Antique Table Info & Help Please

JessEm

AzB Goldmember
Silver Member
I need some good price estimates for work on this table. Just to have an idea how much I might expect to pay for:

- Setup (not moving)
- Bumper and cloth replacement
- Any necessary "tweaking" to get play-ability within modern specs


How much money is "too much" to invest in this table?

Is this a good model? From a "performance" standpoint?

Any help is appreciated.
 

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Rubik's Cube

Pool Ball Collector
Silver Member
I can’t help with your questions, sir, but just wanted to congratulate you on such a beautiful table.

I hope it all works out well.
 

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
I can’t help with your questions, sir, but just wanted to congratulate you on such a beautiful table.

I hope it all works out well.

I agree....do whatever it takes...it’s a gem.

pt....raised on Monarch cushions...spends other people’s money freely...:smile:
 

JessEm

AzB Goldmember
Silver Member
I agree....do whatever it takes...it’s a gem.

Thanks for the responses. Agree on its beauty!

Point taken on the quoted sentiment, however, I'm working within a budget and do not have unlimited funds. Actually, at this point I'm trying to determine if diving into this is even feasible for me from a cost standpoint...?

Thanks again.
 

maha

from way back when
Silver Member
budget 1000 for cloth and new cushions. and etc, that may show up as a surprise.
might need new pockets for a few hundred or more.

and a couple thousand later on for a refinish by an average guy.

the table is totally worth it.

if you are moving it yourself just set it up and play on it first to see how you like it and what you want to fix.
 
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bradsh98

Bradshaw Billiard Service
Silver Member
It's a Brunswick Regina. Nice looking table, when properly restored. This particular table has seen some interesting repairs.

One thing to note: this table will never play like a modern table, as it has a T-rail design. In order to replace the cushions, you will need to have someone properly modify the rails, to accept a modern-day K55 cushion. This generally is not a cheap process. You'll probably also want to tighten up those bucket pockets while you are at it.. I'm thinking no less than $1200, to have a reputable person perform the work for you. That does not include tearing down and moving the table (if needed). It also does not include any restoration work.
 

Ron Padilla

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If you can get the table at a reasonable price pick it up and work on it over time, I am not a table mechanic but it could be worth something that can be cherished once put together! I had one similar years ago and sorry I didn’t find a way to keep it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

JessEm

AzB Goldmember
Silver Member
The responses are much appreciated.

I, too, agree with setting-up and playing for awhile before refinishing /restoring. One that note, I can refinish wood with the best of them. I'm not talking shabby-chic paint job. I'm talking about wood repairs, custom stains, toners, and a vast array of finishes... :) But moving along...

Anyone care to ballpark a "good" purchase price for this table as-is, in the midwest?
 

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's a tuff one. You don't want to insult the seller and his (possible) heirloom.

I'd want to offer 5-700, with the promise it will be gone quickly and seller will never hear from you again about it.

Cloth, move and setup near 1k, unless you do it yourself...and you still got no new rubber.

Plus, it is a t-rail.

The responses are much appreciated.

I, too, agree with setting-up and playing for awhile before refinishing /restoring. One that note, I can refinish wood with the best of them. I'm not talking shabby-chic paint job. I'm talking about wood repairs, custom stains, toners, and a vast array of finishes... :) But moving along...

Anyone care to ballpark a "good" purchase price for this table as-is, in the midwest?
 

bradsh98

Bradshaw Billiard Service
Silver Member
I wish that the pictures of the rails were more clear... The aprons do not look like the originals.. The pockets need to be redone.. It will need the rails updated for new cushions.. It's an antique, so the slates could be beat up/cracked/broken/covered in plaster.. The ball box has some "custom" brackets, which kill the aesthetics.

Value is determined on an individual basis. If it were me, I would have a hard time paying $300 for it. With what you will have into restoring it, and what it will be worth when completed, I might suggest no more than $500. But, others may disagree.

If you just want something to play on, that could potentially look decent, pay whatever it is worth to you. If you want a table that plays well and could have resale value, find something different.
 

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
It's a Brunswick Regina. Nice looking table, when properly restored. This particular table has seen some interesting repairs.

One thing to note: this table will never play like a modern table, as it has a T-rail design. In order to replace the cushions, you will need to have someone properly modify the rails, to accept a modern-day K55 cushion. This generally is not a cheap process. You'll probably also want to tighten up those bucket pockets while you are at it.. I'm thinking no less than $1200, to have a reputable person perform the work for you. That does not include tearing down and moving the table (if needed). It also does not include any restoration work.

They still make T-rail rubber....snooker and 3-tables....
...so maybe pool rubber also?

Plus the rubber might still be good....I’ve played on 60 year old Monarch rails.
....they need hitting to liven them up if they’ve been unused for some time.
 

JessEm

AzB Goldmember
Silver Member
Their asking price is $1500. It's already taken apart, with pictures mapping how it goes back together. The slate is on a pallet (3 pieces), and the base and table is one piece. They have machinery to load on a trailer.

"The pool table is 9’ long, the slate is 1” thick with a backer board also 1 “ thick. The slate is in very good condition."

Given this tables value in restored condition, I'm somewhat surprised by the pricing here. I was expecting a little more. But then, as usual, I'm sure I'm underestimating the work involved. :)
 

JessEm

AzB Goldmember
Silver Member
I'm looking at this table not only as a table I can use, but also as an investment.

