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Patrick Johnson
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08-24-2019, 07:46 AM

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Originally Posted by erhino41 View Post
I pivot to compensate for deflection and that's it. Although it is a part of how I aim, it isn't done simply to help me aim. I line up center cue ball dead red to the ghost ball spot. I've learned by rote the pivot I need for the specific amount of spin and speed I'm looking for. I simply apply the proper pivot and execute the stroke. In my brain I'm not actually changing my aiming point, it is still the ghost ball spot. The actual adjustments needed for squirt, swerve and throw are made subconsciously and naturally.
I think that describes the "backhand english" method of compensating for squirt/swerve.

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At the end of the day whatever system you use will only get you kind of close, the rest will have to be learned by experience.
Yup. Of course that doesn't mean aiming systems are useless, just that they're not supernatural. Some players prefer the illusion that their aiming system makes the subconscious part of aiming unnecessary for them.

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08-24-2019, 08:10 AM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
I think that describes the "backhand english" method of compensating for squirt/swerve.





Yup. Of course that doesn't mean aiming systems are useless, just that they're not supernatural. Some players prefer the illusion that their aiming system makes the subconscious part of aiming unnecessary for them.



pj

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Back hand and front hand together. That way the bridge length does not have to match the pivot length.

If something gets a person closer to being able to do something then it is by definition useful. I will never tell anyone that whatever method is getting them to understand any of this is useless, so long as it is giving them actual useable results.

I do think there are a lot of players who are over thinking aiming in the hopes that by analysis alone their games will improve. I also think there are others who are gaining actual useable results by incorporating some of these types of systems into their thought process.

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08-24-2019, 08:24 AM

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Originally Posted by erhino41 View Post
Back hand and front hand together. That way the bridge length does not have to match the pivot length.
Right. I do the same, but I don't think of it as "pivoting", just adjusting my aim for squirt/swerve.

My question in this thread is about pivoting as a way to get on the centerball aim line without sidespin (although I'm happy to hear about other uses such as yours).

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08-24-2019, 08:47 AM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
Right. I do the same, but I don't think of it as "pivoting", just adjusting my aim for squirt/swerve.

My question in this thread is about pivoting as a way to get on the centerball aim line without sidespin (although I'm happy to hear about other uses such as yours).

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Everything in this game really boils down to perception, and we all perceive differently.

I offered up my reason for pivoting merely for posterity, not by any means to debunk any other reason for using a pivot.

I've dabbled a bit with some of these aiming systems, aligning centers and edges and pivots and fractions and so on, as a means to try and understand how different minds approach this game. I admit, and I think this is why a lot of the hamb guys can't relate to these systems of learning, is that I will always be biased by the way I learned. Any attempt will always fall back on using what I already know. That makes an actual scientific attempt to understand very difficult.



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08-24-2019, 09:32 AM

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Originally Posted by erhino41 View Post
Everything in this game really boils down to perception, and we all perceive differently.





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True.
You have to visualize the two balls colliding.
For cue ball control and pocketing .


  
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08-26-2019, 07:42 AM

I came up with some interesting findings back when I was curious about how pivot systems function, like shishkabob, which a friend of mine uses very well. Here is a drawing that shows how using one point of reference on the ob (to get a line from ccb to this reference) and one exact pivot (half tip right of this reference line), produces different cut angles. Notice how most of the balls get cut toward the yellow circles. If the pocket were located at any of the yellow circles then most of these shots would hit the pocket. If not, then a different reference point in the ob would be needed.



Here's a video showing how it works on the table.

https://youtu.be/rilAhGzSH10


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08-27-2019, 11:43 PM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
Are you a pivot aimer who has thought about how pivoting works for you? How exactly it helps you find the final aim more easily, quickly, accurately? If you have any insights or ideas about that I'd be interested to hear.
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