stainless steel ? ivory ? or wood-to-wood joint ?
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Purdman
Banned
Joints
I have all three with both large (3/8x10 & Radial ) & and small pins (5/16x14 or 18).
I like the Ivory for 1 pocket and straight pool and the steel for 8 & 9 ball. I also like the wood to wood natural feel. The ferrule, joint & tip are what makes for a "HIT" IMHO. I like different tip and ferrule combinations with each joint also.
Purdman
I have all three with both large (3/8x10 & Radial ) & and small pins (5/16x14 or 18).
I like the Ivory for 1 pocket and straight pool and the steel for 8 & 9 ball. I also like the wood to wood natural feel. The ferrule, joint & tip are what makes for a "HIT" IMHO. I like different tip and ferrule combinations with each joint also.
Purdman
so to ur opinion.. which one gives u the best control over the cue ball ? ... coze for me, i like medium hit, and seems like wood-to-wood best fits my style of play...
i dun quite like the steel joint, think it's too hard, and too "dead" on the hits...
but would love to try the ivory joint...
i dun quite like the steel joint, think it's too hard, and too "dead" on the hits...
but would love to try the ivory joint...
I have all three also. I played with a steel joint for a long time, so the wood to wood joint actually feels too soft to me. I don't think either helps you control the cue ball better, just different. The wood to wood makes it easier to produce shots requiring small amounts of travel with more touch, but harder on long draw shots or forced follow. The opposite with the sttel joint. I find the ivory joint somewhere in between. The tip will play into this also though, so make sure to factor that in.
I can already feel burning eyes looking at this post and what I'm about to suggest.
This is why that (and I'll qualify my statement to take the edge off ) at least for me, a production cue is just fine. Feel is PURELY an individual thing.
Go to some supply store with tables and hit with a bunch of different cues until you feel the one you like. Some places (most places) won't allow you to use chalk. Thats ok, you don't even need an object ball. Just make some center ball hits till you find the feel you like.
I remain bewildered after 45+ yrs at this game how some can simply order a cue without playing with it. I dunno, I'd rather pick up a Dufferin that I like for 40 bucks than order some high tech inlaided thing from across the country only to find I don't care for it and now I'm forced to "learn to like it".
This is why that (and I'll qualify my statement to take the edge off ) at least for me, a production cue is just fine. Feel is PURELY an individual thing.
Go to some supply store with tables and hit with a bunch of different cues until you feel the one you like. Some places (most places) won't allow you to use chalk. Thats ok, you don't even need an object ball. Just make some center ball hits till you find the feel you like.
I remain bewildered after 45+ yrs at this game how some can simply order a cue without playing with it. I dunno, I'd rather pick up a Dufferin that I like for 40 bucks than order some high tech inlaided thing from across the country only to find I don't care for it and now I'm forced to "learn to like it".
2 words, IVORY TITLIST!
Carry on.
Carry on.
Steel hits hardest, wood gives most feedback, Ivory looks the prettiest
steel is strongest, ivory is the weakest but all can last a lifetime if not abused
the end result is the same with all, joints have no effect on the cue ball
feel can be altered just as much with different tapers, tips, and woods
feel is vastly over rated, as are most cues, all cues give you some feedback, it's just a matter of adjustment from one to another
steel is strongest, ivory is the weakest but all can last a lifetime if not abused
the end result is the same with all, joints have no effect on the cue ball
feel can be altered just as much with different tapers, tips, and woods
feel is vastly over rated, as are most cues, all cues give you some feedback, it's just a matter of adjustment from one to another
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Staghorn works for me.
Is it the joint??
Is it really the joint that makes the difference?
Actually, the shaft makes all the difference in the world, when it comes to what action you get. The taper is very important. The pro taper allows more flexibility than the graduated taper or the straight taper.
Then, there's the tip. The softer tip allows more grab for English, but it also mushrooms more easily. The harder tip works best if you don't need English and need a more powerful shot... for instance, on the break.
The ferrule does make a difference, but the shaft taper and the tip are probably the most overlooked items, when it comes to figuring out what hits best. Everyone always assumes it is the joint.
For the record, I like my wood-to-wood joint best, with a close run by the phenolic collars. I used to think i needed a stainless steel or brass collar on my cues, but my whole game got better with the others. I also noticed that the shafts with the metal collars were more straight or graduated tapers, not pro tapers. The cues with the joints I seem to like best also have pro tapers on them. I now use the thicker taper cues I have for break cues. I have a WB Water Buffalo tip put on them and away I go! I don't have to put near the effort into my break, but I make at least one ball on most breaks, now.
ahyen8021 said:
Is it really the joint that makes the difference?
Actually, the shaft makes all the difference in the world, when it comes to what action you get. The taper is very important. The pro taper allows more flexibility than the graduated taper or the straight taper.
Then, there's the tip. The softer tip allows more grab for English, but it also mushrooms more easily. The harder tip works best if you don't need English and need a more powerful shot... for instance, on the break.
