Taking Money From A Kid

Pidge · Sep 15, 2015

A bit of a frowned upon subject in these parts but I want your thoughts on playing kids for money. A situation arose yesterday where I played a 15 year old for a bit of money. All these local types were hyping this kid up saying he is a future snooker star and how he makes centuries for fun so I asked the kid if he wanted a game. He had a sort of big fish in a small pond attitude and thought he was better than what he was. Don't get me wrong, he was a good junior player but wasn't going to improve any further without excellent guidance. So, we played a frame of snooker and I was chatting with his dad and uncle throughout and the topic of him playing me for money came up. His dad said we should play the best of 13 frames for 500, and an extra 50 for every frame difference there was. We agreed on some T&C's and the kid got a 2 frame advantage and a free ball each frame. It didn't help him much and it ended with him losing 7-3. Afterwards the kids dad paid up and I offered to give him some much needed advice. Technically he was solid but lacked experience and made some wrong decisions so I was setting up shots he played wrong against me and was showing him how I would have played them. The kid didn't want to know. He was adamant his way was the best. At this point I thought eff it, I'm out.

Afterwards I can't help but feel bad about taking money off a kid who never stood a chance, that's why I offered my advice to try and sort of give setting back. See it as a very expensive lesson if you will. I know it was his dad's money he was playing with and his dad didn't seem at all bothered. He was actually very grateful of me offering advice. I left the dad my phone number and told him once his son got over it to give me a call and we can arrange some sparring sessions and I'll try show him a thing or two. I would normally just take the money and call it a day but I felt guilty. I'm sure I'll get over it.

Anyone ever had similar experiences?

RiverCity · Sep 15, 2015

You didnt take money from the kid directly. You wagered with the father and uncle. Sure, they probably beat the shite out of him when they got home, fed him dog food, then threw away his shoes......... but you didnt place the bet with the kid.
So rest easy........ :thumbup:

If I gamble with a "kid", its for a soda with them getting a big spot, and thats only if Im sure it wont break the kid (financially or in spirit).

ktrepal85 · Sep 15, 2015

I like this post. I think it's okay since his dad was there. If it was just the kid being stupid and you're an obvious lock I think it's unethical.

A friend of mine who is in his late 20's now said when he was 15 he lost $750 to an 50 year old guy at the pool hall who he was "friends" with. I know this guy and to this day I think he is a piece of crap for doing that.

Every situation is different though...

I personally feel guilty taking money from most people b/c most people I play are struggling financially. However I only play for $20 sets most of the time. I'll usually just cut them a break at the end and just have them pay the table time or whatever. I'm nicer than most though.

Ken_4fun · Sep 15, 2015

Gambling with the kid

If you hadn't taken their money they would have given it to someone else.

If I was you, I wouldn't give it a second thought and sleep like a baby.

When I first moved to Paducah, there was a kid there that wanted to gamble. I knew he didn't have much money, but he wanted to play so we gambled. He was probably 14-15 or so. Nobody knew me and I sure as hell didn't know him. I think we pretty much broke even the first time we played, even though everyone was wanting the kid to beat me and expected him to.

That "kid's" name is Skyler Woodward....

His rate of improvement was LEAPS, and I pretty much stayed about the same skill level.

I learned that I couldn't play anymore 9-ball or 10-ball with the youngster and tried to trap him playing one-pocket. He avoided playing that, so we gambled less and less.

That's one reason I am such a fan, I have seen him play as bad as I do (years ago), and I have seen him play like a true champion (now).

(And he is a good guy)

Ken

bbb · Sep 15, 2015

pidge
dont feel guilty
#1 you bet with his dad
#2 based on the kids attitude im not sure i would go out of the way to help him
you tried
#3 if the kid won do you think they would feel guilty
or if the kid was keith mcready or a young shannon daulton where they were robbing you do you think they would feel guilty
#4 really you did the kid and his dad a favor by showing them the kid is nowhere ready to play with "the big boys"
for $500 that was a good deal for them...

M.G. · Sep 15, 2015

Trust your instincts that something wasn't right and don't buy into that "if not you somebody else would've done it".

"If I hadn't shot him he would've died of a heart attack 5 years later" is just about the same logic.

