Is Josh Filler the World's Best Pool Player?

G

gxman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Filler lost to JL Chang 11-5 at the International Open 3rd rd.

Then he lost his next match to Gorst 11-9.


Filler finished tied for 65 at DCC 9b 2019.

Playing short race to 9 or 11, it can go either way
when matching up two Fargo 810+ players.

It's just with Filler, hes a slight favorite.
 
K

klone

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
IMO he’s the top tournament player right now in the world. The US Open had the toughest field of 256 players, I mean you had the American MC members past and present, the semi-pros with nothing to lose, the Filipino contingent, the Taiwanese elites, the Chinese sharpshooters, and all the European pros, not to mention a few other hungry young guns like Singapore’s Aloysius Yapp nipping at the heels.

He’s 21 and he’s got the invincibility mindset, much like many of the pros we know when they’re young.

Kudos to him for working hard to earn his titles. I believe we will be talking a lot about him in the many years to come.
 
Cardigan Kid

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
gxman said:
Filler lost to JL Chang 11-5 at the International Open 3rd rd.

Then he lost his next match to Gorst 11-9.


Filler finished tied for 65 at DCC 9b 2019.

Playing short race to 9 or 11, it can go either way
when matching up two Fargo 810+ players.

It's just with Filler, hes a slight favorite.
Click to expand...

It was my understanding that Filler was playing money matches through the night and really didn't get rested/prepared for the tournament matches. DCC is sometimes deceiving in that way, a player might be fully involved in one discipline and not really involved in another and lose, but it's misleading as to what their full potential is. (Case in point, Filler lost to Chang in the tournament but then played for cash and beat Chang in an extended set).
 
Cardigan Kid

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
sjm said:
I can't remember who Josh has a coach, but it's not Eckert.

I think composure is learned, but it is certainly influenced by the environment in which one is raised and in which one lives or does business. Nonetheless, I think that composure is more often a byproduct of confidence and, of course, confidence is a byproduct of preparation. From everything I've heard, Josh is a workaholic and that has given him his brash confidence.

Jack Nicklaus used to say that confidence is the stubborn belief that you are about to perform well. I think Filler might say the same.
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Aa always Stu, your posts are words of wisdom. We need to compile them and make an ebook! With a few references to Dostoyevsky for good measure. ;)
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
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Cardigan Kid said:
It was my understanding that Filler was playing money matches through the night and really didn't get rested/prepared for the tournament matches. DCC is sometimes deceiving in that way, a player might be fully involved in one discipline and not really involved in another and lose, but it's misleading as to what their full potential is. (Case in point, Filler lost to Chang in the tournament but then played for cash and beat Chang in an extended set).
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Certainly a valid post but your example isn't a good one. In both the Bigfoot final and in their gambling match, both Filler and Chang played superbly. No doubt, Filler has developed his game the "Filipino" way. He's always in action and loves to test himself against the world's most elite players. This has toughened him and developed his competitive pedigree. You might call Filler the first "German Filipino" player, and, as we've seen, no moment is too big for him.
 
Cardigan Kid

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
sjm said:
Certainly a valid post but your example isn't a good one. In both the Bigfoot final and in their gambling match, both Filler and Chang played superbly. No doubt, Filler has developed his game the "Filipino" way. He's always in action and loves to test himself against the world's most elite players. This has toughened him and developed his competitive pedigree. You might call Filler the first "German Filipino" player, and, as we've seen, no moment is too big for him.
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A super dangerous pool hybrid! Like a laboratory monster movie for pool enthusiasts. :thumbup:
 
O

one stroke

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
sjm said:
Unfortunately for Team USA, Filler's #1 World ranking will make it impossible for Coach Chamat to leave Filler off of Team Europe.

Still, just like everyone else, Filler is beatable, but Filler shines at the Mosconi Cup because late match pressure starts in Rack 1 of every match. Josh is awfully good at handling late match pressure.
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One thing I learned about pressure is when your younger your beliefs in your game over shadow the moment you are in your eyes are good and you fire at will ,when you get older the eyes not so good and have taken some thumpings because you missed those lower percentage shots doubt sets in and you have to learn the safety game of his is weak , for him to substain his level of play as he gets older he will have to learn a better safety game


1
 
sjm

sjm

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one stroke said:
One thing I learned about pressure is when your younger your beliefs in your game over shadow the moment you are in your eyes are good and you fire at will ,when you get older the eyes not so good and have taken some thumpings because you missed those lower percentage shots doubt sets in and you have to learn the safety game of his is weak , for him to substain his level of play as he gets older he will have to learn a better safety game


1
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Nonsense. He is not a super-aggressive shotmaker like a Shaw, but a player who is patient, plays a tactically sound game and employs the two way shot more than all but a few. His kicking is already solid, too, and he wins most of his tactical sequences, even against the most elite.

His safety game is already one of the best in the world (although I do understand that in Stage 2 of the US Open, he had two poor matches in defensive execution, although he made all the correct tactical decisions) and I believe he will one day be the best defensive player in the world.

