Inside English, Outside English Definition

pocket

pocket

AzB Silver Member
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Please don't devolve this into an aiming thread. I am simply trying to understand terms.

Obviously I'm slow on the uptake because I can't get my head around how some define those terms.

Isn't it just "outside english" would be away from the pocket you are shooting at, and "inside english" would be towards the pocket?

I had someone explain it to me at league and I just couldn't understand the definition given.
 
C

Ched

"Hey ... I'm back"!
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I always took it to mean the inside angle of the shot .. less than 180 degrees ... and outside being the larger angle more than 180 degrees. But maybe we're saying the same thing in different ways.
 
pt109

pt109

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Check post # 13 in your dime shaped thread.
....don't feel bad about this confusion....George Fels was calling it the opposite until we
convinced him in a thread a few years ago.

A famous player years ago also called inside english "CHECK" and outside english "RUN"...
...until I showed him that both could be either run or check.
 
C

Ched

"Hey ... I'm back"!
Silver Member
pt109 said:
Check post # 13 in your dime shaped thread.
....don't feel bad about this confusion....George Fels was calling it the opposite until we
convinced him in a thread a few years ago.

A famous player years ago also called inside english "CHECK" and outside english "RUN"...
...until I showed him that both could be either run or check.
Click to expand...

I've heard the term "running english" a lot (following the natural angle) - but "check" is a new term to me. I'm guessing it comes from the term "checked up" as in NASCAR (slowing down, holding a spot) ... or "check" as in poker - just hold your bet (no raise).
 
pocket

pocket

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
pt109 said:
Check post # 13 in your dime shaped thread.
....don't feel bad about this confusion....George Fels was calling it the opposite until we
convinced him in a thread a few years ago.

A famous player years ago also called inside english "CHECK" and outside english "RUN"...
...until I showed him that both could be either run or check.
Click to expand...

Your diagram in that thread makes it completely obvious. Thanks!
 
pt109

pt109

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Ched said:
I've heard the term "running english" a lot (following the natural angle) - but "check" is a new term to me. I'm guessing it comes from the term "checked up" as in NASCAR (slowing down, holding a spot) ... or "check" as in poker - just hold your bet (no raise).
Click to expand...

I look at check or run by what the cue-ball does when it hits a rail.
 
hang-the-9

hang-the-9

AzB Silver Member
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pt109 said:
Check post # 13 in your dime shaped thread.
....don't feel bad about this confusion....George Fels was calling it the opposite until we
convinced him in a thread a few years ago.

A famous player years ago also called inside english "CHECK" and outside english "RUN"...
...until I showed him that both could be either run or check.
Click to expand...

Inside will always shorten the natural angle of the cueball after it hits the rail, I can't picture a shot where you can use inside english and make it do what "running english" does. From what I picture things on the table, running english goes along with the natural path of the cueball after contact and and sharpens the angle of rebound. Of course if you have a shot that is hit at 0 degrees (dead on), then you can use either inside or outside to create a running english effect. Say shooting at a ball from spot to spot using top left or top right. Since there is no "angle" of rebound, there is technically no inside or outside spin.
 
Cornerman

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
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hang-the-9 said:
Inside will always shorten the natural angle of the cueball after it hits the rail, I can't picture a shot where you can use inside english and make it do what "running english" does. From what I picture things on the table, running english goes along with the natural path of the cueball after contact and and sharpens the angle of rebound. Of course if you have a shot that is hit at 0 degrees (dead on), then you can use either inside or outside to create a running english effect. Say shooting at a ball from spot to spot using top left or top right. Since there is no "angle" of rebound, there is technically no inside or outside spin.
Click to expand...

Uh oh....

If the first cushion isn't adjacent/connected to the pocket, you have every possibility where inside is running english. The standard three-railer opening break in 3C is such a shot (disregarding that you're not potting a ball). It's used many times in pool.

It all depends on what angle the cueball is heading toward the cushion. In fact, just a standard follow three railer, even if the cushion is connected, is almost always running english.