... and simply don't do it again.

Cheers,
M

Donny Lutz · Sep 15, 2015

Or...

Chuck Fields said:
You didnt take money from the kid directly. You wagered with the father and uncle. Sure, they probably beat the shite out of him when they got home, fed him dog food, then threw away his shoes......... but you didnt place the bet with the kid.
So rest easy........ :thumbup:

If I gamble with a "kid", its for a soda with them getting a big spot, and thats only if Im sure it wont break the kid (financially or in spirit).

Or, on the other side of the issue...

In the early '60s (when I was in my twenties), I lost my entire paycheck to a 16-year-old kid.

slide13 · Sep 15, 2015

If everything had happened the same way without dad and uncle being there I'd say it was on the wrong side of the ethical line...but with their presence they were really just backing their kid and they put him into action and you're really taking the dad's money. I wouldn't have a seconds doubt about doing that myself. Sounds like they needed to learn some humility anyway.

michael4 · Sep 15, 2015

bbb said:
pidge
dont feel guilty
#1 you bet with his dad
#2 based on the kids attitude im not sure i would go out of the way to help him
you tried
#3 if the kid won do you think they would feel guilty
or if the kid was keith mcready or a young shannon daulton where they were robbing you do you think they would feel guilty
#4 really you did the kid and his dad a favor by showing them the kid is nowhere ready to play with "the big boys"
for $500 that was a good deal for them...

^^^ this, plus you gave the kid a spot, and it seems like the gamble was Dad's idea.....(Dad was trying to make money off his kid's talent)

SakuJack · Sep 15, 2015

I think you're okay here.

With that amount of money involved, it it were just the kid on his own I would say you were a bit out of line. But as it seems like it was effectively his dad making the bet, I don't see a problem with it. And from what you've said, his dad seemed okay with it and appreciated the offer of some friendly sessions in the future.

To those criticising the kid's attitude, come on. He's 15 years old and has just had his pride bruised. I'm sure we've all been there in some way or other.

Pidge said:
Anyone ever had similar experiences?

To be honest, I'm not a big fan of betting on pool in general (probably because most 15-year-olds are better than me, lol). I wouldn't bet if I were playing football, or tennis, or running with someone, or taking part in any other hobby that doesn't inherently involve betting (e.g. certain card games), and I don't really get anything from it on a personal level.

In the past I have ended up betting with friends who don't really play - the games generally involving silly spots - and I always felt bad when I knew they were in a game where they never really stood a chance but couldn't see it, so I suppose I can relate in some way.

Like I said before, though, I don't think you did anything wrong in this situation.

lfigueroa · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge said:
A bit of a frowned upon subject in these parts but I want your thoughts on playing kids for money. A situation arose yesterday where I played a 15 year old for a bit of money. All these local types were hyping this kid up saying he is a future snooker star and how he makes centuries for fun so I asked the kid if he wanted a game. He had a sort of big fish in a small pond attitude and thought he was better than what he was. Don't get me wrong, he was a good junior player but wasn't going to improve any further without excellent guidance. So, we played a frame of snooker and I was chatting with his dad and uncle throughout and the topic of him playing me for money came up. His dad said we should play the best of 13 frames for 500, and an extra 50 for every frame difference there was. We agreed on some T&C's and the kid got a 2 frame advantage and a free ball each frame. It didn't help him much and it ended with him losing 7-3. Afterwards the kids dad paid up and I offered to give him some much needed advice. Technically he was solid but lacked experience and made some wrong decisions so I was setting up shots he played wrong against me and was showing him how I would have played them. The kid didn't want to know. He was adamant his way was the best. At this point I thought eff it, I'm out.

Afterwards I can't help but feel bad about taking money off a kid who never stood a chance, that's why I offered my advice to try and sort of give setting back. See it as a very expensive lesson if you will. I know it was his dad's money he was playing with and his dad didn't seem at all bothered. He was actually very grateful of me offering advice. I left the dad my phone number and told him once his son got over it to give me a call and we can arrange some sparring sessions and I'll try show him a thing or two. I would normally just take the money and call it a day but I felt guilty. I'm sure I'll get over it.

