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Is the Tip More Important than Deflection Considerations?
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Matt_24
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Is the Tip More Important than Deflection Considerations? - 10-18-2019, 09:32 AM

Is the TIP is more important than deflection considerations? I might prioritize by TIP, Taper, then...maybe deflection?

My thought was that if I have a Kamui Brown Soft (which I really like and I'm used to)....I'm almost guaranteed to like the hit and immediate familiarity. Next, of course I want a taper that feels good. And then go from there. What say you?


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10-18-2019, 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_24 View Post
Is the TIP is more important than deflection considerations? I might prioritize by TIP, Taper, then...maybe deflection?

My thought was that if I have a Kamui Brown Soft (which I really like and I'm used to)....I'm almost guaranteed to like the hit and immediate familiarity. Next, of course I want a taper that feels good. And then go from there. What say you?
One way to look at it: Suppose you were spotting your opponent that he could choose one of three cues for you to use on each shot. Suppose those three cues had only one thing different among them. Which would be the worst thing for that difference to be, tip, taper, or squirt?


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10-18-2019, 10:29 AM

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Originally Posted by Bob Jewett View Post
One way to look at it: Suppose you were spotting your opponent that he could choose one of three cues for you to use on each shot. Suppose those three cues had only one thing different among them. Which would be the worst thing for that difference to be, tip, taper, or squirt?
Raymond Ceulemans said “A good tip is more important than a good cue.”
...after all, it’s the only part that hits the cue ball.
..so I hope my opponent doesn’t choose a flat, glassy tip.

...assuming the cues are within reason....don’t be fooling us naive Canucks


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Last edited by pt109; 10-18-2019 at 10:32 AM.
  
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10-18-2019, 10:34 AM

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Originally Posted by Matt_24 View Post
Is the TIP is more important than deflection considerations? I might prioritize by TIP, Taper, then...maybe deflection?
Crazy idea: have you tried other cues with each of these differences?

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10-18-2019, 10:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_24 View Post
Is the TIP is more important than deflection considerations? I might prioritize by TIP, Taper, then...maybe deflection?
I use an open bridge, so the taper is of no concern.

Assuming all of the tips in your comparison hold chalk, they are equally good to me since I can very quickly get used to the hit efficiency and "feel"/"hit"/"sound" of any tip; although, I prefer a harder tip for the reasons here: cut tip hardness resource page.

To me, deflection is the most important because if the CB deflection is different than what I am used to, then I need to aim differently when using sidespin.

Regards,
Dave
  
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10-18-2019, 11:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_24 View Post
like the hit and immediate familiarity
Going on what Dr. Dave and others have stated:

I can believe the tip affects those factors I quoted from your post: How familiar it feels and whether you like it. But does the tip really affect your shot-making as much as deflection?
  
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10-18-2019, 12:32 PM

Here is a unique piece of advice - pick a cue, pick a tip you like to install on that cue- play with that cue every single time and Forget about deflection, etc. - just play man- what do you think the very best do? Worry about thus stuff? Deflection etc. are all inherently adjusted to by the shooter over a course of time using Any cue- the rest is ALL Marketing hype to get you to spend money.
One of the very best players I ever saw in competition used to get out of his car and walk over to the pool hall about 30 minutes before the tournaments started with an old Meucci "in his hands" - no case, no jump or break cue, nothing but an old Meucci broken down into two pieces in his hands- and he took down a lot of JOSS tournaments in the 90s against guys like Ginky, Frankie Hernandez, etc. etc. - Guys make WAY too much about equipment on this site- you should be concerned with so many other aspects of the game His name was Chuck Altomare - He went # 1 in a lot of Joss tour Calcuttas in the 90s when he was playing real well - I saw him carrying that cue on the streets many times.

Last edited by mikemosconi; 10-18-2019 at 12:34 PM.
  
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Never had a BAD tip
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Cadillac J
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Never had a BAD tip - 10-18-2019, 12:49 PM

I honestly don't agree that the tip the most important, as long as it does it's basic job and holds chalk/doesn't miscue. Soft laminated vs. Hard one-piece doesn't make a difference in performance (feel only) in my opinion.

Every cue has deflection, you just need to adjust...again, not a big deal, but it might just take some time to get used to playing.

Tapers and tip diameter varieties don't take much modification in my eyes...can go right from by 9.5mm Snooker cue to a 13mm Joss maple. Then again, it is because I have experience playing with all my cues.

Please don't take the wrong way, but how can you be a member/play pool for so long (based on join date and posts) without knowing some of your own preferences or this base info?

If tips play the most significant factor, why are people buying $400+ carbon fiber shafts?
  
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Is the Tip More Important than Deflection Considerations?
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Is the Tip More Important than Deflection Considerations? - 10-18-2019, 08:05 PM

For me, deflection is WAY more important. I may not like the fee of one tip compared to another, and my speed might be off a hair, but if the deflection is much different Iím going to miss a lot of balls for a while.

Also to answer your last question about why would people but carbon fiber shafts if the tip is the most important: pretty sure people are using a tip on whatever shaft they use. Just because something is less important doesnít mean itís unimportant.

KMRUNOUT


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10-18-2019, 08:54 PM

Captain Minguard invented the leather tip, it was a game changer.


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10-18-2019, 08:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by pt109 View Post
Raymond Ceulemans said “A good tip is more important than a good cue."
What does he know? I watched that guy play before and he couldn't even pocket a single ball!


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10-18-2019, 09:13 PM

Deflection by far the most important to me. It changes the aim on nearly every single shot. Its like playing blind if you are used to a certain amount of deflection. Tip type doesn't change aim, nor does shaft taper. You can put a different tip or taper on a same deflection shaft, and be playing your normal game in a few minutes. Do that with a different deflection shaft, and it will take months. IMO
  
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10-18-2019, 09:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dave View Post
I use an open bridge, so the taper is of no concern.

Assuming all of the tips in your comparison hold chalk, they are equally good to me since I can very quickly get used to the hit efficiency and "feel"/"hit"/"sound" of any tip; although, I prefer a harder tip for the reasons here: cut tip hardness resource page.

To me, deflection is the most important because if the CB deflection is different than what I am used to, then I need to aim differently when using sidespin.

Regards,
Dave
Deflection is greatly overrated if one's game is properly based on center ball. I can break and run racks of barbox eight ball using a phenolic tip, on a factory Schon shaft, which is absolutely about as high deflection as one can get.
  
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10-18-2019, 09:34 PM

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... if one's game is properly based on center ball. ...
Like pretty much no one in the top 100 and certainly not Efren.
  
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10-18-2019, 09:58 PM

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Originally Posted by Bob Jewett View Post
Like pretty much no one in the top 100 and certainly not Efren.
???? Maybe we are looking at totally different players. Orcullo's and Pagulayan's games are VERY much patterned around center ball, or at the very least, moving more towards center ball. Toastie is more center ball than either... And Niels is the ultimate center-baller.

And pretty much every European sticks as close to center ball as possible.

Efren's success had more to do with his ability to hit the CB soft, and his kicking. Everyone ran out about the same, he just got to the first shot more often. And the fact that he generally played on larger, softer pockets than the modern day players have to contend with, which allowed more of a margin of error on those soft spin inside shots he used to like so much. His creativity and three-cushion ability extended his competitive years in One Pocket...

I mean.. If you could point out specific players who spin the ball a lot that are still forces at world championships... I'm listening.
  
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