Scorekeeping for 14.1

topcat1953

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My take on scorekeeping for 14.1.

Growing up playing on Brunswick equipment, the Gold Crowns always sported two counters on both sides of the foot rail. I would like to think Brunswick had the Straight Pool shooters in mind when they had that feature. One counter could be used for the rack score and the other for the running total. Simple enough, easy to understand. Although, with this method of scorekeeping, the shooters should always be on their toes as to whether the rack scores and totals are correct because they are not visible unless one is physically checking to be sure the numbers are accurate. It is known that trusting your opponent to validate the scoring could be a mistake. My advice when using this method is to check the score often, particularly at the end of each rack if you are still the shooter. Don’t rely on your opponent to make your score correct. At different times throughout my playing career, whole racks have mysteriously disappeared from scorekeeping, because I had relied on my opponents’ honesty or integrity to get the score right. I can say that I like to announce the rack score and the total if I am racking the balls, therefore my opponent knows I am being square. Plus, if my opponent is on a run, I like to clarify the length of said run before he shoots at the break shot.

Then there is the use of the beads on the wire. This is the best and most fun method, in my opinion, since the score is visible to both shooters and any sweaters interested in the game. But, there is a certain simple way in which the beads should be handled in order to assure accuracy for both participating shooters. The most important thing in using the beads is keeping the rack score accurate. If this is done properly, the total will always be correct. Players should slide the number of beads equivalent to balls pocketed at the end of each inning during each rack. Often, there may be several innings to clear the balls off the table in any particular rack. Such as 7-7, 9-5, 12-2, etc. As an example, player A pockets the first 4 balls of the rack and slides 4 beads to the center of the wire. Player B shoots off 5 balls and before moving any beads, player B will look over to see how many beads had been moved by player A and check the number of balls still on the table, in which the remaining balance will determine the number of balls pocketed and the number of beads to be moved for his inning. Player A, then clears off the remaining balls on the table and has set up for a reasonable break shot. Very simply then, player A should be able to see that player B has pocketed 5 balls and he has pocketed 5 more balls to complete the rack. So, player A will now have 9 beads displayed and player B will have 5 beads displayed for moving over to the running total group.

But, wait! To be fair, since player A is still at the table, he should not be the one who slides his beads into the running total. This should be done by player B, who is the racker. Reason is that player B has not actually had a chance to examine the number of beads to be moved. An unwritten protocol dictates that player B is the one who will slide both sets of beads into the running totals for both players. This helps to avoid the old cliché of an opponent “playing the wire” or moving too many beads.

This all may seem annul, but this procedure in handling the beads will help avoid any arguments or disagreements regarding the score.

The reason I bring this up is that I had a match with a very accomplished player recently and had jumped out to a big lead in a game to 125 points. Since I was the one who was finishing off most of the racks, I was moving my beads into the center of the wire for my opponents approval, hence he could then slide them over to the running total. But, he was taking exception to me not moving my beads over myself, which didn’t make sense to me. Wouldn’t you know it, but the subsequent rack after he started fussing, I pocketed the break shot and opened up a few balls. I then lost focus for a second and missed a makeable ball. He cleared off the remaining 13 balls, then counted out 13 beads and just slid them all the way over onto the running total, without me being able to validate how many he moved. This happened one more time, then I explained to him that I wanted to have the option to check his beads before they were moved to the total.

This ruffled his feathers and he responded with that he was honest and would never cheat on the score. I, of course, explained that it had nothing to do with his honesty and that I reserve the right to see if he has the right amount of beads, whether I actually count them or not. He still does not necessarily agree with my take on “bead protocol”, but we are still friends and fellow competitors.
 

SpiderWebComm

HelpImBeingOppressed
Silver Member
There's def bead protocol. I typically dont slide them over completely. I like to leave a one shaft gap between the rack score and rest of beads so my opponent can verify after the rack is over.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
 

dmgwalsh

Straight Pool Fanatic
Silver Member
I agree that you should not slide them all the way over. You should give the other player the courtesy of looking at the numbers and you should be given the same courtesy.

There are a couple of fellows in my league that want me to slide them over, and they also want to slide their own all the way over.

Sometimes, I will be racking the balls and I look up and there is nothing to see.

With the counters, you are right, too. The best way would be for the racker/scorer to announce the numbers. Usually, it is awkward for the shooter to get in and check as the racker usually has the counters inadvertently blocked.
 

sfleinen

14.1 & One Pocket Addict
Gold Member
Silver Member
To be honest -- and I'm probably in the minority here -- I've NEVER been a fan of those GC counters that are mounted on the top surface of the foot rail.

