Hall of Fame Shoo-Ins

kkdanamatt · May 3, 2020

Definite future BCA Hall of Fame Inductees:
Shane Van Boening
Dennis Orcollo
Thorsten Hohmann
Ronnie O'Sullivan
Stephen Hendry
Steve Davis
Torbjörn Blomdahl
Semih Saygıner
Frédéric Caudron
Dick Jaspers

Possible, but a bit too early to tell
Jayson Shaw
Ko Ping Chung
Jung Lin Chang

Possible for "Meritorious Service"
Jay Helfert
Philip Capelle
Mike Panozzo

Possible, if the HOF were to open up a "Veteran's Category"
Ronnie Allen
Marshall Carpenter
Jack Breitkopf (Jersey Red)

Are there any other players deserving of entering the BCA Hall of Fame?

Cornerman · May 3, 2020

kkdanamatt said:
Definite future BCA Hall of Fame Inductees:
Shane Van Boening
Dennis Orcollo
Thorsten Hohmann
Ronnie O'Sullivan
Stephen Hendry
Steve Davis
Torbjörn Blomdahl
Semih Saygıner
Frédéric Caudron
Dick Jaspers

Everyone after Hohmann arent shoo ins as they didn’t get shod in.

I would have thought Hohmann is a shoo in, and I hope he still will be. But Corey and Neils havent made it in, and they weren’t close. If those two had been close, I’d like Thorsten’s chances better.

kkdanamatt · May 3, 2020

Cornerman said:
Everyone after Hohmann arent shoo ins as they didn’t get shod in.
I would have thought Hohmann is a shoo in, and I hope he still will be. But Corey and Neils havent made it in, and they weren’t close. If those two had been close, I’d like Thorsten’s chances better.

Hi Freddie,
I don't think Corey and Neils have won many world titles, 2 each, I think.
I know that only one national or international title is a requirement, but I think Thorsten has won more money and has more titles than either Corey or Neils. Am I correct?

Also, why do you not think that the snooker and billiard players whom I listed are not shoo-ins?
Aside from Raymond Ceulemans, they have won more national and international titles during the past 50 years.

Cornerman · May 3, 2020

kkdanamatt said:
Hi Freddie,
I don't think Corey and Neils have won many world titles, 2 each, I think.
I know that only one national or international title is a requirement, but I think Thorsten has won more money and has more titles than either Corey or Neils. Am I correct?

How many World Titles do you think they need?

Corey changed the game and has significant titles in several disciplines.

Niels is a multi-world champion.multi-Mosconi MVP, and has more than enough résumé to gain entry.

Also, why do you not think that the snooker and billiard players whom I listed are not shoo-ins?
Aside from Raymond Ceulemans, they have won more national and international titles during the past 50 years.

They’re not shoo ins from the simple fact that they’re not in. Worthiness has nothing to do with it, nor does public opinion. They all have reached the right age of eligibility, but none of them are in. Therefore, they’re not shoo ins.

The premise of the BCA Hall of Fame is that the player have some level of significant USA titles and impact as well as international WPA titles since the BCA is part of the WPA. Ceulemans won a World Title in Las Vegas. But his induction was still eyebrow raising.

Can a player make it with only significant international titles? Maybe, but if Davis and Hendry aren’t ever mentioned, then it would be awfully tough for any of the others to get any votes. It would be difficult for a player to get in to only have WPA titles with no significant USA titles. For example, will Wu get in? We’ll see.

sjm · May 3, 2020

Other than Shane, the biggest shoo-in Hall of Famer among pool players is Niels Feijen, who is, without question, one of the best pool players of all-time having won WPA sanctioned world championships in both 9-ball and straight pool, countless European championships, the World Pool Masters, the World Cup of Pool, and the Challenge of Champion, along with dozens of other titles. Other than Souquet, Niels is probably the best European pool player of all time. Hohmann should get in at some point, and Orcullo's chances can't be taken lightly.

As we know, however, worthiness doesn't get you in. Strickland waited and waited until he finally got in.

The time will tell category should start with Josh Filler, whose resume already exceeds that of those listed, and is far more likely than any of them to end up in the Hall.

In the meritorious service category, my list would start with Mark Griffin. whose already amazing credentials were recently enhanced by the conception by CSI of the WPA sanctioned Diamond 10-ball and the reintroduction of the WPA World 10-ball Championship.

Cornerman · May 3, 2020

sjm said:
Other than Shane, the biggest shoo-in Hall of Famer among pool players is Niels Feijen.

And shockingly to me, Niels wasn’t shoo’d in. He needs a campaign manager.

