OB plus or Z2 or S Tuned shafts

SuperLue

Registered
Hi,

I am currently playing with a Predator icon2-6 cue with a z2 shaft. My skill level is an APA high 5 to 6. Once winter comes around I was thinking about either buying the OB2 plus shaft or buying one of the z2 S-Tuned shafts. I was hoping to get some pros and cons about both if anyone has tried them and maybe getting some pros and cons about going with a 29 or 30 inch length. All feedback would be appreciated.

Lue
 

anbukev

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm currently playing with the Z2 S-Tuned shaft and I highly recommend it if you prefer a pro taper rather than a conical taper. It plays the same as the regular Z2 so it's all about which taper you prefer. I'm hoping OB gives us taper options in the future.
 

SuperLue

Registered
Thanx for the info. I was wondering if there was much of a difference when it came to play. I am pretty sure the OB Plus Pro is with a pro taper but they dont offer it with the wood ferrul.
 

trinacria

in efren we trust
Silver Member
OB plus pro is a conical taper. and if you want an Z2 S tuned shaft I'll save you money and just get your z2 retapred for 30 dollars. Ofcourse im not telling you how to spend your money, but if you are willing to buy a new one I recomend buying an OB+ pro from seyberts and tell them to tune it for you. the new predator shafts are guaranteed to warp as they come from china. just my ¢.02
 

RBC

Deceased
Thanx for the info. I was wondering if there was much of a difference when it came to play. I am pretty sure the OB Plus Pro is with a pro taper but they dont offer it with the wood ferrul.

Take a look at the different shaft descriptions on this page:

http://www.obcues.com/categories/NEW-OB-Plus-Shafts/


You'll see the types of hit, cue ball deflection, tapers, and ferrules broken down by the different models.

The Pro+ is a modified conical taper. The OB-2+ is the same taper, but with the laminated maple ferrule.


Royce
 

SuperLue

Registered
I dont think taper would really be an issue for me. Although I never tried a pro taper I dont think it would make a difference in my play. I just prefer the smaller diameter. Im kind of leaning towards the new OB plus shafts but since im not gonna buy until winter figured i would try to find as much opinions from others as I can until Im ready to buy one. Thanx for all the feedback so far
 

i8ap4t

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think re-tapering a shaft is killing what the maker wanted the shaft to be in the first place.

I recommend you get an OB + pro. Not only do you not have any of the predator issues, but it also feels, and plays better.
 

SuperLue

Registered
I think re-tapering a shaft is killing what the maker wanted the shaft to be in the first place.

I recommend you get an OB + pro. Not only do you not have any of the predator issues, but it also feels, and plays better.


Is there a difference in play in the tapers?
 

SuperLue

Registered
thanks Royce. Could you tell me the big difference between the pro and OB2? I saw one is a crisp hit and other is a quite hit but not sure what that means.

Thanx

Lue
 

RBC

Deceased
thanks Royce. Could you tell me the big difference between the pro and OB2? I saw one is a crisp hit and other is a quite hit but not sure what that means.

Thanx

Lue


Lue

Well, if it's not coming to you now, it's kind of hard to describe.

Imagine hitting 2 pillows together. This would be soft on impact.

Imagine 2 hammer heads together (don't actually do this!). This would be hard on impact.


I hope that helps!

Royce
 

trinacria

in efren we trust
Silver Member
Take a look at the different shaft descriptions on this page:

http://www.obcues.com/categories/NEW-OB-Plus-Shafts/


You'll see the types of hit, cue ball deflection, tapers, and ferrules broken down by the different models.

The Pro+ is a modified conical taper. The OB-2+ is the same taper, but with the laminated maple ferrule.


Royce

how is it modified?? I can't find a description of the taper. I knew it felt different but I thought it was the maple, it feels thicker too.
 

RBC

Deceased
how is it modified?? I can't find a description of the taper. I knew it felt different but I thought it was the maple, it feels thicker too.

The taper on both the OB-2+ and the Pro+ are the same. It's called a modified conical taper because it's not completely conical. Basically, we take the normal taper on our OB-1+ and Classic+, and we taper it down the last 11" to reach the smaller tip diameter. The general diameter in the bridge area is about the same on both tapers.


I hope that helps!

Royce
 

ddadams

Absolutely love this cue.
Silver Member
I'd get an OB shaft over ANY Predator shaft, period.