For one thing, they are just plain badly placed. All too often, when I'm shooting a shot that requires I place my bridge hand on the foot rail -- it never fails -- that *&^%$ counter is in the way. I find I have to fiddle with my bridge to prevent any part of my fingers from touching the rollers -- which inevitably are poorly maintained (the clicker mechanism no longer works and the wheels just spin freely) -- and I find that my fingers or the part of my hand touching them easily disturbs them.

For another thing, it's very easy to "palm" the counter and cheat when bridging over it. The fact that, as the OP explained, the counters are not always visible to the opponent in the chair, exacerbates this version of the "playing the wire" problem.

I always try to use the overhead bead string whenever possible, and as Dave (Spidey) says, use bead protocol, being always careful to segregate-out each table visit's number of pocketed balls with a "space" between groupings, such that my opponent and any onlookers can easily inspect it. I also make sure, if I foul, to slide my penalty bead from my previously-committed total, "through" the groupings, over to the other [unused] side.

Again, maybe I'm in the minority here, but I'm definitely NOT a fan of those GC in-rail counters, even though I pretty much grew up on Gold Crown tables.

-Sean
 

StraightPoolIU

Brent
Silver Member
You could also go the keeping it on paper route, and there are a couple of smartphone apps out there that keep score as well.
 

Wink

14.1 Wannabe
Silver Member
I have beads, counters and smartphone app.

Personally, I HATE the counters on the table as they seem to never have a solid click between numbers, but seem to free spin. This means that whenever they get accidentally bumped, the score gets all screwed up. Second, I have to put glasses on to score. I can use beads or smart apps without glasses.

My favorite, and I use it every game is a smart app on an iPad. I get the functionality of the smart app, with the easy to view screen of an iPad.

I use BilliardsBuddy and love it. It tracks all the safeties, fouls, handicaps, etc... and at the end of the game, you have a full record of every inning, as well as your average per inning.

mzl.bmtdxllt.320x480-75.jpg


http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/billiards-buddy-score-counter/id399341220?mt=8
 

krupa

The Dream Operator
Silver Member
You could also go the keeping it on paper route, and there are a couple of smartphone apps out there that keep score as well.

I think paper has the same problem as the built-in counters. You have to go out of your way to look at it. Smartphones are even worse because the screen could go black or even lock, requiring the owner of said phone to unlock it to view/change the score and still have the problem of the other guy being able to review the score easily.

I use beads and like them. They're simple, easy to glance at to view the score, and easy to double-check the other guy's work (when he puts some space between them.) They also don't require bug fixes, are platform-independent (work regardless of what table you own), and don't crash (unless someone jumps up and rips them down.)

I was taught to keep the rack score in groups of four beads (never got a good explanation of why 4, though), and at the end of the rack, we usually call out the rack score before moving the beads.

Since I don't get to play a lot of 14.1, I find that I frequently move too many or two few beads and have to adjust them. This is another good reason why the other guy should be able to review the score: unintentional mis-scoring.
 

mnhighrunlist

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When first started playing we also used the beads to keep score of rotation. 61 points or over you were the winner. Problem with many rail rotary counters is that once broken or worn out they are seldom replaced or fixed. I think it was only GC 1 and 2 that had these counters.

Today I use Ipad scoring app "Billiards Buddy" and love it.

-Dennis in MN
 

DogsPlayingPool

"What's in your wallet?"
Silver Member
I like the way the double GC counters work, though I don't care for the counters embedded in the rails. I made one, dropping a couple of aftermarket counters into the lid of a cigar box.

I don't like the beads at all. It's tough to keep the rack score separated from the total; any inadvertent bump of the wire with the cue easily causes the beads to slide together, ruining the scoring process.
 

robsnotes4u

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There us a good iPhone/ipad app i think it is called Billiard Buddy keeps score and stats

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

krupa

The Dream Operator
Silver Member
I don't like the beads at all. It's tough to keep the rack score separated from the total; any inadvertent bump of the wire with the cue easily causes the beads to slide together, ruining the scoring process.

This is dependent on the quality of the hanging, I guess. At my friend's house, there's a lot of extra space on the wire (he's strung them across a corner of the room) and you'd have to whack the snot out of it to get the beads to slide together.
 

StraightPoolIU

Brent
Silver Member
Also regarding the scoring beads I haven't been in a poolroom yet in Indiana that has them. This makes them rather difficult to use.
 

