There will be blood

T

thebark

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I didn't want to have to start this thread. I wanted the governing body to act in judicious way, or at least in a way that would save them the embarrassment of abuse on a public forum, but their failure to act leads me to post here.

Here are the details. At the recent BCAPL 8Ball Championships held at the Rio many of my friends told me of a team that was playing with an unqualified player. Not an amazing story, it's been done before, but this time it was a League Operator's team (Jerry Stuckart Wednesday Inhouse at Stingers Glendale Az). Jerry was using a player that had never played once, according to all I talked to, and was therefore ineligible for team completion. The Stuckart team had even beaten another of his inhouse teams. Needless to say people were hot. I did not play team so I felt I would be the one to let BCAPL know what was going on.

I told Bill Stock the situation.Stuckart had an unqualified player on his team by the name of John. Everyone from the inhouse league said he had never played one week. There was another player named John who had subbed enough weeks to qualify but this was absolutely a different person. I therefore suggested that the league records had been forged to show that Stuckart's John had enough weeks. I told Bill that it was a serious violation especially coming from a league operator and I hoped the BCAPL would look into it. Bill told me it would take awhile to look into because they had to look into the computer records.

I patiently waited for the ruling knowing I would see Stock and Griffin at the Southwest Regional in Phoenix over Labor Day. To me this was a very serious offense for a League Operator. Through intermediaries it was expressed To the BCAPL Senior Staff how outraged the BCA players and other league operators of Metro Phoenix were. A just ruling was needed if they didn't want this brought out for public discussion. A minimum of one year suspension of league operations (even if he was still behind the scenes) seemed fair.

Then over Labor Day there was Jerry playing in the advanced/masters singles. His punishment I heard was that he couldn't personally play teams for 1 year and was on probation for anywhere from 1 to 3 years. This for a person in a position of trust and integrity just a slap on the wrist. The BCAPL really failed all their players and league operators of Arizona. Could it be that he got off so easily because he is going to take over the Southwest Regional with Dr. Pool next year? ettu brute TresKane
 
ideologist

ideologist

I don't never exaggerate
Silver Member
That's pretty lame if that is all that happened. That's the kind of move that should get an LO banned for life, since they sign agreements to uphold league rules.

Also, I'll be following this thread:
mj-thriller-popcorn-o.gif
 
pt109

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
I would think that 1 year banishment from team play is more than a slap
on the wrist....and up to 3 years probation.

capital punishment is frowned on in many States
 
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Cdryden

Cdryden

Pool Addict
Silver Member
There will be blood? Lol, sounds a bit over dramatic, but I guess I've heard and seen worse. Good luck resolving it fairly.
 
CreeDo

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
Sounds like he broke the rules, got caught, got punished.
Suspending him as an LO (rather than as a player) means a bunch of teams suddenly have nobody to
run their league, right? If so I can see why they didn't boot him... those teams don't want to be told
"Sorry, no league this year, maybe next year".

But I agree having a dishonest LO is no good either... if he's willing to cheat to win a tournament,
maybe he's willing to be sleazy in other ways like steal dues or permit cheating in his league.

Did he ever explain why he felt compelled to blatantly break the rules?
If he's on the forums you should edit your title by putting in his name, so he has a chance to
notice it and explain what he was thinking.
 
Nullus

Nullus

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
IF it's all true, it's just another glaring example of how and why most of the amateur leagues are businesses and when push comes to shove, the amateurs lose out to 'business' decisions. It's the same reason most of them look the other way when it comes to sandbagging, or won't alter their rules. As long as they're making money, they don't want to hear about it. Sad.

(As a side note, maybe they'd be better off without a league operator and a league if that's what they have to look forward to. Maybe they can get a different league in there and give it a try?.)
 
B

Bill S

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
thebark said:
I didn't want to have to start this thread. I wanted the governing body to act in judicious way, or at least in a way that would save them the embarrassment of abuse on a public forum, but their failure to act leads me to post here.

Here are the details. At the recent BCAPL 8Ball Championships held at the Rio many of my friends told me of a team that was playing with an unqualified player. Not an amazing story, it's been done before, but this time it was a League Operator's team (Jerry Stuckart Wednesday Inhouse at Stingers Glendale Az). Jerry was using a player that had never played once, according to all I talked to, and was therefore ineligible for team completion. The Stuckart team had even beaten another of his inhouse teams. Needless to say people were hot. I did not play team so I felt I would be the one to let BCAPL know what was going on.

I told Bill Stock the situation.Stuckart had an unqualified player on his team by the name of John. Everyone from the inhouse league said he had never played one week. There was another player named John who had subbed enough weeks to qualify but this was absolutely a different person. I therefore suggested that the league records had been forged to show that Stuckart's John had enough weeks. I told Bill that it was a serious violation especially coming from a league operator and I hoped the BCAPL would look into it. Bill told me it would take awhile to look into because they had to look into the computer records.