Anyone ever had similar experiences?

A-OK in my book. Dad was there actively engaged and you offered sage counsel post match.

Besides, beyond playing skill, being able to detect small but critical qualities in play is a hard won skill that often goes under-appreciated. You deserve to get paid on both counts.

Lou Figueroa

TATE · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge said:
A bit of a frowned upon subject in these parts but I want your thoughts on playing kids for money. A situation arose yesterday where I played a 15 year old for a bit of money. All these local types were hyping this kid up saying he is a future snooker star and how he makes centuries for fun so I asked the kid if he wanted a game. He had a sort of big fish in a small pond attitude and thought he was better than what he was. Don't get me wrong, he was a good junior player but wasn't going to improve any further without excellent guidance. So, we played a frame of snooker and I was chatting with his dad and uncle throughout and the topic of him playing me for money came up. His dad said we should play the best of 13 frames for 500, and an extra 50 for every frame difference there was. We agreed on some T&C's and the kid got a 2 frame advantage and a free ball each frame. It didn't help him much and it ended with him losing 7-3. Afterwards the kids dad paid up and I offered to give him some much needed advice. Technically he was solid but lacked experience and made some wrong decisions so I was setting up shots he played wrong against me and was showing him how I would have played them. The kid didn't want to know. He was adamant his way was the best. At this point I thought eff it, I'm out.

Afterwards I can't help but feel bad about taking money off a kid who never stood a chance, that's why I offered my advice to try and sort of give setting back. See it as a very expensive lesson if you will. I know it was his dad's money he was playing with and his dad didn't seem at all bothered. He was actually very grateful of me offering advice. I left the dad my phone number and told him once his son got over it to give me a call and we can arrange some sparring sessions and I'll try show him a thing or two. I would normally just take the money and call it a day but I felt guilty. I'm sure I'll get over it.

Anyone ever had similar experiences?

I would pose this question: Would you feel guilty if you had lost the 500 to him?

How about if afterward he pointed out your every poor decision?

wahcheck · Sep 15, 2015

grassinton?

I'm assuming you are in England; so I don't know what you mean by "500"
and I'm assuming it isn't US dollars, but it SEEMS like a lot of money to bet for the first match against a 15 yr. old....but again I don't know what you mean by "500".......

As others have said, you bet the adults, not the kid....

I normally would not bet a 15 yr. old kid unless he initiated it and it was for a small amount.

Assuming I beat him the first set, I probably wouldn't take it any further to make any money, just maybe show him where he's at.....

Tramp Steamer · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge, you did a terrible thing and will probably burn in hell for it.
No, seriously, you contributed to the delinquency of a minor, and as a responsible adult you have an obligation to set a much higher standard than what you did.
I suggest nine Hail Mary's, and a week of abstinence from any, and all, adult beverages.
I hope I have been of some assistance. Your pal, Tramp.

P.S. These yahoos who think that just because the kid's father was there makes everything is alright, are beyond sad.

Pidge · Sep 15, 2015

TATE said:
I would pose this question: Would you feel guilty if you had lost the 500 to him?

How about if afterward he pointed out your every poor decision?

No, I wouldn't feel any guilt. I'd be glad for the kid that he just made some money and I would urge the kid to look at the game as a chance to make a very nice living on the pro circuit so keep up the practice. When ever I lose to someone, or beat them for that matter and they choose to talk about certain shots I played poorly or differently to them I take it on board and learn from it.

actionplayer · Sep 15, 2015

It's tough
On the same note
There was a "kid" on the pool hall he bought a year pass so was in there every day playing
He was an ok shooter but struggled with knowledge
He played for 5 an 10' game to learn an he got to b player
Heavy on the drink after my night playing he was wanting to play 9 ball
I didn't want no part then he said 400 a set

I still didn't like it but my friend did and he gave up a spot too big and lost 2 sets
The kid then got into one pocket and we started playing 20 a game I givibg up 10-6
He really needed 11-5

We went back m forth
Random day later he wants to play even one pocket race to 8 and he gets 4 games on wire for 600
I accepted and torched him 7-0 before he quit
Comes back minutes later double or quits race to 5 he gets one on the wire 11-6
I agree and win 2 sets
The money was posted so I got it
He ran out and was crying outsidi felt bad
He had some hard stories an times going through
I gave him the last set back so he wasn't broke

