Which Balls am I?

Odinpop · Nov 27, 2019

* - in 8 ball, In a Non-refereed match. When a player asks his opponent which balls are his (stripes or solids), is it the responsibility of the opponent to answer accurately?

If the opponent purposefully misleads the player, telling him the incorrect balls, and the player then proceeds to follow the opponents incorrect answer and executes a shot on the "wrong balls" , can the opponent then proceed to call a foul?

Not asking what is "ethical" or "good sportsmanship" or "what any decent person would do"... I'm actually wanting to know the rules or if there is any that apply?

Scott Lee · Nov 27, 2019

It is the player's responsibility to know what side they have, if a legal side has been determined. In your story, it is not your responsibility to tell your opponent (although that would be good sportsmanship). In the event that they shot the wrong ball, it would not be a foul. If they pocketed a ball, and you let them continue to shoot, then those balls would become their side.

Scott Lee
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour

Odinpop · Nov 27, 2019

Thank you. But that isn't necessarily my question. My question is if you ask your opponent and they give you the WRONG answer, can they then turn around and call a foul on you for shooting the wrong balls?3

EG - I have Solids, When i ask my opponent tells me I have stripes. I shoot stripes, .... is that a foul?

pt109 · Nov 27, 2019

Odinpop said:
Thank you. But that isn't necessarily my question. My question is if you ask your opponent and they give you the WRONG answer, can they then turn around and call a foul on you for shooting the wrong balls?

If it’s a tournament, he should be disqualified for unsportsmanlike conduct.
...if you ‘re gambling or just competing privately....quit him for life.

In my opinion

Fatboy · Nov 27, 2019

pt109 said:
If it’s a tournament, he should be disqualified for unsportsmanlike conduct.
...if you ‘re gambling or just competing privately....quit him for life.

In my opinion

Well said!

Happy thanksgiving
Fatboy

JessEm · Nov 27, 2019

In the rules I've heard, you/your opponent MUST answer honestly. This leads me to believe it WOULD NOT be a foul.

strmanglr scott · Nov 27, 2019

JessEm said:
In the rules I've heard, you/your opponent MUST answer honestly. This leads me to believe it WOULD NOT be a foul.

Without looking it up, I believe that to be correct.

hang-the-9 · Nov 27, 2019

Odinpop said:
* - in 8 ball, In a Non-refereed match. When a player asks his opponent which balls are his (stripes or solids), is it the responsibility of the opponent to answer accurately?

If the opponent purposefully misleads the player, telling him the incorrect balls, and the player then proceeds to follow the opponents incorrect answer and executes a shot on the "wrong balls" , can the opponent then proceed to call a foul?

Not asking what is "ethical" or "good sportsmanship" or "what any decent person would do"... I'm actually wanting to know the rules or if there is any that apply?

If you ask a police officer if something you are about to do is legal, and he tells you yes, but then arrests you for it, do you think the court will allow that?

buckshotshoey · Nov 27, 2019

hang-the-9 said:
If you ask a police officer if something you are about to do is legal, and he tells you yes, but then arrests you for it, do you think the court will allow that?

Of it's his word against yours, good luck. If you can prove it, video tape, yes. Or at the very least, the officer could be brought up on ethics charges.

As per APA rules, the opponent must answer truthfully. Same in BCA I believe.

jimmyco · Nov 27, 2019

Odinpop said:
Thank you. But that isn't necessarily my question. My question is if you ask your opponent and they give you the WRONG answer, can they then turn around and call a foul on you for shooting the wrong balls?3

EG - I have Solids, When i ask my opponent tells me I have stripes. I shoot stripes, .... is that a foul?

Your question was answered.

jimmyco · Nov 27, 2019

buckshotshoey said:
Of it's his word against yours, good luck. If you can prove it, video tape, yes. Or at the very least, the officer could be brought up on ethics charges.

As per APA rules, the opponent must answer truthfully. Same in BCA I believe.

Undercover has never been about ethics.

td873 · Nov 27, 2019

Odinpop said:
* - in 8 ball, In a Non-refereed match. When a player asks his opponent which balls are his (stripes or solids), is it the responsibility of the opponent to answer accurately?

If the opponent purposefully misleads the player, telling him the incorrect balls, and the player then proceeds to follow the opponents incorrect answer and executes a shot on the "wrong balls" , can the opponent then proceed to call a foul?

Not asking what is "ethical" or "good sportsmanship" or "what any decent person would do"... I'm actually wanting to know the rules or if there is any that apply?

Always check the rules for the game you are playing. Contrary to other comments above, the CSI/BCA rules discuss this scenario and **specifically require that the non-shooting player provide the correct group information.** Further, under the rules, it could be a loss of game for the player giving incorrect information. (on this point, see applied rules regarding unsportsmanlike conduct. p. 101).

RULES said:
"the non-shooting player *MUST* provide information to you concerning the game on the table (e.g., who has which group in 8-ball)"

RULES said:
"it is willful unsportsmanlike conduct to ... to trap [a player] into a foul"

Short answer, there is no foul on the shooter, but there could be a penalty assessed to the non-shooting player. Get a ref at this point.

I think these are the latest rules:

https://www.playcsipool.com/uploads/7/3/5/9/7359673/official_rules_of_csi__170714_.pdf

Note, if a referee gives you the information and you disregard it, that is a different scenario and you would likely receive a foul. See Rule 1-1.2.

Snippets from the rules below:

RULES said:

-td

Which Balls am I?

Odinpop

New member

Scott Lee

AzB Silver Member

Odinpop

New member

pt109

WO double hemlock

Fatboy

AzB Silver Member

JessEm

AzB Goldmember

strmanglr scott

All about Focus

hang-the-9

AzB Silver Member

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member

jimmyco

NRA4Life

jimmyco

NRA4Life

td873

C is for Cookie