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07-20-2019, 09:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bstroud View Post
Lassiter told me to practice on loose pockets and play for money on tight pockets.

Pool is all about confidence and you cannot gain confidence practicing on tight pockets all the time.

Bill S.
That is a viewpoint that certainly differs from what most of us may likely have always assumed. Definitely is worth considering, when that advice came from Wimpy - one of the greatest pool players of all time!

I believe the main issue on our two tightest tables is the 143 degree pocket facing angles inside the pockets. When combined with the 4-1/8" corner pocket pocket mouth measurement on these tables, it results in an almost unfair playing pocket for most of us mortals.

I'm hoping/planning to get Ernesto here again either before or after the International Open at Norfolk in late October. If he can alter these angles inside the pockets on these two tables from their current 143 degrees to about 139 degrees, even if we keep the mouth measurement unchanged at 4-1/8", I believe they'll play considerably fairer.

Last edited by ChrisinNC; 07-20-2019 at 09:28 AM. Reason: edit
  
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07-20-2019, 09:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisinNC View Post
That is a viewpoint that certainly differs from what most of us may likely have always assumed. Definitely is worth considering, when that advice came from Wimpy - one of the greatest pool players of all time!

I believe the main issue on our two tightest tables is the 143 degree pocket facing angles inside the pockets. When combined with the 4-1/8" corner pocket pocket mouth measurement on these tables, it results in an almost unfair playing pocket for most of us mortals.

I'm hoping/planning to get Ernesto here again either before or after the International Open at Norfolk in late October. If he can alter these angles inside the pockets on these two tables from their current 143 degrees to about 139 degrees, even if we keep the mouth measurement unchanged at 4-1/8", I believe they'll play considerably fairer.

Hard pressed to argue with Bill Stroud ( one of the greatest *road* players of all time ), let alone Luther Lassiter. Points to absolutely ponder...




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07-20-2019, 10:11 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bstroud View Post
Lassiter told me to practice on loose pockets and play for money on tight pockets.



Pool is all about confidence and you cannot gain confidence practicing on tight pockets all the time.



Bill S.


Exactly!


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07-20-2019, 10:17 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bstroud View Post
Lassiter told me to practice on loose pockets and play for money on tight pockets.

Pool is all about confidence and you cannot gain confidence practicing on tight pockets all the time.

Bill S.
Wow! Some consider Lassiter the game's greatest ever ball pocketer, so this has to be taken seriously. Irving Crane used to advocate playing on tight pockets twice a week, otherwise on average pockets. He once commented to me about a problem that arose if he played on tight equipment only by saying "I don't want to get scared of shots I'm not supposed to be scared of."
  
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07-20-2019, 10:47 AM

I grew up playing on a 3/4 size snooker table ie 10ft. Pockets are tighter than pool. I had to develop a smooth stroke and strong fundamentals or quit in frustration. I wouldnt practice exclusively on that table these days . I would practice on it if i needed to work on the fundamentals.

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07-20-2019, 11:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjm View Post
Wow! Some consider Lassiter the game's greatest ever ball pocketer, so this has to be taken seriously. Irving Crane used to advocate playing on tight pockets twice a week, otherwise on average pockets. He once commented to me about a problem that arose if he played on tight equipment only by saying "I don't want to get scared of shots I'm not supposed to be scared of."
That is what I was talking about in my post when I mentioned "gun shy". When tables are too tight, players tend to get "scared" and they doubt themselves and shoot safeties when maybe they should have tried to make the shot.
  
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07-20-2019, 05:29 PM

Does practicing on a tight table help or hurt?

It depends.

It depends on how you react and what you do about the bobbles. If you do nothing, it hurts. If you stop and figure out why it bobbled, it helps.

Lately I've been playing on some very tight, finicky Diamonds. At first it was aggravating beyond words - hitting a shot just a hair to the outside facing or barely brushing a rail and having the ball hang up. It's a pisser. But what I did was to start to look at all that as indicators of an imperfect setup and stroke and, lately, after much introspection, angst, and work, I have had success.

Personally, I think a table can be too tight for pool to the point that the whole thing becomes something other than pool. You need to be able to work the ball and that means a little leeway at the pocket. But there's never anything wrong with being able to be laser accurate. And when you get a hold of that... it is amazing how much you can still work the cue ball.

Lou Figueroa
  
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07-20-2019, 06:15 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by lfigueroa View Post
Does practicing on a tight table help or hurt?

It depends.

It depends on how you react and what you do about the bobbles. If you do nothing, it hurts. If you stop and figure out why it bobbled, it helps.

Lately I've been playing on some very tight, finicky Diamonds. At first it was aggravating beyond words - hitting a shot just a hair to the outside facing or barely brushing a rail and having the ball hang up. It's a pisser. But what I did was to start to look at all that as indicators of an imperfect setup and stroke and, lately, after much introspection, angst, and work, I have had success.

Personally, I think a table can be too tight for pool to the point that the whole thing becomes something other than pool. You need to be able to work the ball and that means a little leeway at the pocket. But there's never anything wrong with being able to be laser accurate. And when you get a hold of that... it is amazing how much you can still work the cue ball.

Lou Figueroa
When playing on a table with super tight pockets that tend to rattle balls, I find myself thinking more about the exact angle I'm planning to leave for my next shot to best get to the shot after that - so as I hopefully don't ever have to stroke any shot any harder than is absolutely necessary. Obviously the harder you have to hit any shot particularly object balls sitting near the cushions, in order to move the cue ball where you need it, the more likely they will rattle if not hit dead center pocket. If you're leaving yourself too straight in on a shot and you have to work that cue ball off line to get on your next ball, on a tight pocket table you're going to have a hard time pocketing the shot successfully and getting the necessary position.

