★ Aiming Systems ★ Techniques ★ Etc.

JoeyA said:

Aiming systems and techniques that some people SELL are not necessary for everyone. That is the cold-blooded truth. You can still go hit a million balls and you might reach Nirvana or not......

However, I have thought on this A LOT. Everyone knows that there isn't an aiming system out there or a technique that I don't like. I have purposefully kept an open mind about every aiming system and every technique used by others and the bottom line is they all work for some people, sometimes a lot of people.

We aren't all built the same, physically, mentally or emotionally and that's why there are all these different ways that people suggest that you can play and improve your game.

While there is a cookie-cutter method of playing pool, it isn't for everyone BECAUSE we don't all see things the same way.

For those of you that dislike or hate (PUT IN YOUR MOST HATED SYSTEM HERE), because it doesn't work for YOU, don't think it doesn't work for SOMEONE ELSE, because it DOES. It might not help YOU, but it does help others. So instead of running behind every thread that offers another option for aiming, shooting or playing and pissing in those cheerios, consider that someone else who doesn't see things just as you do, might just be helped by that particular aiming system.

I have made it a life-long work of learning and appreciating the way different people play pool. I have probed the minds of the best pool players on the planet. I have paid for pool lessons from the best pool players on the planet. They all offer UNIQUE perspectives about how they see things and how they accomplish things and you should consider this before admonishing things that haven't helped you. Please consider that you might not need (or find it valuable) that particular piece of the puzzle but someone else MIGHT and you could be the one preventing them from improving their pool game. We aren't all made alike.

Just sayin......

JoeyA

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Nice post JoeyA.

Personally I enjoy working with different pool ideas. Its a lot of fun to work with a new idea.
I have picked up quite a few ideas from contributors on this and other forums.

This game is a never ending learning process. I guess that's why I'm still with it for over 50 years.

I don't shoot anyone's contributions down. If its been posted I take it to the table, try it out, if it works for me great, if it doesn't that's cool. Like you have stated, an idea may be what has been holding back a player to move forward in this game.

Thanks man. :smile:

John

Aiming Systems/DirtyWord

Nice Subject Joey,
Kudos on that.

I came back to playing in 2005 and I had been on Pool Retirement for some time and had lost a lot of what I viewed as the old instincts. So when I realized that I was building a house back from very little my mission was to find and catalog a way to get the player....back....or into a knowing state where he understood how to control his Instincts making him/her a much more Natural and better player.

Then I became a member here and I have learned a lot about Pool and a lot about people and a lot about this silly Aiming Argument. The reason I say its silly is what is so wrong with anyones Aiming Mechanism if it involves someone playing pool?

I cant find much wrong with it although I have at times taken sides in the Aiming War so to speak.

What I think is extremely ridiculous is some of the arguments that I see where Purists argue over some minute point of pool that they declare or maintain is traditional and therefore blessed by them.

Many players do great things but yet do not understand how to tell people how they do what they do and when they do try and describe it, here come the Purist Police and knock the guy until he doesn't come back anymore.....now...being fair to the Purists some peoples only mission in life is marketing and making a living out of Pool and that in itself isn't so bad everyone has to have a little action to make it work so I try not to hate on folks.

So in the purist view it seems to me the word.......System.....has become the pariah of all things and it is that way out of the product of a closed mind and possibly prejudiced by looking at some Systems.

All in all it seems we here are at a quandary of sorts over aiming. To me this is very silly. I shouldn't care how you aim a Center Ball shot. I should care if you fire it in with spin and get position on me and run out the rack.

That to me seems like the best thing to argue about and not proclaim that this system or that is going to take over the world, come on man, its only pool and pool is supposed to be easy as possible to play and fun to attract new people.

This is my rant so Rock On!

[QUOTE=JoeyA;5333595]Aiming systems and techniques that some people SELL are not necessary for everyone. That is the cold-blooded truth. You can still go hit a million balls and you might reach Nirvana or not......

However, I have thought on this A LOT. Everyone knows that there isn't an aiming system out there or a technique that I don't like. I have purposefully kept an open mind about every aiming system and every technique used by others and the bottom line is they all work for some people, sometimes a lot of people.

We aren't all built the same, physically, mentally or emotionally and that's why there are all these different ways that people suggest that you can play and improve your game.

While there is a cookie-cutter method of playing pool, it isn't for everyone BECAUSE we don't all see things the same way.

For those of you that dislike or hate (PUT IN YOUR MOST HATED SYSTEM HERE), because it doesn't work for YOU, don't think it doesn't work for SOMEONE ELSE, because it DOES. It might not help YOU, but it does help others. So instead of running behind every thread that offers another option for aiming, shooting or playing and pissing in those cheerios, consider that someone else who doesn't see things just as you do, might just be helped by that particular aiming system.

