Vernon Elliot "The Faceless Man" - Great Road Player, or The Greatest?

fun story from CJ

I was under the impression that CJ was a better player than Vernon at everything but bankpool

I played vernon twice and didn't know who he was until it was over both times

These stories are the best entertainment on the forum,CJ has had some experiences and
has the gift to make hearing them fun

CJ Wiley said:

Vernon Elliot may have been the greatest underworld pool player in the world - this is the story of when I played him in Indianapolis and learned techniques I later utilized in my professional career.

Vernon would never play in a pool tournament, but he won more gambling in a week than top professional players could win in a year!



https://youtu.be/pIA7-OFQQ6U

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Another great little story from CJ. I spent over three decades working at pool tournaments all over the country and only saw Vern Elliott twice. The first time was at Johnston City and the second time was at LeCue's in Houston. He was as elusive as Jack Cooney and played just as good too!

too pretty players

A great story!

I always backed off from those too pretty players until I saw them in action. I had been known to go home, take a shower, then put the clothes from working in my body shop all day back on myself. Bondo curlings hanging off of them was a nice touch.

Hu

CJ Wiley said:

Yes, he wasn't fond of the spotlight at all! His famous quote was "I'd rather cop a store than play in a pool tournament!"

We had a lot of mutual friends and I met up with him in Chattanooga Tn. a couple times with some other road players. We beat a guy in Georgia out of over $100,000 - one thing about Vernon he knew how to make the BIG SCORES. He must have won over $900,000 in Detroit all together playing one pocket on the snooker table mostly.

I miss those old school players, they are almost all gone now. There will never be those types of characters in the game again like Cooney, Billy Johnson, CornBread Red, Jersey Jack, Eddie Tayor, JR Weldon, Omaha John, and Dalton Leong.

The Game is the Teacher

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You forgot Ronnie and Keith and Louie Roberts. New York Blackie and Marvin were two more of my favorite characters. Yes, that was a great time to be around the pool world. I never had a lot of money but I never lacked for entertainment either.

I've heard of some elite level pros who wouldn't play Vernon Elliot for money.

I posted some articles about Vernon at https://www.liveabout.com/greatest-pool-hustler-vernon-elliott-368759

A legend!

CJ,
Nice post...
"There was another man,
Don Willis,
Seemed like he also didn't want tourney play-
didn't want anyone taking his picture
Only gambling,
Apparently on the road with Luther Lassiter for many years

CJ Wiley said:

Yes, "Portland Don" Willis was a special road player too, he was known for his superb cue ball control and could run a rack and never tough the cueball to a rail.
He was a bit before my time, but Wade Crane aka Billy Johnson spoke highly of him in several conversations we had. Wade may have even told me Don had a great influence on how he developed his break shot. (I'm not 100%, correct me if I'm wrong).
I was on the road at the ideal time, riding the wave created by the Color of Money in 1986. That year I won the World Series of Tavern Pool then dropped off the tournament scene for 5 years and only played high dollar matches and studied martial arts mixed with an obsession for learning Neuro Linguistic Programming from Richard Bandler and several other teachers from Texas, Colorado, and Hawaii. (I took an 8 day course on the Kahuna Indian on the Big Island of Hawaii that was beyond incredible!}

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Correction CJ....
"Portland Don" was Don Watson...slim, calm. and quiet. We called him "tippy toe". Don Willis was chunky and from Ohio.
Don Watson ran a lot with Joe Cosgrove, Ronald Watkins, Grady M., and Jack Gant as well as Billy J.
I enjoyed watching old tippy toe back down Fatty once....offered the Fat Man the 8 and the "great one" left fingerprints in the chair rails and just kept talking. Fats was a buffoon, but he knew who to leave alone.
Regards.

CJ Wiley said:

Yes, "Portland Don" Willis was a special road player too, he was known for his superb cue ball control and could run a rack and never tough the cueball to a rail.

He was a bit before my time, but Wade Crane aka Billy Johnson spoke highly of him in several conversations we had. Wade may have even told me Don had a great influence on how he developed his break shot. (I'm not 100%, correct me if I'm wrong).