Freddie
 
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pt109

pt109

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hang-the-9 said:
Inside will always shorten the natural angle of the cueball after it hits the rail, I can't picture a shot where you can use inside english and make it do what "running english" does. From what I picture things on the table, running english goes along with the natural path of the cueball after contact and and sharpens the angle of rebound. Of course if you have a shot that is hit at 0 degrees (dead on), then you can use either inside or outside to create a running english effect. Say shooting at a ball from spot to spot using top left or top right. Since there is no "angle" of rebound, there is technically no inside or outside spin.
Click to expand...

You're in good company....but not correct.
Picture the black-ball on its spot at snooker....
...picture the cue-ball three inches above dead on...towards the pink spot.
If you make the shot with high inside, it runs....low inside checks.
If you make the shot with high outside, it checks....low outside runs.
 
captainjko

captainjko

Kirk
Silver Member
See the picture below.... It is a Picasso drawing...... lol... In the shot below, if you strike the cue ball on the left side , it is inside english.. If you strike the cue ball on the right, it is outside english..
 
A

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
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Here are the definitions from the glossary on Dr. Dave's site:

inside english (IE): sidespin created by hitting the cue ball on the side towards the direction of the shot (i.e.
on the “inside” of the cue ball). For example, when the cue ball strikes an object ball on the left side, creating
a cut shot to the right, right sidespin would be called “inside english.”

outside english (OE): sidespin created by hitting the cue ball on the side away from the direction of the shot
(i.e. on the “outside” of the cue ball). For example, when the cue ball strikes an object ball on the left side,
creating a cut shot to the right, left sidespin would be called “outside english.”


http://billiards.colostate.edu/resources/glossary.pdf
 
BC21

BC21

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I always figured "inside" was inside the shot angle and "outside" was outside the shot angle. Running english is any spin that causes the CB to speed up along its naturally direction/line off a cushion. That's why inside can be running english depending on the shot. It's weird.....cutting a ball down the rail to the left, say a 15° angle, and using top right (outside spin), would not be running english. It would act like a brake, checking the CB. Inside spin would send the CB running faster along it's natural direction, so in this case inside is running english.
 
E

Ekojasiloop

AzB Silver Member
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Despite how people actually define this, I think the best way is simply when cb hits ob and the English is running off the ball is running English. Cb hits the ball and English is sticking or going in the opposite direction of the cb is inside. Maybe I didn't explain that good but that's how I see it. I think using the cushions to define inside outside is super confusing. What if you never hit a cushion.

A better way to explain it would be friction. Same as above but when the cb is running off (less friction) it's running. When cb is spinning back (more friction) would be inside.

If I'm practicing my inside English shots it's that sticking, higher friction English, which makes the ball harder to pocket imo. It would not matter what the cb is doing when it hits the rail.
 
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PoolBum

PoolBum

Ace in the side.
Silver Member
I believe outside english is english applied to the outside of the cue ball, while inside english is english applied to the inside of the cue ball. That's what makes inside english so difficult to use.
 
Cornerman

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
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PoolBum said:
I believe outside english is english applied to the outside of the cue ball, while inside english is english applied to the inside of the cue ball. That's what makes inside english so difficult to use.
Click to expand...

And that's why we have "what's your favorite drill" threads.
 
jasonlaus

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
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PoolBum said:
I believe outside english is english applied to the outside of the cue ball, while inside english is english applied to the inside of the cue ball. That's what makes inside english so difficult to use.
Click to expand...

It's difficult if you don't use it often. I do about half of each, so I see no difference.
GL
Jason
 
michael4

michael4

AzB Silver Member
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PoolBum said:
I believe outside english is english applied to the outside of the cue ball, while inside english is english applied to the inside of the cue ball. That's what makes inside english so difficult to use.
Click to expand...

Correct, but if you have a very strong follow through with your cue, you can apply inside english.


I used to think outside English is when the pool table is outside, like on the patio. :grin:
 
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