I patiently waited for the ruling knowing I would see Stock and Griffin at the Southwest Regional in Phoenix over Labor Day. To me this was a very serious offense for a League Operator. Through intermediaries it was expressed To the BCAPL Senior Staff how outraged the BCA players and other league operators of Metro Phoenix were. A just ruling was needed if they didn't want this brought out for public discussion. A minimum of one year suspension of league operations (even if he was still behind the scenes) seemed fair.

Then over Labor Day there was Jerry playing in the advanced/masters singles. His punishment I heard was that he couldn't personally play teams for 1 year and was on probation for anywhere from 1 to 3 years. This for a person in a position of trust and integrity just a slap on the wrist. The BCAPL really failed all their players and league operators of Arizona. Could it be that he got off so easily because he is going to take over the Southwest Regional with Dr. Pool next year? ettu brute TresKane
Click to expand...

Just so you know, we have been discussing what the punishment will be over the last week. It has been decided and the certified letters are being prepared to mail out tomorrow morning.

Also, you don't know all of the facts and you are on here saying what the punishment is going to be and we just decided that so I don't know where you get your information from.

Shame on you Tres! I know that you and others are generally against Jerry to begin with.

Lost a little respect for you buddy!

Bill Stock
 
hang-the-9

hang-the-9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Once word gets out that someone is shady with his dealings, the reputation loss is enough to make most official punishment light by comparison.

I know many pool players that don't play in a few tours in the area due to the people running them having reputations for pulling stunts on the players and known players being handicapped unfairly. Once you get a reputation, you start to lose things, business, friends, fingers (in some dealings hehe).
 
FASTEDDIE427

FASTEDDIE427

BUSTIN' BALLS SINCE '86
Silver Member
I agree it might not be proper. Why did such a light sentence get handed down. It took a thread on here for things to be handled


Bill S said:
All league operators in Arizona will be informed via email tomorrow.

We don't feel it is proper to air our business in a public forum.

Bill Stock
Click to expand...
 
Roger Long

Roger Long

Sonoran Cue Creations
Silver Member
Bill S said:
Just so you know, we have been discussing what the punishment will be over the last week. It has been decided and the certified letters are being prepared to mail out tomorrow morning.

Also, you don't know all of the facts and you are on here saying what the punishment is going to be and we just decided that so I don't know where you get your information from.

Shame on you Tres! I know that you and others are generally against Jerry to begin with.

Lost a little respect for you buddy!

Bill Stock
Click to expand...

Bill,

I don't doubt for a minute that what Tres Kane has claimed about Jerry Stuckart here is true, as my team had a very similar experience with Jerry about three years ago when we played in his league. After my team mates and I confronted Jerry with the fact that he was using an ineligible player on his team in a playoff match against us, he went and altered his online records to reflect that the new player was one of his regular players. My team lost that argument and, consequently, the match, and then Jerry went bragging about his great victory over us. After that, we quit his league and vowed to never play in another league run by him.

While you may have lost a little respect for Tres, I just found a lot of new respect for him. He had the courage to come on here - state his complaint - and then sign his full name to it. My only guess as to why others haven't outed Jerry Stuckart before this is that they must be afraid of losing the league. It is a well-designed league with a lot of good players in it, but it is being run by the wrong person. And while Tres may have jumped to conclusions concerning the punishment Jerry is to receive, he jumped to no such conclusions in his assessment of Jerry's character. He was right on with that.

Roger Long
 
L

lorider

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Bill S said:
All league operators in Arizona will be informed via email tomorrow.

We don't feel it is proper to air our business in a public forum.

Bill Stock
Click to expand...

i agree with your stance on this incident whole heartedly.

it just amazes me when shit hits the fan concerning bcapl the majority of league bashers on here are pretty quiet. the one who do post on here regarding an incident with bcapl are pretty civil

i recall the thread about last years apa 9 ball team being dq'ed. the league basherers were out in droves bashing the apa for not coming on here and disclosing how they handled the situation. seems like most posters thought the apa was hiding the situation because they did not blast it across every form of major media across the entire nation.

they handled it much like you are doing but was bashed on here repeatedly because of it.

guess its just an apa thang. :confused:
 
Stones

Stones

YEAH, I'M WOOFING AT YOU!
Silver Member
A few years ago, there was a incident which I and others witnessed at the Texas State BCAPL Championships.

A few days after the incident, I was contacted by Bill Stock for my opinion on what happened. After a lengthy conversation, Bill asked me to document the details and forward them to him by email.

Bill inteviewed many people to get their opinions as to what actually happened. As a former tour director myself, my point is that it takes a lot of time and effort to gather as much information as possible before making a proper ruling for disiplinary action.

As far as outing this in a public forum, it is a BCAPL private matter and will be dealt with only by the BCAPL no matter what is said on this forum.

In my opinion, Bill is a fair minded and just man. Let him have the time to do his job.

As far as fairness of the BCAPL's ruling on this matter, some folks won't be happy unless there is a lynching. LOL



Stones
 
M

Mr Phil

New member
Don't feel it's proper to air business in a public forum? If someone who is not only a league operator, but also the President of the Arizona Ratings committee is doing anything improper I think they players have the right to know, so far this sounds like a cover up.
 
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