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KenRobbins
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07-27-2019, 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imac007 View Post
Do you have a physical or mental key?
Is it different for big stakes?
When itís not important does that require a different strategy?

Everything is situational.
Tell us the situation and your "go to".
I'm not in top form now and it matters little to me. All I need to do is spend a solid week dedicating it to table time and I should be good to go. I don't let myself think anything otherwise.

My mental key is "you'll never amount to anything." That was repeatability said to me when I was a child. That person is my opponent no matter who it is at the table.
  
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07-27-2019, 12:37 PM

my strategy for gambling when not in top form

i am assuming not in top form means,on tilt,broke down,discouraged' lousy attitude

my first rule is quit for the day,go home sell the cue that let me down,lick my wounds and

stay away until i feel like playing,survival with the bankroll in tact is the name of the game
m
when i feel right away,i try to get a game that i can win big money,ask for more weight
and play again

most of the time when i quit i compliment my oppent,admit i underestimated him,
say something like "you play with a lot of heart,i needed more weight,you shoot good,"

so when i come back,we adjust and jack the beti never play to try to get my money back,i want his too and jacking the bet is my favorite way back
  
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07-27-2019, 04:53 PM

[QUOTE ] I play the same whether Iím playing good or bad.


There is something about that statement that confuses me, and yet I understand it perfectly.

Reminds me of that famous quote I can never remember

something about a couple of streakers at Yankee stadium- yogi is asked what sex they were and he said he had no idea cause they had bags over their heads.

He was then asked to join some friends for dinner at a popular restaurant,to which he replied nobody goes there anymore it's too f'n crowded.

But the ops quote does rebut the notion that insanity is the definition of doing something the same way every time and still expecting different results

As to the original question - like another poster said I slow down concentrate on my PSR and relax my grip on the butt end,tighten my bridge hand , make sure to keep my head down until the object ball is pocketed or reaches its destination.if I'm still not playing well and 9 ball is the game, I break out the crop and start riding like sea biscuit
  
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Strategy when not in top form
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Strategy when not in top form - 07-27-2019, 05:34 PM

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Originally Posted by 9BallKY View Post
I play the same whether Iím playing good or bad.


I kind of get what youíre saying, but not sure it translates for me.

When Iím not playing well, I try to play better. If Iím playing well, I try to play the same. I donít just keep trodding along telling myself this is how I play and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnít.

Being able to tighten the screws when needed, is a very valuable tool. If I had one tool to do that, it is a good Pre-Shot Routine!


Sent from my iPhone using AzBilliards Forums

Last edited by Scratch85; 07-27-2019 at 09:54 PM.
  
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07-27-2019, 07:58 PM

Good thread. Agreed that sticking to your pre-shot routine is critical, but even when you do, you'll have slumps.

The best rule of thumb is that you must always play within yourself. That said, what constitutes playing within yourself can change with the peaks and valleys of your game.

When you gamble, you should have a game plan, and that plan should incorporate a means of accurately playing within yourself.
  
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07-28-2019, 04:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by garczar View Post
SLOW DOWN and get a good pre-shot routine established. Play 'cinch' pool aka make the damn ball. Take tougher shape if you have to.
When it isnít your turn, focus on your breath. In through nose for a 3 count, hold for a second, out through mouth for 6 count.
  
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jay helfert
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07-28-2019, 04:35 AM

Change cues for awhile.


http://www.jayhelfert.com/ to order More Pool Wars
  
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Imac007
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07-28-2019, 09:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichSchultz View Post
When it isn’t your turn, focus on your breath. In through nose for a 3 count, hold for a second, out through mouth for 6 count.
Part of the idea of problem solving is to identify what is the real problem. Too often we let generalizations dictate both the problem and solution. Yesterday in a mini tourney my cue ball got away from me a tad and ended up in the jaws of the corner pocket. I decided that the next shot would be a diagonal shot to the side pocket, about half way along the line to side. Scratching in the side pocket because of the straightness emerged as an issue. The scratch, since I was hitting the ball with top due to the position, the cb would run more than a lower struck ball. The table runs fast so I needed controlled pace. The fullness of hit would take most momentum so the solution was to control the follow pace by not reaching the pocket. The second problem of course is awkward cueing and keeping the cue travel straight. I lined up the shot. Finding the direct line from cue ball to object ball my focus moved to the front of the cue ball not the face. The contact points dead center on each ball need to collide, on straight shots. Finding a stable spot for my open bridge, I shot the shot, cued straight, shot straight and nicked the near jaw, missing. Why?

I let the way we generalize things tell me it was a straight in shot. We often look where center to center points. In my case just a little over an inch into the pocket. It need to be an inch and an eighth or more. Looking down the center to center line I missed the difference that made a difference.

Despite the length of the description, this all happened in a reasonable time frame. In a timed event I doubt I would need to use an extension. What occurred in retrospect is two fold. The term I use for what happened is "ball bound". The awkward cueing put undue focus on the cue ball. When my focus extended to the object ball and pocket it triggered the two problems. Once I decided on a solution to the pace problem, my mind became bound by the cueing and straightness challenge. I never saw the "real problem". It was minutely off straight. The other problems and solutions remained true with a slight modification, a tiny aim adjustment was needed.

