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SamShaddey
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07-13-2019, 02:11 PM

I side with Glen on this if it.was a manufacture problem it would be product line side. Or a majority of a run not two random tables in bum fuct where ever!


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07-13-2019, 02:16 PM

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Originally Posted by realkingcobra View Post
And I challenge you to get off your ass and go travel around the country and find OTHER DIAMONDS that play like those do!! We don't have ANY problems with the playability of the several 100 Diamonds in my area!!
The ones in NJ play like crap too. Not as short as these, but like pin balls. Blue labels as well.

The ones in PA are pin balls.

The ones I played on in Denver played great.

The ones in Tunica played horrible.

The ones in DCC play good some years, so-so other years. I think it has to do with the weather personally, but that is just a hunch.

I also played on some in VA that were super old. The pockets weren't even black, before the black dye. They actually played good.

Any more places I should try?
  
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07-13-2019, 02:20 PM

I've never played on a bad one. Our room had early Red Pro's that banked a little short but played ok. Every other Diamond i've played on was fine. I live in hot/humid Okla. and ANY table gets bouncy down here. Never seen a Diamond with all the ills described in above posts. Its all in the set-up. Take a great table and a j^*k-off installer and any table will suck.
  
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07-13-2019, 02:21 PM

Its not a manufacturing problem. That would imply there is variation from sample to sample due to tolerances or other issues.

I'm implying its a design problem. Probably using the wrong cushion material or cushion profile. Or maybe the wood rail behind the cushion is too stiff.

The point is, sometime the diamond's play great, and sometimes they play like pinball machines, and sometimes they play so short a 4 rail bank goes 2 rails (ask John Morra )

I'm not here to fix the problem. But Glen acts like there is no problem.

I've said this before, you take a GC, and put it all over the country, and it will play "close" in most cases. You do the same with a Diamond, some places it will play great, some horrible. WHY, that is Glen's job or Diamond's job to figure out. But blasting me and others because we point out these difference is nuts.
  
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07-13-2019, 02:22 PM

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Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
The ones in NJ play like crap too. Not as short as these, but like pin balls. Blue labels as well.

The ones in PA are pin balls.

The ones I played on in Denver played great.

The ones in Tunica played horrible.

The ones in DCC play good some years, so-so other years. I think it has to do with the weather personally, but that is just a hunch.

I also played on some in VA that were super old. The pockets weren't even black, before the black dye. They actually played good.

Any more places I should try?
And after Paul Smith wiped down the cushions on the 10's in Tunica with Armoral like I told him to, it solved the humidity problems with the cushions banking short and springy. Are you NEW to the effects humidity has on pool tables in different areas of the country???
  
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07-13-2019, 02:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
Its not a manufacturing problem. That would imply there is variation from sample to sample due to tolerances or other issues.

I'm implying its a design problem. Probably using the wrong cushion material or cushion profile. Or maybe the wood rail behind the cushion is too stiff.

The point is, sometime the diamond's play great, and sometimes they play like pinball machines, and sometimes they play so short a 4 rail bank goes 2 rails (ask John Morra )

I'm not here to fix the problem. But Glen acts like there is no problem.

I've said this before, you take a GC, and put it all over the country, and it will play "close" in most cases. You do the same with a Diamond, some places it will play great, some horrible. WHY, that is Glen's job or Diamond's job to figure out. But blasting me and others because we point out these difference is nuts.
Well then, I hate to be the one to inform you, but I've played on PLENTY of horrible playing GCs around the country as well. ALL tables are effected by humidity, but it varies depending on the cloth on the tables.....ever considered that possibility????
  
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07-13-2019, 02:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
Its not a manufacturing problem. That would imply there is variation from sample to sample due to tolerances or other issues.

I'm implying its a design problem. Probably using the wrong cushion material or cushion profile. Or maybe the wood rail behind the cushion is too stiff.