Not sure if right ir wrong move but I think was

alstl · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge said:
A bit of a frowned upon subject in these parts but I want your thoughts on playing kids for money. A situation arose yesterday where I played a 15 year old for a bit of money. All these local types were hyping this kid up saying he is a future snooker star and how he makes centuries for fun so I asked the kid if he wanted a game. He had a sort of big fish in a small pond attitude and thought he was better than what he was. Don't get me wrong, he was a good junior player but wasn't going to improve any further without excellent guidance. So, we played a frame of snooker and I was chatting with his dad and uncle throughout and the topic of him playing me for money came up. His dad said we should play the best of 13 frames for 500, and an extra 50 for every frame difference there was. We agreed on some T&C's and the kid got a 2 frame advantage and a free ball each frame. It didn't help him much and it ended with him losing 7-3. Afterwards the kids dad paid up and I offered to give him some much needed advice. Technically he was solid but lacked experience and made some wrong decisions so I was setting up shots he played wrong against me and was showing him how I would have played them. The kid didn't want to know. He was adamant his way was the best. At this point I thought eff it, I'm out.

Afterwards I can't help but feel bad about taking money off a kid who never stood a chance, that's why I offered my advice to try and sort of give setting back. See it as a very expensive lesson if you will. I know it was his dad's money he was playing with and his dad didn't seem at all bothered. He was actually very grateful of me offering advice. I left the dad my phone number and told him once his son got over it to give me a call and we can arrange some sparring sessions and I'll try show him a thing or two. I would normally just take the money and call it a day but I felt guilty. I'm sure I'll get over it.

Anyone ever had similar experiences?

What is a free ball?

RiverCity · Sep 15, 2015

alstl said:
What is a free ball?

Same thing........

e7b275b0bf3e4577cd876eb502bc5443bc600b5d60743c51c5a1fdf6148eac6c.jpg

Ron Swanson · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge said:
No, I wouldn't feel any guilt. I'd be glad for the kid that he just made some money and I would urge the kid to look at the game as a chance to make a very nice living on the pro circuit so keep up the practice. When ever I lose to someone, or beat them for that matter and they choose to talk about certain shots I played poorly or differently to them I take it on board and learn from it.

Have you ever had that, though? I don't know a single player who ever talks about any shot not of their own. Proper pisses me off, that.

Ron Swanson · Sep 15, 2015

Pidge said:
A bit of a frowned upon subject in these parts but I want your thoughts on playing kids for money. A situation arose yesterday where I played a 15 year old for a bit of money. All these local types were hyping this kid up saying he is a future snooker star and how he makes centuries for fun so I asked the kid if he wanted a game. He had a sort of big fish in a small pond attitude and thought he was better than what he was. Don't get me wrong, he was a good junior player but wasn't going to improve any further without excellent guidance. So, we played a frame of snooker and I was chatting with his dad and uncle throughout and the topic of him playing me for money came up. His dad said we should play the best of 13 frames for 500, and an extra 50 for every frame difference there was. We agreed on some T&C's and the kid got a 2 frame advantage and a free ball each frame. It didn't help him much and it ended with him losing 7-3. Afterwards the kids dad paid up and I offered to give him some much needed advice. Technically he was solid but lacked experience and made some wrong decisions so I was setting up shots he played wrong against me and was showing him how I would have played them. The kid didn't want to know. He was adamant his way was the best. At this point I thought eff it, I'm out.

Afterwards I can't help but feel bad about taking money off a kid who never stood a chance, that's why I offered my advice to try and sort of give setting back. See it as a very expensive lesson if you will. I know it was his dad's money he was playing with and his dad didn't seem at all bothered. He was actually very grateful of me offering advice. I left the dad my phone number and told him once his son got over it to give me a call and we can arrange some sparring sessions and I'll try show him a thing or two. I would normally just take the money and call it a day but I felt guilty. I'm sure I'll get over it.

Anyone ever had similar experiences?

What do you mean one free ball each frame?

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