Go Back   AzBilliards.com > Main Category > Main Forum
Reload this Page Big action, Kevin Cheng vs DD
Reply
Page 15 of 15 « First 5131415
 
Share Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old
  (#211)
jay helfert
Shoot Pool, not people
jay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond repute
 
jay helfert's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 26,920
vCash: 500
iTrader: 136 / 100%
Join Date: Nov 2004
   
08-03-2019, 06:28 PM

What most of you guys don't get is there is a big difference in being a good money player and being a good tournament player. You can argue about Fargo ratings all day long and what they don't take into account is how a player handles gambling for big money. Some can do it and some get a little weak in the knees. Remember Fargo ratings are based solely on tournament matches.

I spoke with Dennis about this very match last night and he wasn't at all surprised. Dudong has never been one of the top money players in the PI. Chua on the other hand is stronger in this respect. I will only add this. Most of those guys ahead of Dennis in the Fargo ratings would not dare to gamble with him.

Another example might be Bergman's upcoming match with Shane. On paper (and Fargo) Shane is rated much higher, as was Shaw, who first lost to Bergman and then ducked him the second time around. If they did a separate Fargo rating based on money matches, it would look a whole lot different than the current one based on tournament matches alone.

Chohan hasn't done that well in One Pocket tournaments, but you won't find many (or any for that matter) of the One Pocket champs that want to tangle with him for big bucks.

I hope I've made my case here.


http://www.jayhelfert.com/ to order More Pool Wars
  
Reply With Quote

Old
  (#212)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member

iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 11,174
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
08-03-2019, 06:49 PM

Mike has said he actually does put in exhibition/streamed/gambling matches as long as they are pre-announced. Maybe being streamed was another qualifier, I forget.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#213)
BeiberLvr
AzB Silver Member
BeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond reputeBeiberLvr has a reputation beyond repute
 
BeiberLvr's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 7,831
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
   
08-03-2019, 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
What most of you guys don't get is there is a big difference in being a good money player and being a good tournament player. You can argue about Fargo ratings all day long and what they don't take into account is how a player handles gambling for big money. Some can do it and some get a little weak in the knees. Remember Fargo ratings are based solely on tournament matches.

I spoke with Dennis about this very match last night and he wasn't at all surprised. Dudong has never been one of the top money players in the PI. Chua on the other hand is stronger in this respect. I will only add this. Most of those guys ahead of Dennis in the Fargo ratings would not dare to gamble with him.

Another example might be Bergman's upcoming match with Shane. On paper (and Fargo) Shane is rated much higher, as was Shaw, who first lost to Bergman and then ducked him the second time around. If they did a separate Fargo rating based on money matches, it would look a whole lot different than the current one based on tournament matches alone.

Chohan hasn't done that well in One Pocket tournaments, but you won't find many (or any for that matter) of the One Pocket champs that want to tangle with him for big bucks.

I hope I've made my case here.

The best players are the ones that can do both at a high level, but at the end of the day, I'd still rate being a great tournament player as a better level of success.

Any pool player that says they'd take being known as a great money player over a world champion is lying.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#214)
skogstokig
AzB Silver Member
skogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond reputeskogstokig has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 774
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Yurop
   
08-03-2019, 11:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
What most of you guys don't get is there is a big difference in being a good money player and being a good tournament player. You can argue about Fargo ratings all day long and what they don't take into account is how a player handles gambling for big money. Some can do it and some get a little weak in the knees. Remember Fargo ratings are based solely on tournament matches.

I spoke with Dennis about this very match last night and he wasn't at all surprised. Dudong has never been one of the top money players in the PI. Chua on the other hand is stronger in this respect. I will only add this. Most of those guys ahead of Dennis in the Fargo ratings would not dare to gamble with him.

Another example might be Bergman's upcoming match with Shane. On paper (and Fargo) Shane is rated much higher, as was Shaw, who first lost to Bergman and then ducked him the second time around. If they did a separate Fargo rating based on money matches, it would look a whole lot different than the current one based on tournament matches alone.

Chohan hasn't done that well in One Pocket tournaments, but you won't find many (or any for that matter) of the One Pocket champs that want to tangle with him for big bucks.

I hope I've made my case here.
and some supposedly good match up players can't handle big tournaments. shot clock, restricted number of smoke breaks, drug testing, etc might play a role as well
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#215)
gxman
AzB Silver Member
gxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond reputegxman has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Online
Posts: 4,539
vCash: 500
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: South Louisiana
   
08-04-2019, 09:18 AM

Before I started following pool, but I think I've heard it mention that Parica was the top money match player, while Efren, Earl, etc were the best tournament player.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#216)
highkarate
AzB Silver Member
highkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond reputehighkarate has a reputation beyond repute
 
highkarate's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 684
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2012
Location: L.A.
   
08-04-2019, 09:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Black-Balled View Post
Do we think aranas plays as well as Chua? Kiamco? Gomez?

I don't.
I would say he's not as good as Chua, but he's better than Kiamco, Gomez, handful of other guys. I remember seeing videos on youtube a few years ago of Ignacio giving him the 6-ball and beating him. Obviously he's magnitudes better now, but he only has a couple years experience competing at the top level. His tournament results are pretty good though.


thats just like, your opinion man

Last edited by highkarate; 08-04-2019 at 09:54 AM.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#217)
one stroke
AzB Silver Member
one stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond reputeone stroke has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 6,128
vCash: 500
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chesapeake Beach
   
08-04-2019, 09:44 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
What most of you guys don't get is there is a big difference in being a good money player and being a good tournament player. You can argue about Fargo ratings all day long and what they don't take into account is how a player handles gambling for big money. Some can do it and some get a little weak in the knees. Remember Fargo ratings are based solely on tournament matches.

