Allowable Margin for Error -- Contact Point vs Fractional Aim Point

BC21 · Mar 8, 2020

JoeyInCali said:
I know who Dodong is.
Went to see his money match against Pulpol in Davao City in Feb 2018.
I was with Dodong's early mentor, Art. Art is a matchmaker down there and used to run tournaments. And Art is also a very capable player and instructor.
Dodong lost in a hill-hill match.
Before Low starts claiming Dodong does invisible pivot and all that magical stop, he should quit already. Please, he just sees the shooting line and shoots to it .
Roy of Roy's Basement went live when Dodong was trying his new shaft. Roy set up long cut shots and Dodong just shot them over and over again from he was setup . He missed a lot of shots because he was adjusting to the new LD shaft.
Peeps shouldn't be trying to figure out how Dodong aims.
He's one of the few Filipino players who actually have textbook stroke and stance. His delivery is so smooth. Lets the cue slide often.
Low must really have no clue how good someone like DD plays.
If he wants the 7-out and the breaks on 10-ball against DD, he should contact Roy.

Lol... but according to Low Joe and Spider Dave I should've beaten DD because I have Poolology. Well, I missed two shots, and I didn't use Poolology on either one. Sure, if I would have used it on that 1 ball back cut then I would have made the shot, guaranteed. But I didn't use it, and that's that, which brings me to the point of this thread....

If I had started playing this game 35 years ago using an aiming method that provided an exact aim line for most cut shots, without relying on guesswork or my lousy inexperienced judgment back then, I believe my ball pocketing skills would've been developed much quicker and would today be more solid and consistent as a result. Or maybe not....

I mean, I understand that if I played more often, more than one or two nights a week, I would be more consistent anyway, regardless of how I initially learned to play or what aiming methods I choose to use now. Experience has proven that doing the same thing over and over will eventually lead to consistency. This is how skills are formed, how good habits are formed. Unfortunately, it's also how bad habits are formed.:embarrassed2:

SpiderWebComm · Mar 8, 2020

BC21 said:
Lol... but according to Low Joe and Spider Dave I should've beaten DD because I have Poolology.

Nobody ever said that nor would say it. Playing somebody at that level really provides a reality check on how good you think you are to where the game really is. My reality checks come every time I play Allen Hopkins. It's mind numbing.

Well, I missed two shots, and I didn't use Poolology on either one.

No kidding, it's obvious! Not just because you didn't use Poolology but relying on all that subconscious gobble-de-gook that's supposed to allow you to win over everyone and is so reliable. WTF good did it do you?

Sure, if I would have used it on that 1 ball back cut then I would have made the shot, guaranteed. But I didn't use it

The miss on the one ball was a true hackers miss! A minor cut to the right in the corner pocket which was wide open and you missed the entire pocket at least 3" or more to the left into the rail.

ANY aiming method would have knocked that ball in. Contact point, GB, lights, fraction, shishkabob, ANYTHING. What it would have provided was FOCUS.
Just a small amount of focus instead of zippety-do-da by letting the subconscious mind do the work instead of coordinating your stroke with the EYES.

What I got out of it was you're a fairly decent player who can be prone to hot and cold streaks as a result of you're rock head and not using something to focus the eyes in conjunction with the shot line and impact.

You didn't have enough time at the table taking shots to get a feel for anything else except you need mechanical bridge work. :grin:

I do agree 100% with you on something though. You need to lose some weight. LMAO

Now you can atone for your sins by trying to qualify for the US Amateur. That is unless you keep handing those $50's out like candy. It would have been almost 1/2 of the fee to qualify.

BC21 · Mar 8, 2020

SpiderWebComm said:
The miss on the one ball was a true hackers miss! A minor cut to the right in the corner pocket which was wide open and you missed the entire pocket at least 3" or more to the left into the rail.

ANY aiming method would have knocked that ball in. Contact point, GB, lights, fraction, shishkabob, ANYTHING. What it would have provided was FOCUS.
Just a small amount of focus instead of zippety-do-da by letting the subconscious mind do the work instead of coordinating your stroke with the EYES.

What I got out of it was you're a fairly decent player who can be prone to hot and cold streaks as a result of you're rock head and not using something to focus the eyes in conjunction with the shot line and impact.

You didn't have enough time at the table taking shots to get a feel for anything else except you need mechanical bridge work. :grin:

I do agree 100% with you on something though. You need to lose some weight. LMAO

Now you can atone for your sins by trying to qualify for the US Amateur. That is unless you keep handing those $50's out like candy. It would have been almost 1/2 of the fee to qualify.