The new OB Plus line looks extremely promising as an upgrade to an already PHENOMENAL product.

Shane from OB on here told me they're even OK to break with now.... Is that true Royce?

I was asking about the OB Classic +. Is the Classic Pro+ ok, and the others as well?

I need to get some $$ together to get a new + shaft. I LOVE the products you put out.
 

trinacria

in efren we trust
Silver Member
The taper on both the OB-2+ and the Pro+ are the same. It's called a modified conical taper because it's not completely conical. Basically, we take the normal taper on our OB-1+ and Classic+, and we taper it down the last 11" to reach the smaller tip diameter. The general diameter in the bridge area is about the same on both tapers.


I hope that helps!

Royce

ty for the response, its a big help. I have one more, sry. The new ferrule and construction is fine without the fiber-pad? I only ask bc when I bought mine I asked for a tip upgrade and seyberts send it to me without one. Seyberts has always been top notch with everything, is this an oversight or is it fine.
 

RBC

Deceased
ty for the response, its a big help. I have one more, sry. The new ferrule and construction is fine without the fiber-pad? I only ask bc when I bought mine I asked for a tip upgrade and seyberts send it to me without one. Seyberts has always been top notch with everything, is this an oversight or is it fine.

Actually, yes and no. lol:D

On both the Classic+ and the Pro+ we have incorporated the Carbon Fiber pad into the ferrule. Yes, it's there. It's just inside the ferrule right under the tip.

We've accounted for all maintenance and repair issues, so it is really hard to mess it up from a repair stand point. We should have instructions out soon that give a little more detail. Basically, if you cut away the tip, you'll see the outer ring of the ferrule with the rest being the carbon fiber pad. Replacing the tip means just cutting off the old one, and putting on the new one. Really simple.

The only possible issue is if the repair person cuts too much off the end of the ferrule. Effectively shortening the ferrule. This really isn't necessary as there are many ways to prepare the end of the ferrule for a new tip that don't include cutting some of the ferrule away. But, just in case, we've put in a "thickness indicator" in the pad. This indicator is a hole that is only exposed if the ferrule and pad are shortened too much. So, if the hole is exposed, it's time for a new ferrule and pad. Really simple. Parts are available, and the procedures are such that it's an easy cuesmith or repair person job.

The OB-1+ and the OB-2+ have not changed, so they are still serviced the same way as before.

Watch the website for more information. We're putting together some graphics to show the insides a little better.

Royce
 

Donkin the 8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
having owned both s tuned and ob2+ I would definitely recommend going with the ob. better feel and higher quality all around. I do however prefer the taper on the s tuned. id talk to seyberts and see if they will taper on ob2+ or ob classic pro+ the same way they do the s tuned's
 

Papa Red

Love it or Leave
Silver Member
thanks Royce. Could you tell me the big difference between the pro and OB2? I saw one is a crisp hit and other is a quite hit but not sure what that means.

Thanx

Lue

Lue

Well, if it's not coming to you now, it's kind of hard to describe.

Imagine hitting 2 pillows together. This would be soft on impact.

Imagine 2 hammer heads together (don't actually do this!). This would be hard on impact.


I hope that helps!

Royce

Here is the way I describe it: I just ordered 2/OB-2 Plus & 2/Pro Plus shafts. I use the OB-2 Plus for the 7ft Diamond tables (or extreamly fast 8ft.) for the softer hit because you don't have to hit the cue ball very hard where finess and speed control is the key. I use the Pro Plus on Valley tables with heavy cue balls and on larger tables where you need a more firmer hit to move the cue ball better for distance without hitting it harder.

What I'm saying is the OB-2 Plus dampens the hit and the Pro Plus is a solid hit with the same stroke and power. I know some will disagree but for me to change the shaft is easier to increase or decrease the power of the stroke than changing the power stroke.

Have you ever heard the term saying he has a bar table stroke or he has a big table stroke. But champions only have one stroke.
 

TrumanHW

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I feel like my options are giant 12.75mm with pro-taper... or 11.75 with straight taper. I like a small tip with a pro-taper...

Of course, I can probably get used to something different, but what physics justify this dichotomy?

Are there any disadvantages to a constructed shaft vs. a solid shaft?

Also, (and I'd love OB to reply here, as well as Mezz and Predator) -- has anyone taken a robot and done tests?? Recently?
 