The pro solution of course is to look at the balls edge to edge, from both ends, not center to center. Being "ball bound" kept me on the cue ball end of the shot. The solution to "boundness" is to get the view from distance. If I had got down and looked at the shot from at least three feet away, I would have questioned the straightness. The semi-blocked view, being in the jaws, would have made me look at the shot from the side pocket end.

The quiet mind method proposed by the comment above, is a good activation lowering answer. If you are over excited it helps bring your level down. This is a time to ask what the real problem is. Many players with dialogue going on in their mind think they need to quiet the mind. While it’s true that an inward focus results from high stress, not all inner dialogue is of that variety. An inner dialogue about what is happening on the table is really an outwardly, engaged narrative. Thinking you should have a quiet mind can actually create stress and a problem, when none existed. Seeing the actual details of the game in full detail, transitioning to looking at the bigger picture of the table, potential problems, solutions and strategies are pro behaviors. You can get "bound" on your inner mind instead of the game, when in your chair.

The solution above is right for the right problem. There are no wrong answers only solutions to specific problems. What is the "real" problem is the first problem.

Last edited by Imac007; 07-28-2019 at 11:16 AM.
  
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Having a plan
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Imac007
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Having a plan - 07-28-2019, 02:44 PM

The presupposition of this topic is that a player should have a contingency plan. The word strategy was used. There is a strategy saying; "targets dictate weapons, weapons dictate movement". What you choose as a target limits the tactics you can use to achieve it. The pocket is not the whole "target" here. The target is much more. Itís also what you want to do with the cue ball. Constraints like this often limit our ability to implement a plan to get our game back on track.

I think the best tactic is avoiding falling out of form. A preshot routine combined with a mindset trigger can go a long way towards that goal. That said, the best laid plans often fall apart in the face of battle.

The take your time, slow down often mentioned here is such a contingency. It works in the right conditions and right situations. Instead of looking at the responses here as a magic bullet, look at them within the constraints created by the situation. Choice of tactics is your greatest resource. Skill level dictates what resources you can use successfully. Good decision making depends on the availability of options. Choosing wisely is central to any strategy.

Thanks to all posters for continuing to share their arsenal of weapons against the battle of the self on the table.

Last edited by Imac007; 07-29-2019 at 01:13 PM.
  
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KenRobbins
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07-28-2019, 03:16 PM

Everyone is wired differently. My way of thinking is what pushes me beyond my limits/comfort zone to push me to the edge to try and better myself. I do this with whatever I do. It all comes down to how bad do you want it, then take that to the practice table.

If you want to keep your game on track, it all starts at the practice table. After that, everything should be automatic.

After all the work, have fun finding a good tournament with 9ft tables and the expenses that come along with it to get use to the tournament settings. lol
  
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Imac007
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07-29-2019, 01:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by KenRobbins View Post
Everyone is wired differently. My way of thinking is what pushes me beyond my limits/comfort zone to push me to the edge to try and better myself. I do this with whatever I do. It all comes down to how bad do you want it, then take that to the practice table.

If you want to keep your game on track, it all starts at the practice table. After that, everything should be automatic.

After all the work, have fun finding a good tournament with 9ft tables and the expenses that come along with it to get use to the tournament settings. lol
Taking responsibility for our own performance and results leads us to strive to be a better version of ourselves, provided we have the motivation and patience. I like Effrenís routine. He puts the balls spread on the table then with a random ball in hand start, attempts to run the balls. It isnít a break then ball in hand, ghost ball setup. Itís easier. He appears to have a mindset that says when the balls are straight forward I need to make them. If he misses he either pushes the missed ball to a hole and continues or sets it up again so that he mentally records a successful version of the shot. Real games situations, not drills, are his way. Of course, a certain level of skill is needed to clear the balls without missing. However, finding out how far into the run before missing and then continuing is important. The number of balls on the table change the dynamic. Current skill level will dictate the nature of the situation difficulty.
  
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07-29-2019, 03:22 PM

When i have a bad night at the tables it is all mental. I get down on a shot and think about my grip or stoke and ask myself "am i doing this right"?

For those nights I try and just get down and shoot. I guess it just depends on why you are off that night
  
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KenRobbins
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07-29-2019, 10:47 PM

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Originally Posted by Imac007 View Post
Taking responsibility for our own performance and results leads us to strive to be a better version of ourselves, provided we have the motivation and patience. I like Effrenís routine. He puts the balls spread on the table then with a random ball in hand start, attempts to run the balls. It isnít a break then ball in hand, ghost ball setup. Itís easier. He appears to have a mindset that says when the balls are straight forward I need to make them. If he misses he either pushes the missed ball to a hole and continues or sets it up again so that he mentally records a successful version of the shot. Real games situations, not drills, are his way. Of course, a certain level of skill is needed to clear the balls without missing. However, finding out how far into the run before missing and then continuing is important. The number of balls on the table change the dynamic. Current skill level will dictate the nature of the situation difficulty.
Being in top form for tournaments, you have to shoot in a lot of them. Right now I'd get slaughtered in a tournament, even if I don't miss any balls on the practice table or do good matching up.