I have made it a life-long work of learning and appreciating the way different people play pool. I have probed the minds of the best pool players on the planet. I have paid for pool lessons from the best pool players on the planet. They all offer UNIQUE perspectives about how they see things and how they accomplish things and you should consider this before admonishing things that haven't helped you. Please consider that you might not need (or find it valuable) that particular piece of the puzzle but someone else MIGHT and you could be the one preventing them from improving their pool game. We aren't all made alike.

Just sayin......

JoeyA[/QUOTE]

JoeyA said:

Aiming systems and techniques that some people SELL are not necessary for everyone. That is the cold-blooded truth. You can still go hit a million balls and you might reach Nirvana or not......

However, I have thought on this A LOT. Everyone knows that there isn't an aiming system out there or a technique that I don't like. I have purposefully kept an open mind about every aiming system and every technique used by others and the bottom line is they all work for some people, sometimes a lot of people.

We aren't all built the same, physically, mentally or emotionally and that's why there are all these different ways that people suggest that you can play and improve your game.

While there is a cookie-cutter method of playing pool, it isn't for everyone BECAUSE we don't all see things the same way.

For those of you that dislike or hate (PUT IN YOUR MOST HATED SYSTEM HERE), because it doesn't work for YOU, don't think it doesn't work for SOMEONE ELSE, because it DOES. It might not help YOU, but it does help others. So instead of running behind every thread that offers another option for aiming, shooting or playing and pissing in those cheerios, consider that someone else who doesn't see things just as you do, might just be helped by that particular aiming system.

I have made it a life-long work of learning and appreciating the way different people play pool. I have probed the minds of the best pool players on the planet. I have paid for pool lessons from the best pool players on the planet. They all offer UNIQUE perspectives about how they see things and how they accomplish things and you should consider this before admonishing things that haven't helped you. Please consider that you might not need (or find it valuable) that particular piece of the puzzle but someone else MIGHT and you could be the one preventing them from improving their pool game. We aren't all made alike.

Just sayin......

JoeyA

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joeyA
great post.......:thumbup:.......:thumbup:
whether you think one system is bull or not
tearing down is not productive
live and let live
to each his own on how to aim
my 3 cents

JoeyA said:

Aiming systems and techniques that some people SELL are not necessary for everyone. That is the cold-blooded truth. You can still go hit a million balls and you might reach Nirvana or not......

However, I have thought on this A LOT. Everyone knows that there isn't an aiming system out there or a technique that I don't like. I have purposefully kept an open mind about every aiming system and every technique used by others and the bottom line is they all work for some people, sometimes a lot of people.

We aren't all built the same, physically, mentally or emotionally and that's why there are all these different ways that people suggest that you can play and improve your game.

While there is a cookie-cutter method of playing pool, it isn't for everyone BECAUSE we don't all see things the same way.

For those of you that dislike or hate (PUT IN YOUR MOST HATED SYSTEM HERE), because it doesn't work for YOU, don't think it doesn't work for SOMEONE ELSE, because it DOES. It might not help YOU, but it does help others. So instead of running behind every thread that offers another option for aiming, shooting or playing and pissing in those cheerios, consider that someone else who doesn't see things just as you do, might just be helped by that particular aiming system.

I have made it a life-long work of learning and appreciating the way different people play pool. I have probed the minds of the best pool players on the planet. I have paid for pool lessons from the best pool players on the planet. They all offer UNIQUE perspectives about how they see things and how they accomplish things and you should consider this before admonishing things that haven't helped you. Please consider that you might not need (or find it valuable) that particular piece of the puzzle but someone else MIGHT and you could be the one preventing them from improving their pool game. We aren't all made alike.

Just sayin......

JoeyA

Click to expand...

Well said.

There is a difference between running down, bad mouthing CTE, and questioning the statements made about CTE.

People are gonna do what they want to. They can read and decided for themselves what to use and not.

There are no cookie cutter type systems, because as you stated, everyone is different.

It is up to every player to decided for themselves and to expect some of the statements made about CTE to go unquestion does more harm then good.

Both side of the story need to be out there so a player can make the best possible choice on what to use and even possible to come up with there on way at of all the various discussions.

Besides, according to Stan, there is no stopping CTE, it's world wide, so there really is no need for this thread. Nothing said can stop the growth of CTE, so why the concern?

When they are ready....

JoeyA,
You mentioned taking lessons and being curious as to how people best learn. This has been a curiosity of mine as well and here are a few observations.

Basically there is only one of my observations that matter concerning how people learn.

People will learn when its time for them to and that will not happen until they are ready to be receptive regardless of what method you teach.