Very good points. It's amazing how focus tends to hang on the balance of one's expectations. I had already watched DD snap a 4pk off, so in my mind (and correctly so) I was not going to win that set. My absolute best is 4pk in 9ball. He does it often as I break and a run a single rack. I was more focused in the league play. Our team finshed the season in 1st place, and I personally finished 2nd out of over a hundred players.

I could've not missed that one ball or 2 ball and wouldn't have mattered. DD is supposed to run over top of me, because even I hadn't missed a single shot, I'm sure I would've made other errors.

Low500 · Mar 8, 2020

SpiderWebComm said:
The miss on the one ball was a true hackers miss! A minor cut to the right in the corner pocket which was wide open and you missed the entire pocket at least 3" or more to the left into the rail.
ANY aiming method would have knocked that ball in. Contact point, GB, lights, fraction, shishkabob, ANYTHING. What it would have provided was FOCUS.
Just a small amount of focus instead of zippety-do-da by letting the subconscious mind do the work instead of coordinating your stroke with the EYES.
What I got out of it was you're a fairly decent player who can be prone to hot and cold streaks as a result of you're rock head and not using something to focus the eyes in conjunction with the shot line and impact.
You didn't have enough time at the table taking shots to get a feel for anything else except you need mechanical bridge work. :grin:
I do agree 100% with you on something though. You need to lose some weight. LMAO
Now you can atone for your sins by trying to qualify for the US Amateur. That is unless you keep handing those $50's out like candy. It would have been almost 1/2 of the fee to qualify.

Spiderman, that's a pretty good diagnosis of the expert wannabe instructor's performance.
When my kids were young, the last thing I wanted to do was throw away $50 to some pool shark to show off "how much heart I had"..... 50 bucks could've paid for a number of school lunches back then.
Bottom line: "A fool and his money are soon parted".:wink: Anyway, now let us move on to more important and relevant matters...………
I've been watching that tournament in Louisiana all week from the gate.
Last night Aranas was playing that Japanese fellow named Oi (who is no bum either).
They had expert commentary on the match by Mary Kenniston. She knows the real deal about what is what in this game and is noooo dummy.
She commented..."like all the Filipinos, Aranis sweeps into his shots for aiming but he is so quick and smooth with it, nobody picks up on how he does it".
I was caught flatfooted by that comment because I figured he was an exception and was going into the shot straight ahead like some of the pseudo expert intellectuals in here advocate, and I could not understand why he was so accurate. So I started watching him even more closely. I couldn't see this even when he was barbecuing that "expert" from here at that match in W.V. and I was watching like a hawk there too
Mary is quite correct. Aranas (I prefer his real name instead of that goofy "do dong" thing) is disguised sweeping into the shot line and the rock head Americans, by and large, don't have a clue. Validating what our mentor Stan Shuffett advocates.
Don't know if you've ever watched Aranas play. Look him up on the YouTube and if your computer has an app. that can throw a video into slow motion, you'll pick up on it right away. He is really clever at disguising those sweeps..very quick and smooth...just like Efren.
Enjoy and regards,:thumbup:
Lowenstein

SpiderWebComm · Mar 8, 2020

BC21 said:
I could've not missed that one ball or 2 ball and wouldn't have mattered. DD is supposed to run over top of me, because even I hadn't missed a single shot, I'm sure I would've made other errors.

No, it wouldn't have mattered. He's a machine. We all make errors, even the pros.
We make more they make far less.

His speed control between a regular shot and softer shots is a pleasure to watch when he needs to work the CB around the table for a number of shots in a row.
His angles are set up for multiple balls in advance. Yours weren't. It's not a knock because mine aren't many times either due to lack of forethought and touch.

But we can't miss shots that are makeable whether it's against a top player like him or regular Joe Blow. It's highly important to keep the run going.

He missed nothing that I can remember. If so, it's a blank in my memory.

Aiming and using it as it should be used is important for us especially. It provides the 3-4 seconds of FOCUS to make the shot instead of going brain dead and missing. The brain isn't always this wonderful marvel of life functioning perfectly from stored experience. There's a hell of a lot of static at times like an old AM radio and it doesn't play right when you want it to.

Negative thoughts creep in, doubt, anger at self for doing something like a bone head, whatever, WE NEED FOCUS!

AN AIMING SYSTEM PROVIDES IT! MANY CHOICES AVAILABLE.

Agreed?

BC21 · Mar 8, 2020

SpiderWebComm said:
No, it wouldn't have mattered. He's a machine. We all make errors, even the pros.
We make more they make far less.

