Spot on the wall kicking system?

bbb

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The beauty of the spot on the wall system is that it will work on almost any table, whether you've tested it out or not, and will get you real close. Sometimes it can be a life saver.

Eons ago I played Efren in a US Open One Pocket match and he was tying me into knots with his safety play. At one point I was frozen behind a ball near my side pocket and the only way out was a three rail kick to get behind some balls in front of his hole and I was lost. Then I remember the SOTW (though in the version I knew you had to choose a spot about 10' away). There was an standup ashtray about that distance away. I chose a side of the ashtray, took aim, and execute a perfect escape. The crowd applauded :)

Lou Figueroa

nice shot....:thumbup:
is that an aiming system??:eek:
 

chefjeff

If not now...
Silver Member
The SOTW system only works pretty good if the THAT spot you pick out, is only 5"-6" away from the table you are playing on!

I find that the farther away the spot is, the more accurate it is.

Think about it.



Jeff Livingston
 

chefjeff

If not now...
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the spot should be about table length away
the farther away it is its actually less accurate as all spots converge
bob jewett had a great article on this

I'll check it out...thanks. Is it at Billiards Digest?

I've experimented with this at Big Dogs (emphasis, BIG) and I'm finding that the farther away, the better...for me, at least.

The other night in league, I had to shoot a three rail kick to make a hit so I used this method. My spot was, I'd guess, 100 feet away or so. I nailed the shot, made it, in fact.

In my home room, the spots are much closer and I find I'm off just a bit because of that.

I don't get too anal about it because I use the wall spot moreso as a general guideline and starting point for a kick/bank than an exact spot to shoot at.

It's a nice tool, for sure. I love explaining it after I do it when someone asks me wth?



Jeff Livingston
 

greyghost

Coast to Coast
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I find that the farther away the spot is, the more accurate it is.

Think about it.



Jeff Livingston


the spot on the wall is nothing but the geometric unfolding of the table at the same lengths and widths as the table, a form of combined mirroring.

so for a three railer you'd imagine from the farthest corner away from you (say the right corner) 4.5 ft across (Left to right) from that right corner, then 9 ft straight ahead, then 4.5ft across again. imagining two extra tables touching corner to corner diagonally.

further away just like moving more than the width over the actual 4.5feet a 9' requires would change the ratios, thus an inaccurate guesstimating of the eye rulers.

try it out with a tape measure, the key is "seeing" the widths accurately with imaginary track lines.....im better at the method on the 5x10 I see that distance more accurate than the 9ft......8ft and 7' tables are the hardest for me to see/vizualize those odd lengths.

often times I find it easier to see the 9 ft line sections in vertical fashion as a beam/line that I then lay on its side......using the line and its relation to a triangles parts as sort of a double check of the distance vs height and C (hypotenuse)....

lol I dont think much and its actually simple and quick but it def requires some heavy visualization. Also helps if you can jump the eyes like the ball on words in a sing along song......ill move my eyes the same distance as say if I looked at the far left corner of the table then bounced the eye over to the right corner, helps some to correct any inaccurate distances that are merely imagined. Just another double check as a test

hope that doesn't sound like I need a jacket and a padded room :grin:
 

bbb

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I'll check it out...thanks. Is it at Billiards Digest?

I've experimented with this at Big Dogs (emphasis, BIG) and I'm finding that the farther away, the better...for me, at least.

The other night in league, I had to shoot a three rail kick to make a hit so I used this method. My spot was, I'd guess, 100 feet away or so. I nailed the shot, made it, in fact.

In my home room, the spots are much closer and I find I'm off just a bit because of that.

I don't get too anal about it because I use the wall spot moreso as a general guideline and starting point for a kick/bank than an exact spot to shoot at.

It's a nice tool, for sure. I love explaining it after I do it when someone asks me wth?



Jeff Livingston
jeff i deleted my post because i may have "misremembered"
too close for sure is not good
i will pm bob and hopefully he will answer
 

Bob Jewett

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... i will pm bob and hopefully he will answer

Not required.

Here is how you can find a spot on the wall target for many kinds of banks and kicks....

First figure out the general nature of the shot and how you are going to play it. One example would be the standard 3-cushion kick (which could use the corner-5 system if you wanted to count) played with running follow, and another would be a bank shot to the side with a sliding (as opposed to rolling) object ball.

Also think about the range of ball positions over which you want the shot to work. You might want the 3-rail kick to work when coming from the side pocket or from the middle of the end rail. (Technically, those would be called the "shortest" and "longest" starting positions for that shot.)

Find the line the ball has to go along for a shot from one of the extreme positions. Mark that line with two coins on the rails. Find the line for a shot from the other extreme position. Mark that line with coins.

Place a real, physical target where those two lines cross, which is normally somewhere out in the room. In lessons, I use a camera tripod and a pool ball into which I have screwed a 1/4-20 screw that goes on a camera tripod mount foot. You could use a piece of chalk on a bar stool.