We have Thorsten added to the ballot this year. He ought to be a shoo-in. Dennis Orcullo is also eligible this year. Should be a shoo-in.

Corey
Niels
Thorsten
Orcullo

TATE · May 3, 2020

Orcullo and Corey Deuel should be in there in the not too distant future.

For cue making, I would like to see Gus Szamboti in there. Bob Meucci deserves a mention, but I imagine there would be controversy there. Kelly Fisher is not in the HOF yet. Jeremy Jones, as a player, fine coach and commentary - I respect him so much and think his best is yet to come. Keith McCready, the hustler of hustler's. If Keith would have stuck with competitive pool longer, he would have been a shoo-in.

sjm · May 3, 2020

Cornerman said:
And shockingly to me, Niels wasn’t shoo’d in. He needs a campaign manager.

No, the Hall of Fame committee needs to wake up and stop devaluing the accomplishments of those that have played most of their pool in Europe.

Ralf Souquet, the best European pool player of all-time by far, was eligible in 2009, but didn't get in until 2011.

Oliver Ortmann, world champion at both 9-ball and straight pool, and probably the third best-ever European player of all-time behind Souquet and Feijen, didn't get in until he was 47.

Seems Niels, who was probably a top 15 player in the world for 15 straight years, might have to wait, just as Souquet and Ortmann did, simply for the mistake of never having moved to America. For shame!

In contrast, Appleton and Immonen, two elite European players who moved to America early in their careers and were fixtures in American pool for many years each got in when they were 41. Neither had the career Feijen had. Hohmann is also a European who moved to America early in his career and was a fixture in American pool. If he gets in before Feijen, it will further evidence the bias the HOF voters have in favor of those who were US residents during their playing primes, because Feijen's list of titles dwarfs that of Hohmann if all world pool events are included.

evergruven · May 3, 2020

sjm said:
No, the Hall of Fame committee needs to wake up and stop devaluing the accomplishments of those that have played most of their pool in Europe.

Ralf Souquet, the best European pool player of all-time by far, was eligible in 2009, but didn't get in until 2011.

Oliver Ortmann, world champion at both 9-ball and straight pool, and probably the third best-ever European player of all-time behind Souquet and Feijen, didn't get in until he was 47.

Seems Niels, who was probably a top 15 player in the world for 15 straight years, might have to wait, just as Souquet and Ortmann did, simply for the mistake of never having moved to America. For shame!

In contrast, Appleton and Immonen, two elite European players who moved to America early in their careers and were fixtures in American pool for many years each got in when they were 41. Neither had the career Feijen had. Hohmann is also a European who moved to America early in his career and was a fixture in American pool. If he gets in before Feijen, it will further evidence the bias the HOF voters have in favor of those who were US residents during their playing primes, because Feijen's list of titles dwarfs that of Hohmann if all world pool events are included.

wow..didn't know it was like that

from the bca hall of fame (https://bca-pool.com/general/custom.asp?page=4):

"A Tradition of Greatness Over Four Decades: Recognizing Outstanding Players and Contributors since 1966.

The purpose of the Billiard Congress of America Hall of Fame is to honor outstanding people who, through their competitive skills and dedication, have enriched our sport and industry.

Two categories have been established in Billiard Congress of America's Hall of Fame. The Greatest Player category shall be reserved for outstanding players who have been active in national or international competition for at least 20 years and have won at least one national or international championship. The Meritorious Service category shall be reserved for those who have made lasting, memorable and important contributions to billiards.

To date (through 2019) a total of 77 individuals have been inducted; 57 in the player category and 20 meritorious service honorees."

admittedly their club is selective
but according to their own criteria
guys like ralf, niels, and thorsten
should be in there like swimwear

Cornerman · May 4, 2020

kkdanamatt said:
Possible, but a bit too early to tell
Jayson Shaw
Ko Ping Chung
Jung Lin Chang

I'd add:

Wu Jiaqing
Ko Pin Yi
Joshua Filler

Filler has nearly 2 decades to wait, but he's likely.

kkdanamatt said:
Possible for "Meritorious Service"
Jay Helfert
Philip Capelle
Mike Panozzo

I would add:

Jerry Brieseth
Mark Griffin
Bob Jewett
Grady Matthews
Mike Howerton
Dave Alciatore

kkdanamatt said:
Possible, if the HOF were to open up a "Veteran's Category"
Ronnie Allen
Marshall Carpenter
Jack Breitkopf (Jersey Red)

Are there any other players deserving of entering the BCA Hall of Fame?