I was on the road at the ideal time, riding the wave created by the Color of Money in 1986. That year I won the World Series of Tavern Pool then dropped off the tournament scene for 5 years and only played high dollar matches and studied martial arts mixed with an obsession for learning Neuro Linguistic Programming from Richard Bandler and several other teachers from Texas, Colorado, and Hawaii. (I took an 8 day course on the Kahuna Indian on the Big Island of Hawaii that was beyond incredible!}

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CJ, you're confusing "Canton Don" Willis from Canton, Ohio with "Portland Don" Watson. Both were great players, Willis being Lassiter's favorite road partner and Watson possessing one of the softest touches ever seen on a pool table.

Lassiter once said of Willis that if he had to bet his life on one shot he would want Don Willis to shoot it. Willis stayed pretty much undercover his whole life, also never showing his face around a tournament until he was in his late 50's or early 60's. And then just to watch and visit with some of his old buddies. I could tell you many stories about him that would blow your mind. He was also a world beater at horseshoes and ping pong and beat our national champions at both games for the cash. No one ever beat him racing backwards either. He was an astute sports handicapper and once told me how he loved to bet baseball, spending his Summers in Vegas where the books were, and how easy it was to beat college basketball betting only on the small college teams. He said the bookies were just guessing on those games but he followed those teams closely.

Watson on the other hand had a much higher profile, spending his time at action rooms all over the country. What made him unique was you would never see him practice or warm up before playing. He might sit in a chair for a week reading the racing form and when a good player showed up looking for action he would get up, grab a cue and proceed to rob the guy! Only the very best players (like Ed Kelly, Richie Florence and Billy Johnson) could hang with him. My whole generation learned from Don Watson! Buddy Hall pretty much duplicated Watson's style of play. And he played pretty sporty too.

CJ Wiley said:

You are right, I stand corrected!

Did Don Watson show Billy the secret to breaking?

There was another player from Ohio that was a great road player, I believe he was a truck driver named Kenny McCoy. I'm not sure if he was any relation to Don McCoy from Des Moines, but he played a high level like Don.

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No relation. The "Trucker" was strictly a money player who mostly stayed around the Midwest, actually driving trucks from city to city. He'd drop off his load and head to the local poolroom to supplement his income. He was probably the second best player after George Rood and the equal of Joey Spaeth. Chuck Morgan was another great road man from Ohio back in those days. I often wonder what happened to these guys. You wouldn't have wanted to run into either one of them or Rood when you were a young man. Trust me on that. Later on you made it to the top among money players!

Don McCaughey (correct spelling) was a terrific player as well, from Iowa. He was tough as nails and was a bulldog who liked to play super long sessions and wear you down. Pretty sure he's still alive. He owned a room back there for many years.

CJ Wiley said:

You are right, I stand corrected!
Did Don Watson show Billy the secret to breaking?

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CJ, I'm not so sure that Don had much of an influence on Billy's break. I really think Billy had such a great pair of eyes that he was capable of delivering that cuetip right to dead center of the cueball into the rack with every muscle he had.
Tony Ellin was the same way. The key to those power breaks was in the eyes...that cuetip wasn't off center one bit. And I watched Billy from when he was very young.
Of course that's just my opinion only, but I can tell you this much, I don't think Billy's break was ever the same after he started playing while wearing his glasses.
It was still great, but not as it was previously. I've watched him take off his glasses for the breaks and then put them back on to continue the rack.
(By the way, I enjoy your road stories very much)
Regards,
Pete Lowenstein

Low500 said:

CJ, I'm not so sure that Don had much of an influence on Billy's break. I really think Billy had such a great pair of eyes that he was capable of delivering that cuetip right to dead center of the cueball into the rack with every muscle he had.
Tony Ellin was the same way. The key to those power breaks was in the eyes...that cuetip wasn't off center one bit. And I watched Billy from when he was very young.
Of course that's just my opinion only, but I can tell you this much, I don't think Billy's break was ever the same after he started playing while wearing his glasses.
It was still great, but not as it was previously. I've watched him take off his glasses for the breaks and then put them back on to continue the rack.
(By the way, I enjoy your road stories very much)
Regards,
Pete Lowenstein

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You got that right Pete. When Wade Crane was known as Billy Johnson he had the most powerful break in the game, far stronger (and better) than Don Watson's. The only players even close to him were David Howard and Danny Medina. Tony Ellin came along a little later.

Let me guess, you beat Kenny too on the 5x10

CJ Wiley said:

You are right, I stand corrected!

Did Don Watson show Billy the secret to breaking?

There was another player from Ohio that was a great road player, I believe he was a truck driver named Kenny McCoy. I'm not sure if he was any relation to Don McCoy from Des Moines, but he played a high level like Don.

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