There is one precise place where those two lines cross at an exact distance from the table. There is only one point.

At this point you know that if you shoot a ball along either of the two original lines at that single spot, the ball will go to the required target. Now, try shooting the same shot from a startig point halfway between those two extremes. For example, you could shoot the 3-cushion kick from half a diamond up the long rail. You shoot at that same target out in the room where the two lines cross and where I would have put my ball on a tripod.

If the shot from the middle starting point does not go to the target, you set too large a range for the shot. Either you can narrow the range over which you expect that single spot on the wall to work, or you can try to modify the system in some way to force it to work. One example of forcing the shot to work is on the 3-cushion kick. As the shot gets shorter, use more side spin and jack up a little -- that might fix things.

A main point here is that spot-on-the-wall systems are easy to construct on your own for your own equipment and conditions.

Another very important point is that not just any point will do. It has to be at the right distance or it can't work well for all starting points. It almost certainly will not be on the wall.
 
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Bobkitty

I said: "Here kitty, kitty". Got this frown.
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Not required.


There is one precise place where those two lines cross at an exact distance from the table. There is only one point.

ll.

Please tell me where in distance is your point from the table in feet/inches.
 

mr3cushion

Regestered User
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Playing to the, 'Long' cushion first, aim at a point pretty much equal to the width of the table you are play on. Playing to the. 'short' rail first, a point a distance equal to the, length of the table you are playing on.

Hence, possibly, for width, 4'.0", 4'.6", 5'.0". the length, 8.0", 9'.0", 10'.0".
 
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greyghost

Coast to Coast
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Please tell me where in distance is your point from the table in feet/inches.



What size table? (7/8/8.5/9/10/)

How many rails? (1/2/3/4/5...)

Which pocket are you shooting for(corners or sides)

Is the shot to be played long rail or short rail first?

Bank’em and spank’em Ed,
-Greyghost



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

Bob Jewett

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Please tell me where in distance is your point from the table in feet/inches.
I explained how to find the exact spot (fairly quickly) for the particular kind of shot you are interested in on your own equipment. Was that not clear?

As one of many examples, the spot for a stunned bank shot the shorter way without side on the object ball is around 2.8 to 3 diamonds from the nose of the banking cushion but it depends on the cushion.
 

alstl

AzB Silver Member
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I could be wrong - first time for everything - but I think Melling is using the plus 2 or a version of it. I say that because of how he is measuring the rail. I think the reason he looked for a spot on the wall is because he gets low on the cue and he can't see the diamond and because he first looks at the short rail then raise the cue to a corresponding spot on the wall.

Therefore I think it's plus two and his "spot" is on the wall. The way he finds the spot is plus two. Then he shifts upward from the spot on the rail to a spot on the wall. Maybe if somebody runs into Melling with a video camera they could get an explanation from the man himself.
 

Bobkitty

I said: "Here kitty, kitty". Got this frown.
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I explained how to find the exact spot (fairly quickly) for the particular kind of shot you are interested in on your own equipment. Was that not clear?

As one of many examples, the spot for a stunned bank shot the shorter way without side on the object ball is around 2.8 to 3 diamonds from the nose of the banking cushion but it depends on the cushion.

I understood it. Just wondering where your spot is for your table. 9' table.
 

Bob Jewett

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I understood it. Just wondering where your spot is for your table. 9' table.
The tables I play on are not a good example of this for the corner-5 replacement spot. In one direction around one of the tables, you have to shoot to 1 from 5 to get to the opposite corner.:mad: If you go the other direction, you need to shoot to 2.
 

KenRobbins

AzB Silver Member
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Interesting topic on kicking. The quickest and accurate way I found works for me is dividing 3 sections between 2 diamonds, 1/4, 1/2 & 3/4's. This gives me 10 contact points counting the 2 diamonds and which side of each line is my contact point on each section. Not sure if this is a thing or not, but works great for me.

Never tried the spot on the wall method. I'd be concerned of my buddy thinking of me eyeing up his woman if her chair leg was my contact point. lol
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
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the spot on the wall is nothing but the geometric unfolding of the table at the same lengths and widths as the table, a form of combined mirroring.

so for a three railer you'd imagine from the farthest corner away from you (say the right corner) 4.5 ft across (Left to right) from that right corner, then 9 ft straight ahead, then 4.5ft across again. imagining two extra tables touching corner to corner diagonally.
Nice (and accurate) description, Keeb... here's a pic to go with it.

pj
chgo
 

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KenRobbins

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After putting a little more thought into what I visualize, there's actually 13 contact points. My drawing is poor and probably looks more difficult than it really is. When you find center of contact point to center of your object ball standing up, that's the shot line. When your down aiming on that shot line, you can adjust half a tip on each side of that line depending which side of the object ball you want to hit. If you want to hit object ball center, then just stay on that original line. Hard to explain, but not very difficult.
 

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