The point is, sometime the diamond's play great, and sometimes they play like pinball machines, and sometimes they play so short a 4 rail bank goes 2 rails (ask John Morra )

I'm not here to fix the problem. But Glen acts like there is no problem.

I've said this before, you take a GC, and put it all over the country, and it will play "close" in most cases. You do the same with a Diamond, some places it will play great, some horrible. WHY, that is Glen's job or Diamond's job to figure out. But blasting me and others because we point out these difference is nuts.
Are you even aware that Simonis 860 and 860HR play night and day different in extreme humid environments? Do you know why?
  
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07-13-2019, 02:37 PM

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Originally Posted by Cron View Post
I've been playing almost solely on Diamonds for about 2 years and I'm realizing these tables are kinda cheap.

1. The ball returns are the worst. I'm not a fan of ball returns anyways, but I've never danced so much trying to figure out which end the cue ball will come out. It's kinda ridiculous considering the popularity of Diamond.
A Diamond Smart Table requires a special cue ball with a red circle that alerts an optic
sensor.

The Cornerman explained this a while ago....its properties are luminescence and translucency.
..a certain amount of light can pass though the resin....Freddy swallowed a thesaurus..

Sooo....if a room has the cue ball stolen or mixed in with other sets,,,,
...and puts in a different cue ball......is that Diamondís fault?


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iusedtoberich
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07-13-2019, 02:38 PM

Stop showing us how much smarter you are then everyone else. Go to Atlanta and prove it on your rail design on those two tables.

And of course I canít give you 1000 bad examples. Iím giving you local to me examples.
  
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07-13-2019, 02:40 PM

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Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
Stop showing us how much smarter you are then everyone else. Go to Atlanta and prove it on your rail design on those two tables.

And of course I canít give you 1000 bad examples. Iím giving you local to me examples.
Then I'd suggest you get right on it, maybe you can show Diamond a thing or two about how smart you really are!!
  
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07-13-2019, 02:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by realkingcobra View Post
FWIW, I've worked on horrible Diamond tables right there in Louisville, KY not more than 15 miles from the factory, but Diamonds service techs wasn't the ones working on the tables for the last 10 years!!
It is illogical to think diamond is responsible for something it has no control over, agreed.
  
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07-13-2019, 03:07 PM

All this talk about Diamond vs. Gold Crown tables are mostly apple to oranges comparisons. Diamond tables have a great build quality, for what they are. Once they are properly set up they can take a lot of abuse and still play quite well. They are tough to mess up. The Gold Crown actually takes a competent installer. Kudos to the guys behind the Diamond...They realized early that people who work on tables are probably not the sharpest knives in the drawer, usually. Typically they don't have the proper equipment or knowledge to use it. They think a torque wrench is an MMA move, they don't know how to level a table with a three piece slate. They don't know which parts go together, or to mark them when working on several tables simultaneously.

So what most pool halls end up with after a few cloth change cycles are GC with mismatched rails, stripped nuts and inconsistently fastned rails (with no easy solution to fix them) and therefore inconsistently banking cushions, cushions out of geometric specs (sides pushed one way or the other pockets of inconsistent size. The slates are naturally slanted everywhich way, creating rolls that are unpredictable and hard to read. The veneer and woodwork is all bashed up, and the castings are not mounting flush at all. After a decade or two, the castings are probably not even original to the table. Naturally they think this is how a GC plays, when in fact they're playing on hacked up frankentables.

But you know, when the person assembling a GC has a 3 digit IQ, they actually play very nicely. Diamonds are usually very consistent, but they are made with one purpose, to facilitate trick banks. So completely standard pool position shots are made close to impossible to perform in a standard way. Two railers out of the corner come up 2 full diamonds short. That can't be fixed with a torque wrench...The balls are bouncing all over the place, kill shots just don't work, you can't stretch out the angles very much either...But if you have a "stiff" bank on a GC, you can probably make it on a Diamond. Hooray...Too bad the bread and butter shots are all wrong.
  