I am genuinely shocked at those who don't feel Filler is already an extremely well-rounded player both offensively and defensively and invite them to watch him a little more often. His tactical choices are among the best you will ever see, and those who've been around the game a long time will see great similarities in his tactical approach to Pagulayan in his twenties.

He doesn't need more seasoning and he doesn't need more development. Once he has a little more experience, he will be the best in the world. I reckon it will take two more years.
 
pt109

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
sjm said:
Nonsense. He is not a super-aggressive shotmaker like a Shaw, but a player who is patient, plays a tactically sound game and employs the two way shot more than all but a few. His kicking is already solid, too, and he wins most of his tactical sequences, even against the most elite.

His safety game is already one of the best in the world (although I do understand that in Stage 2 of the US Open, he had two poor matches in defensive execution, although he made all the correct tactical decisions) and I believe he will one day be the best defensive player in the world.

I am genuinely shocked at those who don't feel Filler is already an extremely well-rounded player both offensively and defensively and invite them to watch him a little more often. His tactical choices are among the best you will ever see, and those who've been around the game a long time will see great similarities in his tactical approach to Pagulayan in his twenties.

He doesn't need more seasoning and he doesn't need more development. Once he has a little more experience, he will be the best in the world. I reckon it will take two more years.
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When Steve Davis dominated snooker in the 80s, there was a lot of talk about what
he DIDN'T do well.
Seems to me that Joshua Filler is getting a bit of the same treatment.
...it might be the mark of their greatness.
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
pt109 said:
When Steve Davis dominated snooker in the 80s, there was a lot of talk about what
he DIDN'T do well.
Seems to me that Joshua Filler is getting a bit of the same treatment.
...it might be the mark of their greatness.
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Point well taken.
 
brilliance

brilliance

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
hi

Break is what makes winners at this level. Filler found a way to make 1 on almost every break... If Wu did that he would win.

If Ko Ping Yi and his brother had good break they would be in semifinals at least. All these guys can beat each other.

Or imagine Chang Yu Lung with successful break as Filler... that guy rarely miss anything..

Fargorate is very accurate, I would add Kaci to that.

To me Wu shouts the best at the moment.. Filler won due to that lucky 2 ball fluke.

in worlds TOP 10 Taiwanese players are half of that. Only SVB, Kaci and Filler would be part of that.. Wu, Liu Haitao and rest Taiwaneese..
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
brilliance said:
Break is what makes winners at this level. Filler found a way to make 1 on almost every break... If Wu did that he would win.

If Ko Ping Yi and his brother had good break they would be in semifinals at least. All these guys can beat each other.

Or imagine Chang Yu Lung with successful break as Filler... that guy rarely miss anything..

Fargorate is very accurate, I would add Kaci to that.

To me Wu shouts the best at the moment.. Filler won due to that lucky 2 ball fluke.

in worlds TOP 10 Taiwanese players are half of that. Only SVB, Kaci and Filler would be part of that.. Wu, Liu Haitao and rest Taiwaneese..
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I'm right there with you on Wu. He's really something special. I have said for a few years now that I think he plays the best position of any player today, having followed in the steps of Buddy Hall and Ralf Souquet, whom I believe to have been the best two pattern players before him.

In a match of any length, Wu might just be a slight favorite over Filler, but it could go either way for sure.
 
G

gxman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
At Large Stats,

Break-and-run games, on all breaks:
Filler -- 36% (16 of 45)
Wu -- 47% (20 of 43)
Shaw -- 53% (19 of 36)
Van Boening -- 46% (23 of 50)
4-player total -- 45% (78 of 174)
Other 43 players -- 30% (132 of 445)
All 47 players -- 34% (210 of 619)
 
highkarate

highkarate

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
People are saying Filler's safety game is suspect. People used to say that about Wu as well. If either of them are weak safety players, then safety play is overrated. I think like Wu, Filler, and Shaw are probably the most high-powered offensive players in the game, and they also happen to be like the 3 favorites to win any tournament they play in. So what does that tell you about the importance of safety play if you consider their safety play subpar? For the record, I agree with SJM that Filler's safety game is fine or even very good. But at this level of 9 ball and 10 ball, out-gunning is a way higher priority than out-moving.
 
Get_A_Grip

Get_A_Grip

Truth Will Set You Free
Silver Member
highkarate said:
People are saying Filler's safety game is suspect. People used to say that about Wu as well. If either of them are weak safety players, then safety play is overrated. I think like Wu, Filler, and Shaw are probably the most high-powered offensive players in the game, and they also happen to be like the 3 favorites to win any tournament they play in. So what does that tell you about the importance of safety play if you consider their safety play subpar? For the record, I agree with SJM that Filler's safety game is fine or even very good. But at this level of 9 ball and 10 ball, out-gunning is a way higher priority than out-moving.
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Many people agree that Filler is not the best in the world right now. His shotmaking certainly doesn't need improving, so that leaves his safety play, which SJM agrees was sub-par in Stage 2 of the tournament.

To consider him the best in the world, he needs to elevate his safety play to the level of his shot making. I think that would do it.



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