His speed control between a regular shot and softer shots is a pleasure to watch when he needs to work the CB around the table for a number of shots in a row.
His angles are set up for multiple balls in advance. Yours weren't. It's not a knock because mine aren't many times either due to lack of forethought and touch.

But we can't miss shots that are makeable whether it's against a top player like him or regular Joe Blow. It's highly important to keep the run going.

He missed nothing that I can remember. If so, it's a blank in my memory.

Aiming and using it as it should be used is important for us especially. It provides the 3-4 seconds of FOCUS to make the shot instead of going brain dead and missing. The brain isn't always this wonderful marvel of life functioning perfectly from stored experience. There's a hell of a lot of static at times like an old AM radio and it doesn't play right when you want it to.

Negative thoughts creep in, doubt, anger at self for doing something like a bone head, whatever, WE NEED FOCUS!

AN AIMING SYSTEM PROVIDES IT! MANY CHOICES AVAILABLE.

Agreed?

Agreed, 100%. I especially like the radio analogy. I myself use analogies on occasion. :wink:

SpiderWebComm · Mar 8, 2020

BC21 said:
Agreed, 100%. I especially like the radio analogy. I myself use analogies on occasion. :wink:

LMAO...like novel length analogies. (I gotta stop them in the future)

Mkindsv · Mar 9, 2020

Low500 said:
Spiderman, that's a pretty good diagnosis of the expert wannabe instructor's performance.
When my kids were young, the last thing I wanted to do was throw away $50 to some pool shark to show off "how much heart I had"..... 50 bucks could've paid for a number of school lunches back then.
Bottom line: "A fool and his money are soon parted".:wink: Anyway, now let us move on to more important and relevant matters...………
I've been watching that tournament in Louisiana all week from the gate.
Last night Aranas was playing that Japanese fellow named Oi (who is no bum either).
They had expert commentary on the match by Mary Kenniston. She knows the real deal about what is what in this game and is noooo dummy.
She commented..."like all the Filipinos, Aranis sweeps into his shots for aiming but he is so quick and smooth with it, nobody picks up on how he does it".
I was caught flatfooted by that comment because I figured he was an exception and was going into the shot straight ahead like some of the pseudo expert intellectuals in here advocate, and I could not understand why he was so accurate. So I started watching him even more closely. I couldn't see this even when he was barbecuing that "expert" from here at that match in W.V. and I was watching like a hawk there too
Mary is quite correct. Aranas (I prefer his real name instead of that goofy "do dong" thing) is disguised sweeping into the shot line and the rock head Americans, by and large, don't have a clue. Validating what our mentor Stan Shuffett advocates.
Don't know if you've ever watched Aranas play. Look him up on the YouTube and if your computer has an app. that can throw a video into slow motion, you'll pick up on it right away. He is really clever at disguising those sweeps..very quick and smooth...just like Efren.
Enjoy and regards,:thumbup:
Lowenstein

I cannot wait to see your match against a top level pro...bet you are gonna give that pro the breaks and the 8. So easy to criticize someone else's game when you havent done the same. It is hard playing these guys, the level of focus necessary to win a game or two is exhausting. I play quite often with one of the best players I have ever shot with (yes, a pro), I win a fair amount of games, sometimes some sets. One thing, it is never easy.

So Brian played a top level pro for 50 bucks and shit his pants, it happens. But he had the nuts to do so...havent seen your video and until I do I will consider you the best armchair quarterback in the league, but your bashing of a fellow player that had the nuts to step up and play a top level pro at his own expense is chickenshit, especially when you were purportedly in the room and could have challenged either of them on video on the spot...guess those nuts shriveled up before you got over there to offer him the 6 out huh?

Come on down to DFW and I will put you in a match with someone you have never heard of that will test that big mouth of yours...otherwise maybe you should hold on to that smart mouth criticism until you show your merit

JoeyInCali · Mar 9, 2020

BC21 said:
Lol... but according to Low Joe and Spider Dave I should've beaten DD because I have Poolology. Well, I missed two shots, and I didn't use Poolology on either one. Sure, if I would have used it on that 1 ball back cut then I would have made the shot, guaranteed. But I didn't use it, and that's that, which brings me to the point of this thread....

If I had started playing this game 35 years ago using an aiming method that provided an exact aim line for most cut shots, without relying on guesswork or my lousy inexperienced judgment back then, I believe my ball pocketing skills would've been developed much quicker and would today be more solid and consistent as a result. Or maybe not....