14-1StraightMan

High Run 127
Silver Member
Beads

I really like the beads best of all. If you go over to my profile page. Scroll down to the Album post & click on my game room photo. You can see the custom bead brackets that a friend of mine made for me (click on the photo & it will get larger). That wire is very tight and there is plenty of room to keep the total score away from the rack score. I like that "old time" pool room look.
My table also has the roll scorer that are built in. The only problem with them. I have done and I have seen other players roll the score by accident when placing their hand down on the rail as they set up for their shot.
 

poolmouse

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I really like the beads best of all. If you go over to my profile page. Scroll down to the Album post & click on my game room photo. You can see the custom bead brackets that a friend of mine made for me (click on the photo & it will get larger). That wire is very tight and there is plenty of room to keep the total score away from the rack score. I like that "old time" pool room look.
My table also has the roll scorer that are built in. The only problem with them. I have done and I have seen other players roll the score by accident when placing their hand down on the rail as they set up for their shot.

I'm sorry to disagree with you Mike, but your beads are quite defective. Whenever we play, the beads on my side appear to stick, while yours slide over nicely. Yep, definitely a problem with the beads.

:D
 

topcat1953

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The old Yankee Athletic Association, in York, PA, was "The" place to play when I was learning to play, in the 70’s. The clubhouse had opened in 1949 and the area specified for the pool tables was designed by Brunswick. That area was an open alcove with four nine foot Brunswick Centennials. Around the perimeter of the tables was a solid one piece leather bench. There were several rotating Centennial Cue racks for house cues.

There were two wires stretched across the length of the playing area, with brackets to keep the beads separate and each table had 150 point beads to keep score with. Black beads on the top, white beads on the bottom.

The old timers there would get you trained, in a hurry, as to how the beads were to be handled for scorekeeping. Never did one just slide 5 or 6 or 7 or 8, etc. beads over into the middle of the wire, particularly those indicating the rack score. Beads always had to be separated into small groups. Such as if you score 9 balls, you would slide over three groups of three beads. Or, perhaps, seven balls, you would move three beads, then one, then three more. This made it easy to see how many total balls that had been scored. Fourteens were usually shown as 5, 5 and 4.

If a player was on a run, Those balls pocketed prior to a break shot were kept slightly separate for the running total. If the next rack was run out to continue the run, 14 beads were moved over to the previous beads connecting the run, but there would be a small gap between the beads from the previous rack and the one just score. Each subsequent rack would be moved over keeping a small gap between rack scored. It was cool to see 3 or 4 or 5 racks strung together on the wire.

Plus, it was easy for spectators to see and understand what was happening.
 

Pushout

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have beads, counters and smartphone app.

Personally, I HATE the counters on the table as they seem to never have a solid click between numbers, but seem to free spin. This means that whenever they get accidentally bumped, the score gets all screwed up. Second, I have to put glasses on to score. I can use beads or smart apps without glasses.

My favorite, and I use it every game is a smart app on an iPad. I get the functionality of the smart app, with the easy to view screen of an iPad.

I use BilliardsBuddy and love it. It tracks all the safeties, fouls, handicaps, etc... and at the end of the game, you have a full record of every inning, as well as your average per inning.

mzl.bmtdxllt.320x480-75.jpg


http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/billiards-buddy-score-counter/id399341220?mt=8

I have this app and another on my iPhone but haven't used either of them yet. I understand it's quite a drain on cell phone batteries. Don't have an iPad.
 

skierlawyer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When using beads

I agree with the OP on the proper protocols, to me its part of the etiquette of pool.

I prefer to use a house cue when moving the beads, does anyone else do this? I'm paranoid about damaging my shaft.
 

DogsPlayingPool

"What's in your wallet?"
Silver Member
I agree with the OP on the proper protocols, to me its part of the etiquette of pool.

I prefer to use a house cue when moving the beads, does anyone else do this? I'm paranoid about damaging my shaft.

You are not alone. That's another reason I dislike beads. That and the fact that most places they are used they are not wired tight enough to keep them from running together, especially when the wire is inadvertently tapped by the cue while putting up a score.
 

nashville14:1

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
score sheet, beads, counter, app

i have not used app so i have no opinion. i find the beads to be a lot less objectionable than the counters. but i see major shortcomings on both. so i have taken time to design a scoresheet that fits on an 8/5x11 sheet on a clipboard. it will be no harder to use and show much more info for those who are just a little OC sbout 14.1 As soon as i get a chance i will scan & post, if i can figure out how to post photos. i will include a 50 page instruction manual showing how and why to use all those extra columns. Of course when everyone sees this sheet, it will be adopted and used universally.
jr
 

topcat1953

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
i have not used app so i have no opinion. i find the beads to be a lot less objectionable than the counters. but i see major shortcomings on both. so i have taken time to design a scoresheet that fits on an 8/5x11 sheet on a clipboard. it will be no harder to use and show much more info for those who are just a little OC sbout 14.1 As soon as i get a chance i will scan & post, if i can figure out how to post photos. i will include a 50 page instruction manual showing how and why to use all those extra columns. Of course when everyone sees this sheet, it will be adopted and used universally.
jr

Can't wait!!
 
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