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07-13-2019, 03:13 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
All this talk about Diamond vs. Gold Crown tables are mostly apple to oranges comparisons. Diamond tables have a great build quality, for what they are. Once they are properly set up they can take a lot of abuse and still play quite well. They are tough to mess up. The Gold Crown actually takes a competent installer. Kudos to the guys behind the Diamond...They realized early that people who work on tables are probably not the sharpest knives in the drawer, usually. Typically they don't have the proper equipment or knowledge to use it. They think a torque wrench is an MMA move, they don't know how to level a table with a three piece slate. They don't know which parts go together, or to mark them when working on several tables simultaneously.

So what most pool halls end up with after a few cloth change cycles are GC with mismatched rails, stripped nuts and inconsistently fastned rails (with no easy solution to fix them) and therefore inconsistently banking cushions, cushions out of geometric specs (sides pushed one way or the other pockets of inconsistent size. The slates are naturally slanted everywhich way, creating rolls that are unpredictable and hard to read. The veneer and woodwork is all bashed up, and the castings are not mounting flush at all. After a decade or two, the castings are probably not even original to the table. Naturally they think this is how a GC plays, when in fact they're playing on hacked up frankentables.

But you know, when the person assembling a GC has a 3 digit IQ, they actually play very nicely. Diamonds are usually very consistent, but they are made with one purpose, to facilitate trick banks. So completely standard pool position shots are made close to impossible to perform in a standard way. Two railers out of the corner come up 2 full diamonds short. That can't be fixed with a torque wrench...The balls are bouncing all over the place, kill shots just don't work, you can't stretch out the angles very much either...But if you have a "stiff" bank on a GC, you can probably make it on a Diamond. Hooray...Too bad the bread and butter shots are all wrong.


NAILED IT! I have been saying this all along.


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07-13-2019, 03:14 PM

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Originally Posted by Straightpool_99 View Post
All this talk about Diamond vs. Gold Crown tables are mostly apple to oranges comparisons. Diamond tables have a great build quality, for what they are. Once they are properly set up they can take a lot of abuse and still play quite well. They are tough to mess up. The Gold Crown actually takes a competent installer. Kudos to the guys behind the Diamond...They realized early that people who work on tables are probably not the sharpest knives in the drawer, usually. Typically they don't have the proper equipment or knowledge to use it. They think a torque wrench is an MMA move, they don't know how to level a table with a three piece slate. They don't know which parts go together, or to mark them when working on several tables simultaneously.

So what most pool halls end up with after a few cloth change cycles are GC with mismatched rails, stripped nuts and inconsistently fastned rails (with no easy solution to fix them) and therefore inconsistently banking cushions, cushions out of geometric specs (sides pushed one way or the other pockets of inconsistent size. The slates are naturally slanted everywhich way, creating rolls that are unpredictable and hard to read. The veneer and woodwork is all bashed up, and the castings are not mounting flush at all. After a decade or two, the castings are probably not even original to the table. Naturally they think this is how a GC plays, when in fact they're playing on hacked up frankentables.

But you know, when the person assembling a GC has a 3 digit IQ, they actually play very nicely. Diamonds are usually very consistent, but they are made with one purpose, to facilitate trick banks. So completely standard pool position shots are made close to impossible to perform in a standard way. Two railers out of the corner come up 2 full diamonds short. That can't be fixed with a torque wrench...The balls are bouncing all over the place, kill shots just don't work, you can't stretch out the angles very much either...But if you have a "stiff" bank on a GC, you can probably make it on a Diamond. Hooray...Too bad the bread and butter shots are all wrong.
I know what you're taking about, the Pros playing in the US Open 9 ball event had no control over the cue ball to save their life. And Fuller, he just got LUCKY every time he had to bank a ball!!😱
  
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07-13-2019, 03:17 PM

I just can't figure out how Fuller was able to run what. 285 balls on a Diamond, as bad as they play according to the AMATEURS that play on them so much!!
  
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