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06-24-2019, 12:01 PM

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Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
I think we can all agree that first you have to point yourself in the right direction.
That would be nice, but I don't know if it's possible. I think we learn how to do that and how to aim at the same time - they complement each other. In fact, I don't think they're really entirely different things.

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06-24-2019, 08:21 PM

One can train to deliver the cue straight without ever aiming a shot.
  
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06-25-2019, 03:03 AM

[QUOTE=Patrick Johnson;6424857I think we learn how to do that and how to aim at the same time - they complement each other. In fact, I don't think they're really entirely different things.



pj

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I wholly agree with this sentiment....

Being that as it may Iíve found it strange for years to strafe into our shotline and stance, walking it in just is common sense to find and stay on that correct line.

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06-25-2019, 03:53 AM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
That would be nice, but I don't know if it's possible. I think we learn how to do that and how to aim at the same time - they complement each other. In fact, I don't think they're really entirely different things.

pj
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I totally agree. Aiming and aligning do go together. I was addressing alignment vs. stroking as to priorities in learning. Learning how to align/aim properly should come first.

As to the distinction between aiming and aligning, I imagine they could be considered the same thing in some circles. I've always thought of aiming as a visual process and aligning as a physical one. But I don't consider stroking to be part of either the aiming or aligning process --- at least, not the final stroke that executes the shot.

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06-25-2019, 11:45 AM

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Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
I totally agree. Aiming and aligning do go together. I was addressing alignment vs. stroking as to priorities in learning. Learning how to align/aim properly should come first.

As to the distinction between aiming and aligning, I imagine they could be considered the same thing in some circles. I've always thought of aiming as a visual process and aligning as a physical one. But I don't consider stroking to be part of either the aiming or aligning process --- at least, not the final stroke that executes the shot.
I agree about the shot stroke, but for me practice stroking is part of both the aligning and aiming process. Getting my stance right includes ensuring my stroke is moving straight along my line of sight - my aim isn't reliable until then, so I think of it as part of the aiming process.

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06-25-2019, 03:41 PM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
I agree about the shot stroke, but for me practice stroking is part of both the aligning and aiming process. Getting my stance right includes ensuring my stroke is moving straight along my line of sight - my aim isn't reliable until then, so I think of it as part of the aiming process.

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You know...I was thinking about the distinction between practice stroking and the final execution stroke. When we practice stroke, are we really practicing the final stroke or are we just aiming, aligning and waggling? I think it's more part of the aiming process than the stroking process.
  
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06-25-2019, 03:43 PM

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Originally Posted by greyghost View Post
I wholly agree with this sentiment....

Being that as it may Iíve found it strange for years to strafe into our shotline and stance, walking it in just is common sense to find and stay on that correct line.

-Greyghost


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
I agree about walking it in, which is what I teach, but it's not so straightforward. After all, our head is in the center of our body.
  
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06-26-2019, 08:18 AM

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Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
You know...I was thinking about the distinction between practice stroking and the final execution stroke. When we practice stroke, are we really practicing the final stroke or are we just aiming, aligning and waggling? I think it's more part of the aiming process than the stroking process.
Yes, it's an essential part of the aiming process for me - but it's also "rehearsals" for the shot stroke, which I also want to ensure is exactly aligned. I suppose the degree it's one vs. the other depends on the player. I look forward to the day when my stroke will be automatically aligned and true - but when (if) that day comes I hope it doesn't make me careless about checking it as part of my shot routine.

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06-26-2019, 10:04 PM

Actually, no, your stroke will not "straighten out" simply from a better aim and alignment. It takes physical and mental training. Like I said, video analysis is the key. If you don't believe that, then good luck with your efforts. A lesson with the right instructor would take all the anxiety and long term problems out of your process.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by z0nt0n3r View Post
in my opinion aiming is more important,when you start aiming correctly your stroke starts straightening out automatically unless you have an extreme chicken wing or a severe elbow drop that you cannot control..at least that's my experience.


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06-27-2019, 03:03 AM

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Originally Posted by Scott Lee View Post
Actually, no, your stroke will not "straighten out" simply from a better aim and alignment. It takes physical and mental training. Like I said, video analysis is the key. If you don't believe that, then good luck with your efforts. A lesson with the right instructor would take all the anxiety and long term problems out of your process.