Most people see a pool table and are immediately curious to test their skill at making balls in games. So its that drive that makes people want to play. Until they realize that they aren't going to get any better its almost useless to offer them advice because they just want to have fun.

When they get to that stage there should be easy ways to introduce them to pool and work with a higher chance of getting them to continue playing experiencing improvement.

The amazing thing to me is the lack of simple marketing techniques to get more people to come down and see how much fun pool can be. We all know here that pool is fun but no one seems to want to promote it.

In this way it seems that the room owner is just like the beginning pool player that will get better when he is ready to and not a minute before but what is amazing is to watch a pool room close up and no reasonable marketing efforts were made.

Pool is quite a conundrum in that everyone wants to be able to do it themselves and be left alone until they are ready,

duckie said:

There is a difference between running down, bad mouthing CTE, and questioning the statements made about CTE.

People are gonna do what they want to. They can read and decided for themselves what to use and not.

There are no cookie cutter type systems, because as you stated, everyone is different.

It is up to every player to decided for themselves and to expect some of the statements made about CTE to go unquestion does more harm then good.

Both side of the story need to be out there so a player can make the best possible choice on what to use and even possible to come up with there on way at of all the various discussions.

Besides, according to Stan, there is no stopping CTE, it's world wide, so there really is no need for this thread. Nothing said can stop the growth of CTE, so why the concern?

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Thanks Greg.

I'm glad you said it.

336Robin said:

JoeyA,
You mentioned taking lessons and being curious as to how people best learn. This has been a curiosity of mine as well and here are a few observations.

Basically there is only one of my observations that matter concerning how people learn.

People will learn when its time for them to and that will not happen until they are ready to be receptive regardless of what method you teach.


Most people see a pool table and are immediately curious to test their skill at making balls in games. So its that drive that makes people want to play. Until they realize that they aren't going to get any better its almost useless to offer them advice because they just want to have fun.

When they get to that stage there should be easy ways to introduce them to pool and work with a higher chance of getting them to continue playing experiencing improvement.

The amazing thing to me is the lack of simple marketing techniques to get more people to come down and see how much fun pool can be. We all know here that pool is fun but no one seems to want to promote it.

In this way it seems that the room owner is just like the beginning pool player that will get better when he is ready to and not a minute before but what is amazing is to watch a pool room close up and no reasonable marketing efforts were made.

Pool is quite a conundrum in that everyone wants to be able to do it themselves and be left alone until they are ready,

Click to expand...

Hi Robin,

In most cities there are a host of marketing a advertising vehicles available from the more expensive TV & Radio ads to economical fliers & coupon type magazines & then there is the best & least costly method which is word of mouth.

Many business owners just don't understand advertising & do not see it as good investment because they can not usually track it. That's why the best method for that is usually a redeemable coupon of some kind placed in print such as in the newspaper, mail delivered magazine or coupon pack, or a simple flier of some kind.

Some owners will say my business in fine & don't realize that that is just the time to advertise while they can afford to do it & make it a part of their operating budget. Customers leave all the time for a variety of reasons & owners need to pull in new ones to replace them or there is a gradual slide that often times can not be stopped when the business gets beyond a certain point.

So... Yes room owners should be advertising for one reason or the other.

Sorry for the detour, Joey, but this may be an even more important topic.

Best Wishes to All.

Learning new things keeps the mind young. Great post Joey.

duckie said:

There is a difference between running down, bad mouthing CTE, and questioning the statements made about CTE.

People are gonna do what they want to. They can read and decided for themselves what to use and not.

There are no cookie cutter type systems, because as you stated, everyone is different.

It is up to every player to decided for themselves and to expect some of the statements made about CTE to go unquestion does more harm then good.

Both side of the story need to be out there so a player can make the best possible choice on what to use and even possible to come up with there on way at of all the various discussions.

Besides, according to Stan, there is no stopping CTE, it's world wide, so there really is no need for this thread. Nothing said can stop the growth of CTE, so why the concern?

Click to expand...

He never even mentioned CTE. Get lost.

Good Point!

8pack said:

The arguing has never been about the system, rather the claims attached to them.
Take that away(the claims), I think all is good. You've been around a lot of player's, I'm sure there's been a few things that made you think, you cant be serious. And they was.:smile:

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Good Point. I think you are Objectively right! lol

8pack said:

The arguing has never been about the system, rather the claims attached to them.
Take that away(the claims), I think all is good. You've been around a lot of player's, I'm sure there's been a few things that made you think, you cant be serious. And they was.:smile:

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<<<:thumbup2:>>>

336Robin said:

Good Point. I think you are Objectively right! lol

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<<<:thumbup2:>>>

8pack said:

The arguing has never been about the system, rather the claims attached to them.
Take that away(the claims), I think all is good. You've been around a lot of player's, I'm sure there's been a few things that made you think, you cant be serious. And they was.:smile:

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I don't know. CJ'S TOI system is supposedly all the rage.