The ferrule does make a difference, but the shaft taper and the tip are probably the most overlooked items, when it comes to figuring out what hits best. Everyone always assumes it is the joint.
For the record, I like my wood-to-wood joint best, with a close run by the phenolic collars. I used to think i needed a stainless steel or brass collar on my cues, but my whole game got better with the others. I also noticed that the shafts with the metal collars were more straight or graduated tapers, not pro tapers. The cues with the joints I seem to like best also have pro tapers on them. I now use the thicker taper cues I have for break cues. I have a WB Water Buffalo tip put on them and away I go! I don't have to put near the effort into my break, but I make at least one ball on most breaks, now.
JesPiddlin said:Is it really the joint that makes the difference?
Actually, the shaft makes all the difference in the world, when it comes to what action you get. The taper is very important. The pro taper allows more flexibility than the graduated taper or the straight taper.
Then, there's the tip. The softer tip allows more grab for English, but it also mushrooms more easily. The harder tip works best if you don't need English and need a more powerful shot... for instance, on the break.
The ferrule does make a difference, but the shaft taper and the tip are probably the most overlooked items, when it comes to figuring out what hits best. Everyone always assumes it is the joint.
For the record, I like my wood-to-wood joint best, with a close run by the phenolic collars. I used to think i needed a stainless steel or brass collar on my cues, but my whole game got better with the others. I also noticed that the shafts with the metal collars were more straight or graduated tapers, not pro tapers. The cues with the joints I seem to like best also have pro tapers on them. I now use the thicker taper cues I have for break cues. I have a WB Water Buffalo tip put on them and away I go! I don't have to put near the effort into my break, but I make at least one ball on most breaks, now.
the joint(and probably the rest of the cue below the joint as well) is the most overlooked. it may have less obvious impact, but that is why it is the most overlooked. from the butt taper to materials used(especially materials, since say for instance,,,an ebony arm hits differently from paduak).
and actually, in terms of action on the cb, i have to disagree with you....the shaft is the FIRST thing everyone thinks of.
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its all a matter of opinion, i like SS the best. Probably because the weight moves the balancew point foward a little-thats just a guess. But I have some cues that are not SS and they play great too, thus its hard to say whitch one is best, there is no right answere. I like the look of SS or Ivory but that depends again on the overall look/design of the cue.
me too, but
I too have always liked the stiffest most solid hit, that's why I go with the flat-face, big-pin, Ivory or Phenolic joint. And, a mean parbolic taper. IMO, as close to a 1-piece as you can get.
shamadam said:
I too have always liked the stiffest most solid hit, that's why I go with the flat-face, big-pin, Ivory or Phenolic joint. And, a mean parbolic taper. IMO, as close to a 1-piece as you can get.
bruin70 said:
I generally see more threads and hear more talk about the way the joint affects the hit, but I was only trying to point out a few details that often get overlooked by the players. A lot of everyday players don't realize the differences some of the less noticeable things actually create. Many of the folks we've met who play a more serious game don't hardly know how to operate a computer, let alone piddle through forums to see what folks are talking about. They spend most of their time at the pool halls. They know the tip is important and they see the joint, so they think about that, too. They dont' think much about the shaft, unless it's warped. Some want a pro taper, because their buddy has one. They figure it's going to make their game and they want what the crowd seems to be doing, right now.
I also agree with you about the butt being overlooked as an issue. Many look for a warp, check to make sure the balance is good for them, then call it good. And, for some, the overall look is more important than anything. But, the placement of woods and other materials can and does often play a big part in the overall performance of a shot.
I was just trying to point out a couple of less noticed items. I didn't mean to redirect the thread. Sorry about that.
use blue painters tape
Try this: use blue masking tape and cover the joint on ivory cue stainless cue and wood to wood jointed cue. You will not be able to tell difference or will any others. Find a cue maker in your area and see if he has a copy of Kershenbrocks cue bk and read. TIP TYPE FERRULE TYPE TAPER of Shaft and shaft collar will determine feel. you can pay me later
Try this: use blue masking tape and cover the joint on ivory cue stainless cue and wood to wood jointed cue. You will not be able to tell difference or will any others. Find a cue maker in your area and see if he has a copy of Kershenbrocks cue bk and read. TIP TYPE FERRULE TYPE TAPER of Shaft and shaft collar will determine feel. you can pay me later
HollyWood said:
baloney! that's only people who just aren't aware,,,and please don't bring up that infamous "blind test" conducted two decades ago, which was less a test a more a way to FOOL the participants. if kershenbrock actually wrote that then he was talking about something else, but he certainly wasn't thinking about how the strike of the tip hitting the cb resonates/vibrates through the cue and to your grip....because an ss joint deadens the feel of the hit.
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bruin70 said:
opinions, opinions. I have had plenty of steel joints and plenty of flat faced phenolic joints and some of the steel produce a lively hit and some of the flat faced felt dead as a lead weight. I have also noticed the opposite. It's all in the cue itself as a whole.
Try a cue before you buy it. Any joint will play perfectly as long as it is built correctly. World championships have been won with each type of joint.