Is Charlie Williams the most powerful man in pro-pool?

Jesters

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Talking to someone today it was said that "Charlie Williams is the most powerful man in pro-pool today" I was shocked to hear this and had said "No way" It was then explained to me that he does more events than anyone and is controling alot of things that we have no idea about and he will be doing alot more in the future. I do not know Charlie Williams other than events I have heard of and the usual things that are said in these forums so he does do alot of tournaments and manages some of the top players, is this really all it takes to be the most powerful man in pool? Maybe so since the pool world is fractured in so many ways that all it takes is one person to stand out and have influence over players and tournaments.
This is not to bash Charlie Williams but to see what the popular opinion is among the pool community. If not Charlie then who?
 

juegabillar

Private Citizen
Silver Member
Talking to someone today it was said that "Charlie Williams is the most powerful man in pro-pool today" I was shocked to hear this and had said "No way" It was then explained to me that he does more events than anyone and is controling alot of things that we have no idea about and he will be doing alot more in the future. I do not know Charlie Williams other than events I have heard of and the usual things that are said in these forums so he does do alot of tournaments and manages some of the top players, is this really all it takes to be the most powerful man in pool? Maybe so since the pool world is fractured in so many ways that all it takes is one person to stand out and have influence over players and tournaments.
This is not to bash Charlie Williams but to see what the popular opinion is among the pool community. If not Charlie then who?

I don't think many people in this forum will admit that "Charlie Williams and/or Dragon Promotions" does have some power in the "pool world." I don't know if we could call him the "Most Powerful" but I for one recognize he is "up there."

Just my honest opinion.
 

Banks

Banned
Srsly?

yourekiddingright.jpg
 

easy-e

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
In PRO pool? Maybe, who cares. Definitely not the most powerful or influential person in the actual pool world.
 

Fatboy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
there is not such a person in pool hence all the problems, In snooker they have Barry Hearn and he makes things happen top players make huge money.
 

JumpinJoe

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It would be a sad day for pool if he ever does have complete control.

He used this so called authority over some of the women players over the past decade. A real p.o.s. if you ask me.

And the funny thing is, when this issue arises he never comes around to deny it. I wonder why?
 

Blue Hog ridr

World Famous Fisherman.
Silver Member
Respect is a funny thing it is.

People will see you differently if you earn their respect or if you demand it from them.

Myself, lets just say that Rodney Dangerfield and I have much in common.
 
Last edited:

TATE

AzB Gold Mensch
Silver Member
In my book, Mark Griffin , Justin (TAR) and Accu-Stats have pretty much cornered the market on pro pool. They do far more events with greater impact, participation, money, viewership and effectiveness than anybody else.

Mark Griffin IS tournament pool right now. Justin is the leading promoter and broadcaster of action matches, and Accu-Stats is the leading broadcaster of top level tournament pool.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In my book, Mark Griffin , Justin (TAR) and Accu-Stats have pretty much cornered the market on pro pool. They do far more events with greater impact, participation, money, viewership and effectiveness than anybody else.

Mark Griffin IS tournament pool right now. Justin is the leading promoter and broadcaster of action matches, and Accu-Stats is the leading broadcaster of top level tournament pool.


It's always kinda funny to me to read who the most influential people in U.S. pool *supposedly* are.

I think right about now you could go with these guys and be pretty safe:

Greg Sullivan
Mark Griffin
Justin Collet

There are some others guys howling into the wind, but thats abut it, really.

Lou Figueroa
 

Tom In Cincy

AKA SactownTom
Silver Member
Tate and Lou<----- persons to listen to.... I agree 110%

In my book, Mark Griffin , Justin (TAR) and Accu-Stats have pretty much cornered the market on pro pool. They do far more events with greater impact, participation, money, viewership and effectiveness than anybody else.

Mark Griffin IS tournament pool right now. Justin is the leading promoter and broadcaster of action matches, and Accu-Stats is the leading broadcaster of top level tournament pool.

It's always kinda funny to me to read who the most influential people in U.S. pool *supposedly* are.

I think right about now you could go with these guys and be pretty safe:

Greg Sullivan
Mark Griffin
Justin Collet

There are some others guys howling into the wind, but thats abut it, really.

Lou Figueroa
 

nathandumoulin

WPBL / RUNOUT MEDIA
Silver Member
Matchroom produces the World Cup of Pool, World Pool Masters, and Mosconi Cup, which are all broadcast live, to tens of millions of people worldwide. Players attend other events that they don't even want to be at, just to have the opportunity to qualify for Matchroom events. For many players, the primary goal of their entire career is to win a Matchroom event. It's probably not far off to say that the crowds at just one of these events outnumber the entire audience for all other pro events on America soil throughout the entire year combined.

...yet the consensus on the forums thus far is that live online streaming to a few hundred people is what controls pool these days?

I hate to say it, but the forums are becoming incredibly disconnected from reality. I do love watching the occasional TAR match, or logging in to watch Accu Stats coverage of a major event, but the amount of impact they have is almost non existent in comparison to what Barry Hern has been doing for Decades now. You can name industry people all day long, but in the end no one is even in the same ballpark relative to what his company has done for pool.

As for Charlie, like it or not, he'd be a distant second, probably followed by Griffin.
 
Last edited:

Fast Lenny

Faster Than You...
Silver Member
I have to say that most on the forums base who has power in pool based on what they see going on in the US. There are great events going on worldwide that you have to keep in mind. I would say the power players in US pool are Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan and Allen Hopkins based on the events they put on. I wish Matchroom would have more events in the US though other then just the Mosconi Cup because they do an excellent job.
 