I mean, I understand that if I played more often, more than one or two nights a week, I would be more consistent anyway, regardless of how I initially learned to play or what aiming methods I choose to use now. Experience has proven that doing the same thing over and over will eventually lead to consistency. This is how skills are formed, how good habits are formed. Unfortunately, it's also how bad habits are formed.:embarrassed2:

Dodong has logged in thousands of hours in money matches.
And as Roy put it, drills for breakfast ,drills for lunch and drills for dinner at the basement.
And hell, he beat Dennis 11-1 in a major tournament .
Hell, he played Alex challenge match at the basement for 12 hours straight.
https://youtu.be/apdrMBwc-D0?t=1478
Shoots a combo, omg , he uses magic sweeps. Goes from the side of the door, skews to the center of the ball then shoots a combo.
:grin:

Low500 · Mar 9, 2020

Mkindsv said:
I cannot wait to see your match against a top level pro...bet you are gonna give that pro the breaks and the 8. So easy to criticize someone else's game when you havent done the same. It is hard playing these guys, the level of focus necessary to win a game or two is exhausting. I play quite often with one of the best players I have ever shot with (yes, a pro), I win a fair amount of games, sometimes some sets. One thing, it is never easy.
So Brian played a top level pro for 50 bucks and shit his pants, it happens. But he had the nuts to do so...havent seen your video and until I do I will consider you the best armchair quarterback in the league, but your bashing of a fellow player that had the nuts to step up and play a top level pro at his own expense is chickenshit, especially when you were purportedly in the room and could have challenged either of them on video on the spot...guess those nuts shriveled up before you got over there to offer him the 6 out huh?
Come on down to DFW and I will put you in a match with someone you have never heard of that will test that big mouth of yours...otherwise maybe you should hold on to that smart mouth criticism until you show your merit

"A fool and his money are soon parted".
I am no fool.
I also am not some kind of "expert" on everything from how to shoot pool, to music, to writing books, to selling books, to raising kids, to neurological analysis, to epidemiology, to just about anything you can think of.
I am nobody...absolutely nobody. I can watch and post opinions, though, based on experience and intelligent observations about human nature.
Perhaps you should take some of your own advice and counsel your hero to hold on to his all-knowing mouth...mmmmm??
Welcome to "Ignore Prison"....enjoy.
Bye.

BC21 · Mar 9, 2020

Mkindsv said:
......

So Brian played a top level pro for 50 bucks and shit his pants, it happens. But he had the nuts to do so...havent seen your video and until I do I will consider you the best armchair quarterback in the league, but your bashing of a fellow player that had the nuts to step up and play a top level pro at his own expense is chickenshit, especially when you were purportedly in the room and could have challenged either of them on video on the spot...guess those nuts shriveled up before you got over there to offer him the 6 out huh?

.....

I highly doubt Low500 was there. It's a small place, on a Tuesday night. What reason would a non-player from Georgia drive 7 or 8 hours to West Virginia just to sit and watch somebody play pool? And it was a league night. There were several people who came in just to have a chance to play Aranas. I knew them all. I had zero illusions of winning, but 50 is cheap for table time with a player of his caliber.

Anyway, I've now watched the match about 3 times, and I don't see anything close to me being nervous or scared or whatever. In fact, my demeanor was as relaxed as it always is. I was no differnet during my league games against non-worldclass competition, where I ran out 3 of 5 games, one while I was playing that little match with Aranas. For some moronic reason, non-players associate missed shots with nerves, or choking. But it's really the result of a lack of focus, like when you're just hitting balls with a friend, singing along with whatever song is playing, not giving the game the attention it demands. Had it been race to 7 or 9 for $500, then I would've had some sort of spot and would've taken it more seriously because there would've been a chance of actually winning. But playing even....lol...no one there was ignorant enough to expect to win anything from James Aranas.

Roy and DD and good people. Had a good time hanging out with them.

BC21 · Mar 9, 2020

JoeyInCali said:
Dodong has logged in thousands of hours in money matches.
And as Roy put it, drills for breakfast ,drills for lunch and drills for dinner at the basement.
And hell, he beat Dennis 11-1 in a major tournament .
Hell, he played Alex challenge match at the basement for 12 hours straight.
https://youtu.be/apdrMBwc-D0?t=1478
Shoots a combo, omg , he uses magic sweeps. Goes from the side of the door, skews to the center of the ball then shoots a combo.
:grin:

Awesome. Really great player. James is quiet, but Roy had a lot of great Alex and Dennis stories. Can't wait to see them again.

Allowable Margin for Error -- Contact Point vs Fractional Aim Point

BC21

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Low500

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