I spoke with Dennis about this very match last night and he wasn't at all surprised. Dudong has never been one of the top money players in the PI. Chua on the other hand is stronger in this respect. I will only add this. Most of those guys ahead of Dennis in the Fargo ratings would not dare to gamble with him.

Another example might be Bergman's upcoming match with Shane. On paper (and Fargo) Shane is rated much higher, as was Shaw, who first lost to Bergman and then ducked him the second time around. If they did a separate Fargo rating based on money matches, it would look a whole lot different than the current one based on tournament matches alone.

Chohan hasn't done that well in One Pocket tournaments, but you won't find many (or any for that matter) of the One Pocket champs that want to tangle with him for big bucks.

I hope I've made my case here.
There are 5 ahead of DO , Wu , Shane ,Filler ,Shaw .and Chang, I see 2 that he's the favorite against , Wu and Shaw ,,

1
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#218)
jay helfert
Shoot Pool, not people
jay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond reputejay helfert has a reputation beyond repute
 
jay helfert's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 26,920
vCash: 500
iTrader: 136 / 100%
Join Date: Nov 2004
   
08-05-2019, 04:34 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by one stroke View Post
There are 5 ahead of DO , Wu , Shane ,Filler ,Shaw .and Chang, I see 2 that he's the favorite against , Wu and Shaw ,,

1
And only one (Chang) who has shown a willingness to gamble with him.


http://www.jayhelfert.com/ to order More Pool Wars
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#219)
gypsy_soul
AzB Silver Member
gypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond reputegypsy_soul has a reputation beyond repute
 
gypsy_soul's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 825
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Aug 2009
   
08-05-2019, 05:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
What most of you guys don't get is there is a big difference in being a good money player and being a good tournament player. You can argue about Fargo ratings all day long and what they don't take into account is how a player handles gambling for big money. Some can do it and some get a little weak in the knees. Remember Fargo ratings are based solely on tournament matches.

I spoke with Dennis about this very match last night and he wasn't at all surprised. Dudong has never been one of the top money players in the PI. Chua on the other hand is stronger in this respect. I will only add this. Most of those guys ahead of Dennis in the Fargo ratings would not dare to gamble with him.

Another example might be Bergman's upcoming match with Shane. On paper (and Fargo) Shane is rated much higher, as was Shaw, who first lost to Bergman and then ducked him the second time around. If they did a separate Fargo rating based on money matches, it would look a whole lot different than the current one based on tournament matches alone.

Chohan hasn't done that well in One Pocket tournaments, but you won't find many (or any for that matter) of the One Pocket champs that want to tangle with him for big bucks.

I hope I've made my case here.





Oh I totally understand but let them figure it out on their own lol .... Nobody held our hand through the learning process. I have a buddy that plays tournaments everyday but boy if you put that heat on him for the cash he will fold like a paper bag !
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#220)
CreeDo
Fargo Rating 597
CreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond reputeCreeDo has a reputation beyond repute
 
CreeDo's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 9,036
vCash: 500
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: New England
  Send a message via AIM to CreeDo  
08-05-2019, 08:14 AM

I dunno, I don't think this proves Dodong's not a top money player,
or is a good example of how Fargo can get it wrong.

The final score in games was 65-67.
Dodong ran a 7 pack, it's not like he was shaking.
And it's not like he's rarely in action, or rarely wins.

Fargo has them within 2 points of each other, and after 132 racks there's only a 2 game difference.
So I'd say Fargo nailed it.

Sure, Dodong's lost some high profile money matches, but those are to very strong players like Biado,
and he doesn't lose by much. Fargo was pretty close on that one too.

I think if they played many sets, we'd see Dodong win about half of them.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#221)
Mich
AzB Silver Member
Mich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond reputeMich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 190
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Jun 2016
   
08-05-2019, 08:27 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeiberLvr View Post
The best players are the ones that can do both at a high level, but at the end of the day, I'd still rate being a great tournament player as a better level of success.

Any pool player that says they'd take being known as a great money player over a world champion is lying.
Completely agree.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#222)
FeelDaShot
AzB Silver Member
FeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond reputeFeelDaShot has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 471
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Nov 2017
   
08-05-2019, 08:40 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CreeDo View Post
I dunno, I don't think this proves Dodong's not a top money player,
or is a good example of how Fargo can get it wrong.

The final score in games was 65-67.
Dodong ran a 7 pack, it's not like he was shaking.
And it's not like he's rarely in action, or rarely wins.

Fargo has them within 2 points of each other, and after 132 racks there's only a 2 game difference.
So I'd say Fargo nailed it.

Sure, Dodong's lost some high profile money matches, but those are to very strong players like Biado,
and he doesn't lose by much. Fargo was pretty close on that one too.

I think if they played many sets, we'd see Dodong win about half of them.
Dodong is also constantly improving. I've been following his progress for at least 3 years now and he's always getting better. The Dodong that lost in money matches to Biado and Ignacio a year ago is not the same Dodong as today. Meanwhile, I haven't noticed any improvement out of Biado and Ignacio.
  
Reply With Quote
Reply
Page 15 of 15 « First 5131415

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.