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HawaiianEye
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08-23-2019, 06:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
The ball didn't appear to move, certainly wasn't obvious after the shot. Shane could have warned Johnny it looked like his shirt had touched the ball. Perhaps some past history of nitpicking on Johnny's part, Shane called the foul. Johnny could have denied the foul and that would have been the end of things, no ref. Instead Johnny accepted the foul.

Shane was looking at an easy out and Johnny would have to win five games before Shane won two after this game. As good a time as any to dog things off.

I seem to remember Johnny liking long sleeved shirts. That one was expensive, game, set, and match!

Hu
Johnny needs to give Lash Larue his costume back and get some more "pool tournament-friendly" attire.
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08-23-2019, 06:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by penguin View Post
foul in question

7 ball did not appear to move. Doesn't look like a foul.

I don't have a dog in that fight but from what I see Archer was correct.
  
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08-23-2019, 07:23 PM

I dont know which rules were in effect.
My understanding of all ball fouls is if
you touch another ball its a foul, no matter
if it moves or not. Clothing counts
  
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08-23-2019, 07:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by couldnthinkof01 View Post
I dont know which rules were in effect.
My understanding of all ball fouls is if
you touch another ball its a foul, no matter
if it moves or not. Clothing counts
That is the way I always interpreted the rule, too.

You don't have to "move" the ball, just touching it is a foul.
  
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08-23-2019, 08:08 PM

If the ball doesn't move, I'm not going to call a foul. I might mention that it touched; but i'd also say I didn't want a foul for it. Just roll up your sleeve, and keep playing. No harm, no foul.


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08-23-2019, 08:18 PM

I didn't see the 7 move. Even if I think my opponent's sleeve touched the ball if it didn't move I'm not calling a foul.


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08-23-2019, 08:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoolBum View Post
I didn't see the 7 move. Even if I think my opponent's sleeve touched the ball if it didn't move I'm not calling a foul.


If whatever this version of the rules is anything like all ball fouls, it is a foul to touch the ball whether it moves or not. You see it called regularly in snooker events and in properly refereed pool events from Europe (like the Matchroom events). So to me it’s a foul and should be called as such.

Now if it is some version where the ball has to move before it’s a foul, then it doesn’t look like a foul to me.

By the way, I was just at an event here in Toronto with Stephen Hendry and Jimmy White and local legend Cliff Thorburn. One of Cliff’s stories was Cliff being on the hill against Jimmy in a final of a major tournament and Jimmy calling a foul on himself that nobody saw. Cliff ran out and that was that.


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08-23-2019, 08:37 PM

For me, if the ball didn’t move, I don’t think an opponent should call it....
....ONLY a referee.
It’s one of those fouls where Johnny wouldn’t know it he fouled or not.


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08-23-2019, 08:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CreeDo View Post
I'm a little confused on the rules... so it's cue ball fouls only while setting up on the shot,
but then it's all-ball-fouls during the actual stoke?

That seems weird to me, do other tournaments handle things this way?

It's definitely gonna cause confusion and I don't blame Johnny for being annoyed.
I don't really blame SVB either, the rules are the rules, I guess if anyone is at fault
it's whoever made the rule... I don't see the need to split hairs about accidental nudges.
Just make them either fouls or not fouls.
If you see the opponent hit another ball prior to the shot or they notice, then the non shorting player replaces it. If it happens after the shot, it is a foul. We all play this way. Best way without a ref. Johnny should have called a ref and he'd be shooting.
  
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08-23-2019, 08:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by GideonF View Post
If whatever this version of the rules is anything like all ball fouls, it is a foul to touch the ball whether it moves or not. You see it called regularly in snooker events and in properly refereed pool events from Europe (like the Matchroom events). So to me it’s a foul and should be called as such.
What I'm saying is, unless I see the ball move, I cannot really know for sure that he touched it. So no, I'm not calling a foul unless I see it move.


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08-23-2019, 08:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by pt109 View Post
For me, if the ball didn’t move, I don’t think an opponent should call it....
....ONLY a referee.
It’s one of those fouls where Johnny wouldn’t know it he fouled or not.
If Johnny didn't think he touched it he should have held his ground. Ref is not there and call goes to him.

They call a ref then he might go to video.

To just quit is self defeating...literally.
  
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08-23-2019, 08:58 PM

Playing all ball foul without a dedicated ref, for each table, is a bad idea. IMHO



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08-23-2019, 09:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
I just watched the video above. That was a chicken sh-t call by Shane! He must be having a bad year.
Well...he is...at least by the normal SVB standards.

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Letter vs Spirit
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Talking Letter vs Spirit - 08-23-2019, 09:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootingArts View Post
The ball didn't appear to move, certainly wasn't obvious after the shot. Shane could have warned Johnny it looked like his shirt had touched the ball. Perhaps some past history of nitpicking on Johnny's part, Shane called the foul. Johnny could have denied the foul and that would have been the end of things, no ref. Instead Johnny accepted the foul.
That sound like the right approach.
I am not a lawyer (or as Jim Carey would say “liar”) but in Law 101, this is letter vs spirit of law situation.
Strictly applying the letter of the rule , this is a foul on a technicality (shirt touching ball) but the spirit of the rule (i.e. ball did not move) should be applied here and this be deemed as no foul.
Calling on a technicality is not uncommon in other games/ sports . In chess, there is a ridiculous “touch-move” rule. If you accidentally touch one of your pieces in chess , your opponent can apply the letter of the rule and insist you move the piece on a technicality even though you do not intend to move it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GideonF View Post
If whatever this version of the rules is anything like all ball fouls, it is a foul to touch the ball whether it moves or not. You see it called regularly in snooker events and in properly refereed pool events from Europe (like the Matchroom events). So to me it’s a foul and should be called as such.

Now if it is some version where the ball has to move before it’s a foul, then it doesn’t look like a foul to me.

By the way, I was just at an event here in Toronto with Stephen Hendry and Jimmy White and local legend Cliff Thorburn. One of Cliff’s stories was Cliff being on the hill against Jimmy in a final of a major tournament and Jimmy calling a foul on himself that nobody saw. Cliff ran out and that was that.
Jimmy White has always been a real gentleman. Maybe that is why he failed to win countless World Championship finals. LOL
  
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08-23-2019, 09:48 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by SBC View Post
If Johnny didn't think he touched it he should have held his ground. Ref is not there and call goes to him.

They call a ref then he might go to video.

To just quit is self defeating...literally.
Yes... but it is not that simple.
Pro players always try to get edge. That call of foul was sharking.
IMO.
Even there is debate and that goes to Johnny´s way. SVB still broke the comeback rhythm and my guess is that Johnny probably got full of adrenaline and noticed he probably can´t perform. He then chose to make his statement to SVB about that and did forfeit.

I was huge SVB fan before. When I entered DCC 2 years ago and saw him live making corner ball on 9-ball every time with 10-ball break that ended there(almost middle of table).
He still have some respect from me but I hope I don´t see more grey area stuff from him.


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