Gorramjayne

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Necro'd this thread...

Dichotomy is because pro-tapers on skinny tips can be whippy and amplify unintended spin, and can be more prone to warping. There are options, however.

Small tip pro tapers

Lucasi's Hybrid Slim shaft is 11.75mm with a short pro-taper with a very gentle taper rise, Feels every bit as comfortable to stroke as a long pro-taper but not whippy at all. My main playing shaft right now. (Websites refer to it as a 'euro slim' taper -- it's not)

Katana Bushido 11.5mm tip immediately tapers to 12mm, then that 12mm diameter pro taper runs for another 14 in, for a good stiff hit. As far as skinny shafts go, it's unusually easy to load up a shot with power and trust everything will still go according to plan. Really like that shaft.

615uaBCqRKL._SL256_.jpg


Pechauer P+ lite is 11.75mm with a very long pro taper, but whippy as all hell. Very punishing when cuing over obstacle balls and rails or long straight slow-rolls.

Seyberts S-tuned Z shafts are Predator Zs taken down to pro tapers. Haven't gotten to shoot with one (I've owned all the above) but I'm skeptical anything could be worth what that shaft costs...




Solid v. laminated

Laminated ostensibly resists warping and provides radial consistency

Although, I really doubt the real world impact of 'radial consistency' is going to actually show up in any significant way for a skinny shaft engineered to be LD anyway. Most laminated shafts are designed to be LD, but plenty of solid wood shafts have LD ferrules or hollow front-ends. I had a Mezz WX900 which is solid wood and it had very, very low deflection already so the effects of 'radial consistency' were unimportant - hated the steep rise of the conical taper though.

Radial consistency might be more of a factor for 13mm shafts.

Main gripe people usually give is that laminated shafts have less feel and feedback, or a muted hit. It's hard to know if that's from being laminated or the fact that most laminated shafts have other LD features, such as carbon fiber sections or foam somewhere inside the shaft. FWIW, I have found that the less 'pie sections' a laminated shaft has, the less can go wrong with it and the better the hit feels, but this is based on observation rather than scientific data. I think 6-8 pie sections is plenty. One crazy company has a shaft with 64 pie sections... I though that was called 'plywood'....


Do you need LD?

Since you like skinny shafts anyway, you might not need a tech-packed LD shaft. A more traditional 12mm shaft of solid maple, by virtue of being skinny, will have slightly reduced deflection.

What doesn't get talked about enough is that LD shafts do have their disadvantages -- a traditional-deflection shaft actually has some self-correcting properties if you fudge your stroke a little bit. Just like backhand/pivot english, a slight error as you come through the CB with a traditional shaft can squirt the ball a little bit back onto your intended line. LD shafts don't, so they can punish even little mistakes. Skinny LD shafts particularly can cause you to have to concentrate a little harder when you're in a difficult cuing position or shooting a very long straight rolling shot.

Skinny LD shafts can make it difficult to precisely stun a ball at long distances. That CB squirt off-line when using sidespin that everybody wants to avoid these days? It's because the front-end-mass is driving the CB away from the tip. The same effect happens when you're hitting low-center CB with a normal shaft, except instead of pushing the CB to the side, pushes the CB forward and across the cloth rather than down into it. Skinny LD shafts won't give the CB the same starting push across the cloth when drawing, so when using backspin, the CB experiences more friction with the cloth to start off with, and slightly less forward speed, so you have to start with more backspin and/or a harder shot so the CB arrives on target with the right backspin/skid before friction kills the spin on a long shot or slow table.

Jumps and aggressive close-in masse can be a little bit difficult, as driving the CB hard into the slate requires extra effort with LD shafts. I do find, however, that skinny LDs are very good for predictable semi-masse once you know your shaft and the cloth of the table, as long as you aren't too close to the obstacle you're going around.

Skinny LDs are good when you need to put a lot of spin on a close-in shot and really control where the CB hits the object ball, or for long fast side-spin cuts. But for those of us who don't have the stroke and speed control of an A/A+ pro player, a traditional wood shaft with with reduced but not very very low LD properties might be a good compromise since we may need a little forgiveness from the shaft when we have to take a longer rolling shot or leave ourselves in a harder cuing position.

So I wouldn't overlook a traditional shaft of 12 or 12.25mm, a local cue maker might be able to hook you up.
 
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