Stroke related

Ralph Kramden

BOOM!.. ZOOM!.. MOON!
Silver Member
I'm sure it's more often stroke related. Aiming itself is stroke related: it's harder to learn to aim with a gun that doesn't shoot straight.

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The above quote is posted by Patrick Johnson in a thread on the Main forum.
I think this may be the best explanation of why shots are unknowingly missed.

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cookie man

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm sure it's more often stroke related. Aiming itself is stroke related: it's harder to learn to aim with a gun that doesn't shoot straight.

.
The above quote is posted by Patrick Johnson in a thread on the Main forum.
I think this may be the best explanation of why shots are unknowingly missed.

.

But i don't think Patrick actually aims. Seems he just makes sub conscience adjustments along with some head movement
 

Vorpal Cue

Just galumping back
Silver Member
It's the bob, bob bob... bob, bod you're aim technique. Tried it and it don't no nuthin' for me.
 

cookie man

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
lol

My stalkers have arrived (now it's whatever thread I'm mentioned in).

Have you guys thought of trying girls?

pj
chgo

Stalkers lmao. You think too highly of yourself.

Of course posting stupid stuff like you do, you have to expect that people will tease you just a bit about it.
 

Michael Andros

tiny balls, GIANT pockets
Silver Member
lol

My stalkers have arrived (now it's whatever thread I'm mentioned in).

Have you guys thought of trying girls?

pj
chgo


I love 'em but I go bust EVERY SINGLE TIME I get near one. So I've given up all that stuff. Now I just read... ( VERY cheap books )
 

nine_ball6970

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm sure it's more often stroke related. Aiming itself is stroke related: it's harder to learn to aim with a gun that doesn't shoot straight.

.
The above quote is posted by Patrick Johnson in a thread on the Main forum.
I think this may be the best explanation of why shots are unknowingly missed.

.

I have said before that aiming systems should be tested with a digicue blue to make sure user is not steering to pocket balls.

Balls seem to find the pocket more often when there is no steer in the stroke. Funny how that works.
 

Imac007

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
A straight gun without marksmanship is "Spray 'n' Pray"

Principles are foundational concepts. Einstein taught us that every situation is relative. That relativity means evaluation criteria and subsequent measurements are unique to each situation. Principles transcend those measures and what makes them principles is that, they are true in every context. Jimmy White and Ronnie O’ Sullivan spoke of three of pool’s principles. The first was to step forward onto the line of the shot. The second was to cue straight and the third was to stay down.

The original quote "I'm sure it's more often stroke related. Aiming itself is stroke related: it's harder to learn to aim with a gun that doesn't shoot straight." A pro golfer a few years back was on a tear with his putter. When asked about it he said the key was his confidence in putting the ball down the intended line. He said that it allowed him to focus on the pace of the shot. The same truth applies here with position. That said, the insight goes much deeper. In my early days learning the game I asked a good player how to aim. He told me I could spend years shooting balls and maybe learn how to make every kind of shot or I could spend time that would shorten the journey. He said shooting at a ball and seeing where it went only works if you shoot at the ball the same way every time. He said to learn the angles you first have to hit the ball predictably. Only when the ball goes straight to a target can we trust the feedback we get. This is where staying down is so important. If you are moving around after you hit the ball, the feedback is lost. So first I had to learn to hit something predictably.

We were at a snooker table. He had me go to the D. Then he took a package of paper matches and one by one he placed them perpendicular to the rail along the end and side rails at the opposite end. Each head barely was over the edge. If I hit the head directly the match would be driven off the cushion at 90°. Anything else was a miss. Each match head was a target from the D initially.

Once I could hit match heads from all angles, balls were introduced. The contact point on the ball was located. The description of that point is that it is the point on the object ball diametrically opposite the pocket opening. In other words the farthest point on the ball away from the target. It’s also the center of the ball. This description is important. I was learning to think about the ball in a three dimensional way. That point became my match head. The rounded surfaces were about me driving the cue ball around the table producing controlled collisions..

Like the golfer, once I could trust that I could hit a target, I could focus on position. That tutelage taught me how to locate the target and then aim to hit it. Del Hill made the point though that a straight cue isn’t enough, you need to aim https://youtu.be/AwdUk7CGT7Y

For those who don’t know about Del, he found and developed Ronnie O’Sullivan. An article https://www.thestar.co.uk/sport/sno...onnie-o-sullivan-and-stephen-hendry-1-7837783 tells part of his story.

When teaching on a pool table I use toothpicks instead of match heads. Then I start with balls near the pocket. As each ball is made I add distance. A miss brings the ball back closer. This is mastery learning. You want a massive library of successful execution. You will miss many shots if aiming is taking second place to cueing thoughts. And this is not an aiming system. There is a real target and the shooter has learned to hit a real spot, that’s marksmanship.

The step on the line principle of Ronnie and Jimmy, is about aiming. The target is acquired. The head is looking down the target line the ball will take. The stance sets the rest of the body and the cue on the line. The cueing straight principle has the bridge and head on the line. Del, in the video, tells the shooter to now move the chest to the cue, next he closes his eyes on a 10 foot shot.. The cue is now on line. Any movement of the cue grazes the chest along the chest to bridge line preventing lateral movement. The head poised directly over the cue need not touch the cue but any significant upward movement of the cue would contact the chin provided that principle three, staying down, is adhered to. With no sideways movement and limited vertical, pace and height of contact for positioning can become the focus. Once aim and ball path has been determined, position can become the primary focus.

Possibly the worst question a player can ask themselves is what did they do wrong on a shot? Getting the mind to generate a million ways it could miss is negative imagery, rehearsing to miss. Probably the answer lies in violation of one of the three principles. It’s about what the player didn’t do. Step into shot (aim), sniper position for straight shooting with secondary target acquisition (cue ball position), now stay still during execution and after. The principles of the stroke are a separate topic.
 

Ralph Kramden

BOOM!.. ZOOM!.. MOON!
Silver Member
Possibly the worst question a player can ask themselves is what did they do wrong on a shot? Getting the mind to generate a million ways it could miss is negative imagery, rehearsing to miss. Probably the answer lies in violation of one of the three principles. It’s about what the player didn’t do. Step into shot (aim), sniper position for straight shooting with secondary target acquisition (cue ball position), now stay still during execution and after. The principles of the stroke are a separate topic.

This ^^^^^^^ is good advice IMO
 

Ralph Kramden

BOOM!.. ZOOM!.. MOON!
Silver Member
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IMO you should always practice your stroking fundamentals first.

Many years ago I was told by a older gentleman to remember this
statement... Straight cue - Straight through.. Any type of aiming
system, without focus on your stroking fundamentals, is essentially
worthless. Any player.. with practice.. can aim, but the problem is..
your CB must be hit where you think you're aiming. It can't happen
with a crooked stroke when hitting the CB. Aiming is stroke related.

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