Can anyone make this shot?

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
https://youtu.be/wTsg-S2_I40

I tried to duplicate the ball positions of your sketch exactly. I made it on the third try. Dead ball. I don't know what to tell you, I'm a B player at best. Get back to the practice room;)

Screen Shot 2018-09-11 at 5.28.04 PM.png
 
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jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
It's Efren and all, and the delayed english effects are well known, but I don't think he's making that on a Diamond.

Lou Figueroa
not the Diamond
I play on anyway

I was thinking the same thing. It can be made on a Gold Crown. Good luck shooting that shot on a Diamond.
 

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
Rail compression is not required to explain the shot.
It is enough to have friction between the ball and the cushion as the ball moves
somewhat sideways across the cushion.

Can you think of an experiment that would distinguish between rail compression
(which seems to be something like the bunching up of the cushion material forward of the cue ball)
and simple rail-ball friction?

Well, I agree that rail-induced sidespin helps the ball reverse direction. That explains its direction off the 2nd rail.

I just think wanted to point out that rail compression is necessary to shorten up the ball enough,
for this induced sidespin to be be useful in getting the ball 'backwards'... backwards enough to go into a pocket.

Without the shortening caused by rail compression, the induced sidespin would try to bring the ball back,
but I don't think it could ever be enough to pocket the ball.

This bank would illustrate it better I think -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytPZcWNa2Ao

With lines shown: https://i.imgur.com/u1OFBR2.jpg

If the ball didn't shorten a ton off the first rail (near the meucci sticker) I think it hits the 2nd rail around the end of the yellow line.

We know that the induced spin changes its angle off the 2nd rail. By how much? By about the difference between the light green line,
and the dark green line. That's a healthy change in rebound angle, but if the object ball reversed by that amount from the end of the yellow line...
it could never go backwards enough to get near either pocket. So it's a combination of shortening and rail-induced spin. And of the 2 I think the shortening plays a bigger role.

My other thought, which is just a guess, is that the "cupping" of the ball by the rail gives it more surface area in contact with the ball, which in turn creates more grip to turn the ball. Like so:

joF0t1C.jpg


As for experiments, I am having trouble thinking of one that removed rail compression from the equation.
I guess wooden rails, or putting pool cloth on a floor and wall and observing how much spin transfers when it is rolled at an angle into the wall.

Not 100% relevant but do you recall ever seeing this demonstration of collision-induced sidespin? I remember being taught this as a kid.
I cannot recall the exact CB starting position. But the idea is clip the 1 as thinly as humanly possible.
The CB picks up sidespin and reverses off the 2nd rail, with minimal force. https://pad.chalkysticks.com/5589d.png
 

BRussell

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Does rail compression cause shortening? I found this video of some guy on the internet showing that it actually lengthens banks a little; instead it’s the lack of forward roll on a high-speed shot that causes shortening.

https://youtu.be/wjeMWHfmMk4
 

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Does rail compression cause shortening? I found this video of some guy on the internet showing that it actually lengthens banks a little; instead it’s the lack of forward roll on a high-speed shot that causes shortening.

https://youtu.be/wjeMWHfmMk4
Does he really look like the kind of person you should trust on the interwebz?:eek: He doesn't even have a ferrule on that stick.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
As others said, nothing new. Very, very common shot in 1hole and banks.

Also, like Jay and others said..... diamond table, good luck cause you'll need it.

Btw, it is possible on diamond but I'm talking 1 in 100+..... literally.

Rake
 

BRussell

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Does he really look like the kind of person you should trust on the interwebz?:eek: He doesn't even have a ferrule on that stick.

Probably a hustler. I found another video of the same guy beating Shane Van Boening in a race to 150.
 

dr_dave

Instructional Author
Gold Member
Silver Member
Dr. Dave has sold that particular dungeon and has a much nicer, roomier one now. I'm sure you would be very comfortable.:grin-devilish:
Sometimes I miss my old house with the stone-walled dungeon, but then I remember the low ceilings, drafty windows, radically changing temperature and humidity, periodic puddles after hard rains, loud furnace and water pump, crumbly asbestos pipe insulation, non-flat and cracked floor, loud noises from above if my wife walked across the floors, raucous and loud student neighbors (who sometimes "tossed cookies" on my front lawn during late-night lapses of judgement), etc. Yep, I think I like my new "dungeon" much better.

Regards,
Dave
 

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I do hope to visit ft Collins again, someday.

I lived ther for a summer, back in like 2001 or 2. Didn't hit a pool ball once.

I do have people I'd love to see out there.

I, i , i....
 

chefjeff

If not now...
Silver Member
I found a unique way to make this shot from a video from long ago:

tenor.gif




Jeff Livingston
 
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