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
Matchroom produces the World Cup of Pool, World Pool Masters, and Mosconi Cup, which are all broadcast live, to tens of millions of people worldwide. Players attend other events that they don't even want to be at, just to have the opportunity to qualify for Matchroom events. For many players, the primary goal of their entire career is to win a Matchroom event. It's probably not far off to say that the crowds at just one of these events outnumber the entire audience for all other pro events on America soil throughout the entire year combined.

...yet the consensus on the forums thus far is that live online streaming to a few hundred people is what controls pool these days?

I hate to say it, but the forums are becoming incredibly disconnected from reality. I do love watching the occasional TAR match, or logging in to watch Accu Stats coverage of a major event, but the amount of impact they have is almost non existent in comparison to what Barry Hern has been doing for Decades now. You can name industry people all day long, but in the end no one is even in the same ballpark relative to what his company has done for pool.

As for Charlie, like it or not, he'd be a distant second, probably followed by Griffin.


Nathan,
You make a compelling argument about Barry Hern. I'll give him a provisional number 1. JW at number 2 doesn't pass the sniff test.Mark G wont come here and toot his horn so I will. If you want numbers...what type of numbers does CSI deliver in players who play in their league system and come to their National (so would say international) event every year? Ignoring everything else that Mark does for the sport and his profile dwarfs Mr. Williams in this category. Add the balance of what Mark is involved in and you can make an argument that he's nipping at Hern's feet. Remember that Mosconi cup is a funsie made for tv tournament. The number of viewers are mostly casual fans that wouldn't known Johnny Archer from Johnny Cash. CSI's league players spend thousands to play and travel to Vegas and thus vote with their wallet.

Nick
 

easy-e

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Let's remember that the leagues are not "Pro" pool. They are waaaaay bigger and more important than that.
 

JCIN

TheActionReport.com
Gold Member
Seeing as how I can't sleep I might as well write my manifesto on the who's who of pool promoters in the US (because I don't care about the rest of the world. Merica. Insert pic of bald eagle with machine guns here)

Barry Behrman is on his last legs. He had a great run but it is what it is. Allen Hopkins deserves a lot of respect for the expo but he does one pro event a year and it now pays two dimes more than TAR does for a weekend challenge match in part thanks to Charlie Williams. I suppose an honorable mention could be given to Matt Braun for his ESPN events but those have wained considerably in the recent years.

Barry Hearn won't touch pool in the US with a ten foot poll. Once a year he needs a tv cast and that doesnt pay what it used to. Although the fact that they chose not to rely on BCA points this year, thereby making them completely meaningless does make a good point for arguing he has some power in the US.

Charlie has burned through most sponsors/donors/partners that he did large events with. He is doing stuff in pool rooms now every once in awhile when he finds a little money and the occasional tv deal in asia for whoever is in his clique at the time. When he's not helping get $25K added events turned into $8K added events. To his credit he managed to resurrect the 14.1 thing but I attribute that as much to Mr. Fedak (sp?) who puts up the dough. Also Cindy Lee has been making Charlie look good for a lot of years behind the scenes.

Pat Fleming is in the Hall of Fame for a reason. A case could be made that what he did with Accu-Stats is a big reason pro pool is around in the US right now. Don't believe me go find a pro player, fan or promoter under forty who says Pats videos haven't inspired them or fed their desire for the game. IMO its a way bigger deal than most people consider or give credit for. But...Pat doesn't actually produce that many events himself. Its not a knock. He does one or two a year not counting small stuff and not every year. I have a tremendous amount of respect for Pat but again it is what it is when it comes to putting on events.

This brings us to Larry Chiborak who single handedly has caused more promoters and players headaches than anyone since Trudeau. Most of those headaches are related to simple lack of communication about scheduling...and the seeming inability to hire a plumber,electrician and dry wall guy. If you put a lot of weight on being able to shake things up from the norm then Chiborak is right at the top of the list. He also has paid out more for guys to show up and do nothing than Charlie has paid out in the last couple years. So he has that going for him. If/when Bonus Ball actually starts then he will have a lot of players tied to him so for the near future in the US. Chiborak is right at the top of people who will have a real affect on pro pool in the US. Whether it is good or bad remains to be seen.

So with all of the above said consider this.....

If Mark Griffin decides to go back to Alaska to ride grizzly bears or whatever they do up there, Mike Zuglan decides he has had enough and Greg Sullivan decides to move to the UK and build the worlds best dart boards then you can pretty much throw the last shovel full of dirt on pro pool in the United States.

Three dudes. Who without them pro pool in the US is gone. Those three men are responsible for eight "pro events" (another oxymoron) a year. I wouldnt call it power. I would call it "I hope those guys don't take up golf or get hit by a bus."

So I now give you my final ranking list of people who make things happen that affect the most players and fans in the pro pool industry. It is based solely on my opinion which obviously means its 100% correct.

8657863266_52141fcb5b_o.jpg


I know I will take shit for my number one spot but I didn't put Mark there because he's my friend and business partner. Look at the entirety of what CSI does in the US with and for pro pool and I think its a legit call. I do love to argue though so lets hear it.

While the above list is put together with some thought and reasoning behind it I it meant mainly as way to stir up some discussion...if someone wants to really know who the most powerful person in pro pool in the US is I will tell you. It's the fans. Sounds hokey right? Its true though. The guy who goes to Derby every year and buys a TV seat. The people who just paid $300 to sponsor the Accu-Stats event. The people who buy all of the online PPV's from TAR, BigTruck and Accu-Stats. The people who always buy a seat to sweat the pro's at any tournament they are at. Without the people willing to put up with all the bullshit surrounding pro pool and still support it by spending money then anything a promoter does is meaningless.
 
Last edited:

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
Justin Collett has become my second favorite writer in the pool world.

George Fels is still my favorite.....

....although I'll bet on Justin when it comes to arm-wrestling....
 
Top