^^^^^^^^^

Joey,

Threads often don't stay on the original specific track, especially when there are suggestive undertones.

The thing is... no one really disagreed with what you said.

The undertones are a different story.

To characterize those that disagree with the undertones as 'devils' by using the word 'pitchforks' does no real good, just as another calling them 'haters' also does no real good.

Best Wishes.

PS Just where & in what direction did you expect this 'THREAD' to go?

The value of a particular perception

You are right about the cookie cutter methods, the value of them and that everyone is different and some things help others and some people see little value in many things.

People who buy my book call me and they tell me how their shot making has changed, improved etc and they tell what works and doesn't seem to be working for them. These conversations I hear and can tell where they are and usually give them an alternative way of looking at something that helps them. I am amazed at how many different things people can do or cannot do because they don't really think that some small thing is important when it really is.

I glean a lot from these conversations and get to note that what works for one definitely might not work for another.

What I am finding is there is a blend of natural perception abilities as well as methods and depending on where a person is in their ability to perceive will depend on what they like and no small thing can be ignored as important to people.

I think this drivel about Objectivity not being Objective or the word System becoming a dirty word among feel players is crazy.

The word Objective is a descriptive term. Anything that you can do in order to simplify something makes it more Objective and easily seen and understood.

I understand the context in which some people disagree with the use of the term but in the end its much ado about nothing. I wish I hadn't posted it in my recent post. I was poking fun but I can tell it was set to light up an argument between the same people for the same thing that might stretch on for a millennia until someone succumbs to old age.

The aiming argument while important to some has become a destructive force in pool. If you use the word System...internet savyy feel players all over the world throw up silver crosses as if to ward off vampires.

There is nothing completely objective if it involves playing pool because a pool player has to perform the protocols but certain actions in pool can lend to objectivity and easy of playing for a lot of people.

The user will be the judge. So what if someone buys a dvd, book or whatever and decides this isn't for me. The author is there trying to help someone with their game and once the material is out they really cant take it back, their advice is their stock in trade.

People and what pleases them is so Subject to what they might prefer that its hard to draw similarities amongst the things that works for a broad range of people.

So you do the best you can and you offer your help. You do it out of a love for the game regardless if you are making any money or not. That is about all you can do. I have tried to make my material simple, accurate and easy to work with and I've gotten good feedback so far. I have been able to help those that ask. There is always room for improvement and I offer help to people who want to be better at spinning their cue ball.

It would not matter if I came out with the perfect easy aiming system and a complete code for the application of English tomorrow because their would be those people who would say I don't like it.

So you do the best you can do and then you learn what works for you and go support your local poolroom and learn to play the games.

This is why I would love to see more matches between people on here who promote the use of One Aiming System or another. I think it would be interesting and maybe when some people get their butts kicked they would think maybe I need to take a look at what old so and so does because he plays great. Ultimately its about spinning your ball, getting position and getting out. Your aiming system may not help with all of that.

JoeyA said:

Apparently some of the posters got this thread, while others didn't.

There ARE cookie cutting systems for playing pool that have helped and will continue to help the vast majority of people playing pool.

There ARE also unique aiming systems and techniques employed by professional players, that we don't understand completely.

Sometimes, conventional methods of training just aren't good enough to accelerate one's pool game to the level desired.

Unique systems and techniques will continue to be invented and introduced regardless of your opinions.

IT IS APPARENT TO ME THAT EVERY AIMING SYSTEM HAS HELPED SOME PEOPLE PLAY BETTER POOL. But that's not the point.

This thread isn't about one particular aiming system. Some people just cannot put down their pitch-fork. It really is kind of sad.

JoeyA

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JoeyA said:

Apparently some of the posters got this thread, while others didn't.

There ARE cookie cutting systems for playing pool that have helped and will continue to help the vast majority of people playing pool.

There ARE also unique aiming systems and techniques employed by professional players, that we don't understand completely.

Sometimes, conventional methods of training just aren't good enough to accelerate one's pool game to the level desired.

Unique systems and techniques will continue to be invented and introduced regardless of your opinions.

IT IS APPARENT TO ME THAT EVERY AIMING SYSTEM HAS HELPED SOME PEOPLE PLAY BETTER POOL. But that's not the point.

This thread isn't about one particular aiming system. Some people just cannot put down their pitch-fork. It really is kind of sad.

JoeyA

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My Bad!

I thought your post was trying to protect the system guy's from us naysayers.

PS -- I think everyone already knows one shoe doesn't fit all.