My weakness in tournaments is the sitting and waiting game. I do my best just walking in a place, play and leave. If I have to sit for an hour or more, I lose interest so quick no matter how hard I try to keep the interest alive. As long as I'm shooting, I can shoot for hours.

If I could shoot in a couple tournaments a month on 9ft tables near my location with matching up, I might be able to do well. But chasing just the few tournaments a year and the cost, just isn't practical to me. I gave up trying to figure that strategy out. Every man has his limitations and I found mine. lol
  
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Imac007
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08-01-2019, 10:42 PM

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Originally Posted by KenRobbins View Post
Being in top form for tournaments, you have to shoot in a lot of them. Right now I'd get slaughtered in a tournament, even if I don't miss any balls on the practice table or do good matching up.

My weakness in tournaments is the sitting and waiting game. I do my best just walking in a place, play and leave. If I have to sit for an hour or more, I lose interest so quick no matter how hard I try to keep the interest alive. As long as I'm shooting, I can shoot for hours.

If I could shoot in a couple tournaments a month on 9ft tables near my location with matching up, I might be able to do well. But chasing just the few tournaments a year and the cost, just isn't practical to me. I gave up trying to figure that strategy out. Every man has his limitations and I found mine. lol
Giving up is an option and this is your decision to make. Reading between the lines there is a player with a passion who wrote this. Years ago I ran across a game called "equal offense". It was based around straight pool. The thing is it starts from a break, then basically ball in hand. An inning is limited to 20 balls, straight pool style. The neat thing about the game was an opponent on site wasn’t needed. The game was made to address your competition issue. You could play against another player anywhere using any game. You each start from the same scenario. A scoring system is needed giving each ball weight. In order to give some value to safety, a point could be awarded if it is called and successful. The inning is then over either way but keeps safety play in the game. You would specify a number of innings for a match and compare scores. The players don’t need to even play at the same time.

A forum like this could be used to actually set up matches. Like minded players could set up tournaments. This format was used prior to all the mobile devices with video. When I played trust was a major issue. Another issue is comparable equipment since each player is using a different table. Pool hall owners and billiard instructors could tap into this format. They could arrange for matches between students they are training. Instructors often link up with players from different regions. Letting players play and develop without the expense of travel and entry fees in a competitive scenario addresses a problem for players such as Ken.

Other players use the ghost as a format simulating an opponent. The point is that the issues listed by Ken are just that; problems. Creating constraints on how things need to be to solve a problem creates a McGyver test. Chasing a dream sometimes means people have to be creative.

The competition mindset is another issue. Creativity in excuse making is not a tactic. Not meant to be harsh. Meant to emulate what you likely would say to someone who was frustrated, saying they want to quit, but really don’t. Try something different when what you are doing doesn’t work.

Distractions can be a botch. I simplify. Getting out of the venue is a good idea. Find something like staying down, finishing the stroke, or quiet eyes, a behavior you need on every shot. Dedicate your time away from the table to different kinds of imagined shots, with that behavior there in every imagined case. You say you can shoot for hours, shoot in your head. Ingrain a good behavior while you do.

In venue behavior needs to have its own pre-game/in-game routine to handle issues not pool related. I don’t initiate conversation. I’m not rude, I answer if talked to but don’t sustain conversation threads.

Keep your eye on the tournament ball. Make sure you know what to do, where to go, how to tick all the not at the table boxes. Check and organize your equipment, your away from the table space, and needed resources, like water, bathroom locations. Get your ducks in a row.

Distractions in the room, while playing. Bookmark your on table activity. Give your full attention to whatever has drawn your attention away. It usually is over quickly or gets boring real fast. Then "ok where was I". I sometimes even restart by vocalizing the on-table situation. "Oh yeah, that 3 ball can go there and the cue ball needs to come in this area for the 4 so I have angle to get to...". Stopping then talking to yourself may seem strange, but getting distracted, missing the shot or position can sit you in a chair. I prefer to be at the table. When you vocalize, hearing your voice and its directions focused on the table, keeps you out of your head. An outward focus on what needs doing.

Each thing here was a solution to a problem. Have a plan, not an excuse. If the plan fails, so be it, at least you tried. Meant to be helpful, not judgmental. Other players reading this thread may relate to your problem and not want to quit, just want ideas.

Last edited by Imac007; 08-02-2019 at 07:31 AM.
  
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08-02-2019, 04:54 AM

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Originally Posted by garczar View Post
SLOW DOWN and get a good pre-shot routine established. Play 'cinch' pool aka make the damn ball. Take tougher shape if you have to.
Not sure I completely agree with that. You have to play your at your normal tempo that you've always played with in both your practice time and in your tournament matches or $ sessions, and the same pace that you've played your best pool with. Self confidence and the mental game is such a huge factor in pool and if you're struggling and you slow down and you change your pre-shot routine and start thinking too much, results aren't always good.

Last edited by ChrisinNC; 08-02-2019 at 04:58 AM.
  
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