)
8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid intermediate (C)
9. 15 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – upper intermediate (C+)
10. 6 balls, in order – lower advanced (B-)
11. 15 balls, any order – mid advanced (B)
12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – lower shortstop (A-)
14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – upper shortstop (A)
15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – pro (A+/AA)
16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)

I hope others try it out and give us more feedback before we set it in stone.
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Everybody, please let us know what you think of the new list and ratings. And please try out the levels if you have access to a table. I plan to finish up the document and video over the next couple of days, so any input would be helpful.

Thanks,
Dave
 
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J

johnnysd

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
dr_dave said:
Everybody, please let us know what you think of the new list and ratings. And please try out the levels if you have access to a table. I plan to finish up the document and video over the next couple of days, so any input would be helpful.

Thanks,
Dave
Click to expand...

Is 8 ball last in the 15 balls 8 ball rules?
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
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Here is my video. All on the first go, each drill best of 3. Video sped tremendously for sanity. Given enough tries, I'm certain I could do all of the drills 3-0 (individually, not sequentially), except the last two.

https://youtu.be/IDqPBUSCfo0
 
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dr_dave

dr_dave

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iusedtoberich said:
Here is my video. All on the first go, each drill best of 3. Video sped tremendously for sanity. Given enough tries, I'm certain I could do all of the drills 3-0 (individual, not sequentially), except the last two.

https://youtu.be/IDqPBUSCfo0
Click to expand...
Thanks for posting that.

Any more comments or suggestions on the new list or the supporting document?

1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – lower novice
2. 6 balls, any order, BIH on every shot – mid novice
3. 6 balls, any order, 3 extra BIHs – upper novice
4. 6 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – lower beginner (D-)
5. 6 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – mid beginner (D)
6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper beginner (D+)
7. 9 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – lower intermediate (C-)
8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid intermediate (C)
9. 15 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – upper intermediate (C+)
10. 6 balls, in order – lower advanced (B-)
11. 15 balls, any order – mid advanced (B)
12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – lower shortstop (A-)
14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – upper shortstop (A)
15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – pro (A+/AA)
16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)

Thanks again for your input and participation,
Dave
 
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iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
dr_dave said:
Thanks for posting that.

Any more comments or suggestions on the new list or the supporting document?

1. 6 balls, pocket OBs directly with no CB – lower novice
2. 6 balls, any order, BIH on every shot – mid novice
3. 6 balls, any order, 3 extra BIHs – upper novice
4. 6 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – lower beginner (D-)
5. 6 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – mid beginner (D)
6. 6 balls+8 (3 solids, 3 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – upper beginner (D+)
7. 9 balls, any order, 1 extra BIH – lower intermediate (C-)
8. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules – mid intermediate (C)
9. 15 balls, any order, 2 extra BIHs – upper intermediate (C+)
10. 6 balls, in order – lower advanced (B-)
11. 15 balls, any order – mid advanced (B)
12. 15 balls, 8-ball rules – upper advanced (B+)
13. 9 balls (4 solids, 4 stripes, 8), 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – expert tournament player (A-)
14. 9 balls, 9-ball rules – master semi pro (A)
15. 15 balls, 8-ball rules, then remaining balls in order – touring pro (A+/AA)
16. 15 balls, in order – world class pro (A++/AAA)

Thanks again for your input and participation,
Dave
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The document looks good, easy to follow. Levels 12 and 13, I'm not convinced which one is harder. I think a few of us would have to do each 10 times for a consensus, IMO. I'm leaning towards 12 might be harder, but I only did each 3 times... What were your scores on 12 and 13? What were Bob's scores on 12 and 13?

General feedback, I don't know what the motivation was for this. It seems to be ok, but its complicated as well. I don't know why you just didn't do simple ghosts. 1 ball ghost. 2 ball ghost. 3 ball ghost. 4 ball ghost. All the way to 15 ball ghost. Then the setup and explanation of the rules is dirt simple, and are the same for each level. I don't think you will have much participation for this reason.
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

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iusedtoberich said:
The document looks good, easy to follow.
Click to expand...
Thanks.

iusedtoberich said:
Levels 12 and 13, I'm not convinced which one is harder. I think a few of us would have to do each 10 times for a consensus, IMO. I'm leaning towards 12 might be harder, but I only did each 3 times... What were your scores on 12 and 13? What were Bob's scores on 12 and 13?
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Bob doesn't have access to a table so he wasn't able to run through them. Based on all of my practice so far, the order is correct, but I suspect it will depend on the player and their strengths.

iusedtoberich said:
General feedback, I don't know what the motivation was for this. It seems to be ok, but its complicated as well. I don't know why you just didn't do simple ghosts. 1 ball ghost. 2 ball ghost. 3 ball ghost. 4 ball ghost. All the way to 15 ball ghost. Then the setup and explanation of the rules is dirt simple, and are the same for each level. I don't think you will have much participation for this reason.
Click to expand...
I'll let Bob respond to this.

Personally, I think the system is great and I look forward to using it during our BU Summer School Boot Camps, because it is a fun way to evaluate everybody regardless of their playing level. In the past, we have used BU Exam I for this with the whole group while I pulled off individuals to film for later video analysis. BU Exam I tests all important fundamental skills, but it can be very frustrating and unsatisfying for less-skilled players. RDS will be much better and more fun for everybody.

Regards,
Dave
 
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iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
dr_dave said:
Thanks.

Bob doesn't have access to a table so he wasn't able to run through them. Based on all of my practice so far, the order is correct, but I suspect it will depend on the player and their strengths.

I'll let Bob respond to this.

Personally, I think the system is great and I look forward to using it during our BU Summer School Boot Camps, because it is a fun way to evaluate everybody regardless of their playing level. In the past, we have used BU Exam I for this with the whole group while I pulled off individuals to film for later video analysis. BU Exam I tests all important fundamental skills, but it can be very frustrating and not satisfying for less-skilled players. RDS will be much better and more fun for everybody.

Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...

I will say this is a truer test of one's skills than the current BU series, because this is all random. You can't "memorize the drill and patterns".

That said, I'm probably the king of repeating the exact same layouts over and over and over and over, and surprisingly, sometimes after doing it 40 times the score is similar to the first time, in my experience.
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

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iusedtoberich said:
I will say this is a truer test of one's skills than the current BU series, because this is all random. You can't "memorize the drill and patterns".
Click to expand...
I agree; although, BU Exams I and II still require consistent and accurate execution to score highly. That is still a fun and useful challenge.

BTW, one reason why I like RDS over a simple progressive rotation ghost drill is RDS provides challenges and tests in 8-ball, 9-ball, and straight pool.

Regards,
Dave
 
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