Not sure what you mean "if the HOF were to open a "Veteran's Category"?

All of these guys are potential candidates on the Veterans category. This year is a Veterans Category year, so it should be interesting again. Mataya will be on the ballot again, for sure.

sjm · May 4, 2020

Cornerman said:
Jerry Briesath.

Great idea. Not only has Jerry been, arguably, the greatest ever American pool instructor, be if you watch him in action, he often teaches for free. He'll often spend time on the fly, especially with young players, at both Super Billiards Expo and at Derby City just for the love of the game. Jerry is a shining example of a legendary instructor who teaches for all the right reasons, shows unswerving commitment to the game, and he'd be a very deserving inductee.

goettlicher · May 4, 2020

kkdanamatt said:
Definite future BCA Hall of Fame Inductees:
Shane Van Boening
Dennis Orcollo
Thorsten Hohmann
Ronnie O'Sullivan
Stephen Hendry
Steve Davis
Torbjörn Blomdahl
Semih Saygıner
Frédéric Caudron
Dick Jaspers

Possible, but a bit too early to tell
Jayson Shaw
Ko Ping Chung
Jung Lin Chang

Possible for "Meritorious Service"
Jay Helfert
Philip Capelle
Mike Panozzo

Possible, if the HOF were to open up a "Veteran's Category"
Ronnie Allen
Marshall Carpenter
Jack Breitkopf (Jersey Red)

Are there any other players deserving of entering the BCA Hall of Fame?

Jerry Briesath
Gary Benson RIP

Keith E. · May 4, 2020

sjm said:
Great idea. Not only has Jerry been, arguably, the greatest ever American pool instructor, be if you watch him in action, he often teaches for free. He'll often spend time on the fly, especially with young players, at both Super Billiards Expo and at Derby City just for the love of the game. Jerry is a shining example of a legendary instructor who teaches for all the right reasons, shows unswerving commitment to the game, and he'd be a very deserving inductee.

Don't forget him instructing/showing/talking at the International in Norfolk. A Jerry Brieseth fan here, by the way.

Keith

michael4 · May 4, 2020

Cornerman said:
Corey changed the game and has significant titles in several disciplines.

Niels is a multi-world champion.multi-Mosconi MVP, and has more than enough résumé to gain entry.

They’re not shoo ins from the simple fact that they’re not in. Worthiness has nothing to do with it, nor does public opinion. They all have reached the right age of eligibility, but none of them are in. Therefore, they’re not shoo ins.

Seems to me that the HOF in every sport often makes worthy (but younger) candidates wait until "the time is right" whatever that means

Cornerman · May 4, 2020

michael4 said:
Seems to me that the HOF in every sport often makes worthy (but younger) candidates wait until "the time is right" whatever that means

I don't disagree. But consider PGA that up until very recently used an objective point-count method that have had a high percentage of their inductees as active, highly competitive participants.

It's not an easy answer, especially when there are so many worthy candidates from the far past, near past, and current time.

pt109 · May 4, 2020

Cornerman said:
I'd add:

Wu Jiaqing
Ko Pin Yi
Joshua Filler

Filler has nearly 2 decades to wait, but he's likely.

I would add:

Jerry Brieseth
Mark Griffin
Bob Jewett
Grady Matthews
Mike Howerton
Dave Alciatore

Not sure what you mean "if the HOF were to open a "Veteran's Category"?

All of these guys are potential candidates on the Veterans category. This year is a Veterans Category year, so it should be interesting again. Mataya will be on the ballot again, for sure.

I feel Fong-pang Chao is overdue.
Two world 9-ball titles...three Tournament of Champions titles...many others.

I consider Chao as the father of Taiwan pool...he showed them the way.

sjm · May 4, 2020

Keith E. said:
Don't forget him instructing/showing/talking at the International in Norfolk. A Jerry Brieseth fan here, by the way.

Keith

I didn't forget it, just didn't know about it, but it is consistent with the assertion that Jerry is so much more than a legendary instructor, but instead a role model for and a great ambassador for pool.

Cornerman · May 4, 2020

pt109 said:
I feel Fong-pang Chao is overdue.
Two world 9-ball titles...three Tournament of Champions titles...many others.

I consider Chao as the father of Taiwan pool...he showed them the way.

That’s a real good point, PT. Fong Pang Chao was one of the cleanest runout players I’ve ever seen.

kkdanamatt · Nov 28, 2020

BCA....Billiard Congress of America
'Nuff said.

Black-Balled · Nov 28, 2020

Where does mika fit in?

Hall of Fame Shoo-Ins

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