Will Diamonds replace Valleys?

realkingcobra said:

Here's a question for you, who is the major buyer of the Valley tables? Lets see what you really know, then I'll tell you how and why Valley will close its doors sooner or later

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Ken_4fun said:

RKC -

I think vendor companies would be the biggest buyer of Valley tables. They usually supply the tables, and take a percentage of quarters dropped.

Ken

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realkingcobra said:

Valley/Dynamo is like a big snake and has been for many many years...but, cut off it's head...and the body will die. Valley for years made it almost impossible to make any kind of money/profit from trying to sell the tables to the bars directly...as there was only a $300 difference between wholesale and retail. Valley did a great job of controlling the coin-op table industry for so many years by selling most everything they built to the vending industry, and by passing the bar that wanted to buy their own. Brunswick came along and bought Valley/Dynamo for 34.5 million, then a few short years later...sold it to the current ownership...for 2 million, what does that tell you? Then, on top of all that, vending companies that WOULD be in the market to buy NEW Valley's...are in fact replacing some of their older Valley's with Diamond's...because if they won't supply the Diamond to the bar that wants them...another Vending company WILL. So, this creates the MAJOR problem to Valley, the vending company is NOT going to buy any NEW Valley's...as long as they have some, or a few of them somes...in their warehouses. So. along comes Diamond, building and suppling demand as it comes in, while VALLEY is looking to sell their tables to Vending companies that....have Valley's in storage. It don't take a lot of Vending companies to NOT buy Valley tables anymore....but it's the beginning of the dominoes effect meaning....less need for NEW Valley's....means Valley can't stay in business based on what they've ALREADY sold in the past, that requires NEW sales, which are falling off daily.

Second problem for Valley, is that they NEVER built a finance market for the bar that wanted to buy...but needed financing, Valley fed them to the Vending companies, while Diamond...has their no excuse lease/rent to own company...which means...if you want one, you can GET one, no problem!!!

I've already heard that the Valley/Dynamo company is up for sale again, but really...who's going to buy a sick and dying horse...when it's on it's last legs

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Ken_4fun said:

But still I would expect Diamond tables to be ALOT more expensive than Valley tables. For enthusiasits, money makes little difference, but for a bar and their typical customer, it does make a difference.

Ken

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Ken_4fun said:

But still I would expect Diamond tables to be ALOT more expensive than Valley tables. For enthusiasits, money makes little difference, but for a bar and their typical customer, it does make a difference.

Ken

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realkingcobra said:

If the average bar player can't finish out 5 games an hour on a Valley, they're not going to do any worse on a Diamond, and at a dollar a game, it's the same amout of income, the big difference is...the guy down the street that's been looking to play on a Diamond, will now come into the bar that has them...and that's new blood to the bar owner that never had that customer before the Diamond showed up...and that's where the increased income comes into play, new customers

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woody_968 said:

I don't think so.

While I much prefer to play on Diamonds, Valley hit the nail on the head when it came to having a pool table in the bars.

What does a bar owner want to happen to his pool table? To have people put money in the table. The faster games can be over the faster people have to put in more money. For the average bar room player this happens much faster on a Valley than on a Diamond.

While the demand from players to have Diamond tables has strengthened, if I owned a bar I would probably have to go against my personal preferences and install Valleys for this reason.

Woody

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Jaden said:

A bar makes much more money selling drinks than getting quarters put into tables. Keep people at the tables longer and you sell more drinks and make more money...

The truth of the matter is that it greatly depends on where the bar is and who your clientele are....there is no blanket answer that is correct.

I think that diamond will increase it's share of the market on bar boxes but valley isn't getting bankrupted in the near future(solely due to reduced market share)...

Jaden

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9ballrob said:

Lincoln, NE has one of the largest league bases per capita. About 1400 players in a town of 270,000. There is not a 7' Diamond in this town!

Diamond has a long way to go!

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realkingcobra said:

I think you missed the my point, if your area is already full of Valley tables, then Valley won't make any more sales in your area, therefore they can't stay I business if they can't keep selling new tables....but Diamond only needs to pick up ONE vendor in your area...and the vending wars will start

PS. I've seen it happen a 100 times already, and the bottom line is always the same, the vending companies never go back to buying Valley tables again!

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cluelesscuer said:

Yea...this kind of what I am thinking...that they won't.

I guess this leads to my second question, how come more people don't buy 7 ft Valleys for their homes?

I am the first person who hates 7 ft bar boxes and even more sore, crappy ones like Valleys. I am a 9 ft guy. But the most pool in leagues and bars is played on 7 ft Valleys. Not too mention, that 7 ft Valleys are relatively inexpensive to get.

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