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well for me i had two main issues,the first was my shoulders were a bit square causing a chicken wing and second was an aiming issue,my cue was placed slightly across the line of aim when down on most shots or i was aiming a hair to the left or right of where i was supposed to.(probably because my head was moving offline when getting down on the shot).the chicken wing would steer the cue slightly sideways on practice strokes/delivery and when i corrected the chicken wing,i still had the aim/cue alignment issue causing the cue to steer sideways once again.it was like a vicious circle.but when i started addressing both variables at the same time,my stroke started straightening out.so far it has been working but i will post here if i encounter more problems.

but someone else could have even more problems like sighting/dominant eye issues or stroke issues like jumping up on the shot,tightening the grip etc and maybe someone could be steering the cue for such a long time that the hitch in the stroke has been ingrained even when removing all the variables and needs practice of physical training to fix.or if someone is a complete beginner then of course he will not have a straight stroke if he just fixes aim and alignment.

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06-27-2019, 12:51 PM

Quote:
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well for me i had two main issues,the first was my shoulders were a bit square causing a chicken wing and second was an aiming issue,my cue was placed slightly across the line of aim when down on most shots or i was aiming a hair to the left or right of where i was supposed to.(probably because my head was moving offline when getting down on the shot).the chicken wing would steer the cue slightly sideways on practice strokes/delivery and when i corrected the chicken wing,i still had the aim/cue alignment issue causing the cue to steer sideways once again.it was like a vicious circle.but when i started addressing both variables at the same time,my stroke started straightening out.so far it has been working but i will post here if i encounter more problems.

but someone else could have even more problems like sighting/dominant eye issues or stroke issues like jumping up on the shot,tightening the grip etc and maybe someone could be steering the cue for such a long time that the hitch in the stroke has been ingrained even when removing all the variables and needs practice of physical training to fix.or if someone is a complete beginner then of course he will not have a straight stroke if he just fixes aim and alignment.
Whether or not a player's stroke will straighten out once their alignment is corrected depends on how embedded their stroke compensations were due to their faulty alignment.

When your alignment is off, you will somehow compensate with your stroke, often by twisting or steering or turning your arm inside your torso and restricting your arm swing. Those things can become a habit that could take time to break.
  
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06-27-2019, 02:49 PM

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Whether or not a player's stroke will straighten out once their alignment is corrected depends on how embedded their stroke compensations were due to their faulty alignment.

When your alignment is off, you will somehow compensate with your stroke, often by twisting or steering or turning your arm inside your torso and restricting your arm swing. Those things can become a habit that could take time to break.
yes,i am a bit surprised that my stroke started straightening out so quickly after having a twist in the stroke for years but then again for the last 3 years i have been changing things in my technique constantly,(and trying out same stuff that i tried in the past and thought that didn't work but tried them again & again just to make sure) that i sometimes unknowingly fixed the problem and was playing good for short periods of time but because i didn't fully understand all the variables that were causing the problem i was slipping back into the faulty aim/alignment.the point i'm trying to make is that my body was familiar with the correct position and arm movement because i was already doing it in the past for short periods of time so maybe that is the reason that my stroke started straightening out so quickly.but now in tournament matches against other opponents it is very easy to slip back into the past aiming/alignment mistakes because the focus is mostly on winning the game so maybe i should stop playing tournaments for a while and focus on ingraining the new fundamentals in practice.
  
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06-27-2019, 03:22 PM

also i'm wondering,let's say that your main issue is that you can't place the cue on the line of aim consistently.i would say that this problem mostly depends on your visual perception.so how exactly is an instructor going to fix this?there isn't a quick fix and i think to some degree it's either 'you have it or you don't'.
  
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06-27-2019, 04:31 PM

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also i'm wondering,let's say that your main issue is that you can't place the cue on the line of aim consistently.i would say that this problem mostly depends on your visual perception.so how exactly is an instructor going to fix this?there isn't a quick fix and i think to some degree it's either 'you have it or you don't'.
Do you mean...

"How can I determine the head position and eye alignment necessary for me to have the best aiming accuracy and consistency?"

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06-27-2019, 04:56 PM

no i don't mean the cue position relative to the head and eyes,i mean the placement of the cue relative to the correct aim line.
  
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