Last edited by ChrisinNC; 07-20-2019 at 06:25 PM.
  
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07-20-2019, 08:54 PM

Why do people always try to make pool into "something else"?

Smaller pockets, faster cloth, bouncier rails, jump cues, BIH, etc., etc., etc.

Nobody is going to tell me that pool is better now than it was a few decades ago.

It is just DIFFERENT.

And, IMHO, getting worse.
  
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07-20-2019, 10:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gypsy_soul View Post
I'm on my way East . Any tight tables around? I'm in Nashville thinking bout Huntsville if anyone wants action
Hey buddy,

There is a 9' pro am with 4.25 corners in Huntsville at goodtimez, if it didn't get sold when sam sold the room (not long ago). The new owner sold off all but two 9'ers. He kept most 7'ers.

Drop me a line if you make it to Huntsville. I would like to meet up and play some cheap 10 ball if my schedule works out with yours.

Try to give me a couple days notice if possible.

Have a good one,

Jeff


Don't let your bark be bigger than your stroke.

If I had plenty of money, I would probably lose more often.
  
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07-20-2019, 10:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by lfigueroa View Post
Does practicing on a tight table help or hurt?

It depends.

It depends on how you react and what you do about the bobbles. If you do nothing, it hurts. If you stop and figure out why it bobbled, it helps.

Lately I've been playing on some very tight, finicky Diamonds. At first it was aggravating beyond words - hitting a shot just a hair to the outside facing or barely brushing a rail and having the ball hang up. It's a pisser. But what I did was to start to look at all that as indicators of an imperfect setup and stroke and, lately, after much introspection, angst, and work, I have had success.

Personally, I think a table can be too tight for pool to the point that the whole thing becomes something other than pool. You need to be able to work the ball and that means a little leeway at the pocket. But there's never anything wrong with being able to be laser accurate. And when you get a hold of that... it is amazing how much you can still work the cue ball.

Lou Figueroa
Most 14.1 players dont like diamond tables for that very reason. Yep, a diamond will turn a 100+ ball runner thats use to a GC into a 50 to 60 ball runner unless they do as you suggest.

Most give up and just complain instead of adapting.


Don't let your bark be bigger than your stroke.

If I had plenty of money, I would probably lose more often.
  
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07-21-2019, 02:43 PM

Here are photos of the corner pockets on the front row tables at Blue Fin Billiards where I play.
All I know is I can and do run racks on these table whereas some other players will struggle.
But the folks I play pool with also can run racks on these tables. This just requires a strong player.

I'm not trying to boast about being a great player. Quite the opposite because at my age, I play
entirely for the moment.....right now....And some days I play fierce and other times kinda charitable.
Tighter pockets really distinguish a player's skiill level. It is a challenge for less skilled pool players,
especially league players (7' tables) where the pockets are oversized. That's why I never play on 7'.

My preference is to play on 9' tables with tight pockets & the more people complain about the table's
tough pockets, the more I actually relish & genunely enjoy playing on that table. I like the challenge.
Maybe like golf courses that have slope ratings to correlate the course difficulty, so should pool tables.
Anyway, pool should be played for personal enjoyment and so I say to each their own.....Obladi Oblada.
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07-21-2019, 02:59 PM

When Lassiter and I used to practice at St. Elmo's in Norfolk we would play on the table he always practiced on. 5" corners and 5.5" side pockets. We could both run lots of 9 ball racks for 2$ a game.

He was the best tight pocket player I ever saw.

His Secret? Move closer to center ball.

It has always worked for me.

Bill Stroud
  
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07-21-2019, 03:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bstroud View Post
When Lassiter and I used to practice at St. Elmo's in Norfolk we would play on the table he always practiced on. 5" corners and 5.5" side pockets. We could both run lots of 9 ball racks for 2$ a game.

He was the best tight pocket player I ever saw.

His Secret? Move closer to center ball.

It has always worked for me.

Bill Stroud
Yep, center ball works wonders for people that stay in line.

What about players like me that get out of line by the third shot? I have to spin the cb often to get back in line. Then, two balls later, I'm out of line again.....thats about where my run ends.

Center ball, like center table, is a very safe place to be but, seems so hard to get there for some of us (me).


Don't let your bark be bigger than your stroke.

If I had plenty of money, I would probably lose more often.
  
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07-21-2019, 04:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bavafongoul View Post
Here are photos of the corner pockets on the front row tables at Blue Fin Billiards where I play.
All I know is I can and do run racks on these table whereas some other players will struggle.
But the folks I play pool with also can run racks on these tables. This just requires a strong player.

I'm not trying to boast about being a great player. Quite the opposite because at my age, I play
entirely for the moment.....right now....And some days I play fierce and other times kinda charitable.
Tighter pockets really distinguish a player's skiill level. It is a challenge for less skilled pool players,
especially league players (7' tables) where the pockets are oversized. That's why I never play on 7'.

My preference is to play on 9' tables with tight pockets & the more people complain about the table's
tough pockets, the more I actually relish & genunely enjoy playing on that table. I like the challenge.
Maybe like golf courses that have slope ratings to correlate the course difficulty, so should pool tables.
Anyway, pool should be played for personal enjoyment and so I say to each their own.....Obladi Oblada.

That's no longer pool.

Lou Figueroa
  
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