I think the realistic value fully restored is $5000-$6000?

I'm very concerned about what's going on with the apron (board under the top rail around outer edge). As mentioned, it doesn't match or look original. It looks like the wrong species, and I believe the 3rd picture shows knots... Torn on whether to drive 1.5 hours each way, to find out it's some kind of hack job...
 
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CESSNA10

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I need some good price estimates for work on this table. Just to have an idea how much I might expect to pay for:

- Setup (not moving)
- Bumper and cloth replacement
- Any necessary "tweaking" to get play-ability within modern specs


How much money is "too much" to invest in this table?

Is this a good model? From a "performance" standpoint?

Any help is appreciated.

Looks like a Brunswick regina from the 1920's. If so I owned one for 15 years
and the table plays very well.
 

bradsh98

Bradshaw Billiard Service
Silver Member
They still make T-rail rubber....snooker and 3-tables....
...so maybe pool rubber also?

Plus the rubber might still be good....I’ve played on 60 year old Monarch rails.
....they need hitting to liven them up if they’ve been unused for some time.


Perhaps the current rubber is good. It's not likely to be the original rubber (which would be closer to 100 years old). But, to be modified to current specs (as was the request in the initial post of the OP), the pockets will need to be adjusted, which will require new rubber. To change the rubber, I would bet that the sub-rails will still require modification, even if it has been performed in the past.

I think you are confused on styles of rails and cushion rubber.. "T-rail" refers to the design of the rail. It has nothing to do with the sub-rail, or what cushion is mounted to it. Carom rubber is different from snooker rubber, which is also different from pool rubber. But, it has nothing to do with the design of the rail. However, there are different styles of pool rubber, which ARE dependent on the design of the rail.

Common pool cushion profiles are: K55, K66, U23
 

bradsh98

Bradshaw Billiard Service
Silver Member
I'm looking at this table not only as a table I can use, but also as an investment.

I think the realistic value fully restored is $5000-$6000?

I'm very concerned about what's going on with the apron (board under the top rail around outer edge). As mentioned, it doesn't match or look original. It looks like the wrong species, and I believe the 3rd picture shows knots... Torn on whether to drive 1.5 hours each way, to find out it's some kind of hack job...

In my honest opinion, the table certainly has had a bit of hackwork, in its history. Just how much remains to be seen.

In regards to fully restored value, I think $5000 is a bit high. I believe that it could take years to ever have an offer that high. As with most things, it would take quite a bit of work to find the right buyer, for the right price. To get that table refinished to the point that it could be worth $5000, I believe it would require a significant investment in time, and quite a fair financial investment.

You would have to figure on new:
-cloth
-cushions
-extensive rail work
-replacement rail aprons
-recovered pockets

Plus, all of the work to fill/patch the damaged wood and the Brunswick logo, and then the time and money spent on advertising.

After the investment, you would have a very beautiful table, and you may never even consider the resale value.
 

Ssonerai

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Their asking price is $1500. It's already taken apart, with pictures mapping how it goes back together. The slate is on a pallet (3 pieces), and the base and table is one piece.

My wife bought a ca 1926 9' BBC "Royal" at auction last year and i'm still working up to restoring it (she knew what she was doing - it forces me to do work on the house delayed for past 20 yrs, such as pouring piers, setting steel W8 ("I beams") and lally columns in multiple places in the cellar so far. Then there's the actual remodeling upstairs still to be done :( )

Relating to your table Q's: She paid $400. When i go there & took the table apart, a mover onsite took pity & "volunteered" 2 muscle bound kids to carry the slates downstairs from the second floor pool room and put them on my truck to help "those poor old folks :) ". I tipped them a $50 each. So total cost was $500 + some gas.. Buddy helped me unload in shop. (He might not still be my buddy, though, not sure).

Some things about your table look better, some maybe worse (skirts). Wife's has one slate that will need a couple significant repairs that don't affect playing field, but have to be done well to hold T-rails on.

After removing the center & cross pieces, your table frame should come apart into 2 each end sections consisting of 2 legs and stretcher connecting them; and then just 2 long thick heavy dimension rails. Look on the inside faces for the pocket bolts.

My wife's table was originally ball return, but has been "converted" to drop pockets in the past. I'd like to put it back to ball return, but the drop pockets are quicker, and to some extent may look nicer than the original ball return style. Depends how well done they are.

Your rail caps are Brazilian rosewood, but that might not matter depending how you decide to reduce the pockets and re-cut the rail angle for modern rubber. Sometimes the pocket irons have split them as well so might be better to just make new rails and subrails if you have the facility & some really hard wood for caps, like pau fero, bocote, or such. Some tables of that style were actually quartersawn white oak; and relatively dense mahogany or African mahogany would work. So would black walnut if dense boards are selected. Skirts on yours should be mahogany. The ones in the picture look like 1 x 4's from Lowe's. They don't do anything, so might be perfectly adequate if you throw a faux finish on.

I'm curious about the "knobs" that sort of seem to be sticking out from under the rails in some of your photos - is it a convertible table?

Here's another link to a catalog with more extensive pages on your table and the type of build. Click on any of the pages. 1921 catalog

https://brunswick.pastperfectonline.com/library/BE2318F7-790A-4767-A769-227526524695

1923
https://brunswick.pastperfectonline.com/library/A7120730-053F-42DB-96C6-138254745490

smt
 
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