Go Back   AzBilliards.com > Main Category > Main Forum
Reload this Page Base of Ball or Edge of Ball
Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2
 
Share Thread Tools Rate Thread
Base of Ball or Edge of Ball
Old
  (#1)
Poolhall60561
AzB Silver Member
Poolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond reputePoolhall60561 has a reputation beyond repute
 
Poolhall60561's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 1,013
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Nov 2015
   
Base of Ball or Edge of Ball - 05-24-2019, 08:25 AM

I play edge of ball when shooting out of the kitchen.
Some players want base of ball which can offer better opportunities.

What is the rule?
  
Reply With Quote

Old
  (#2)
Patrick Johnson
Fish of the Day
Patrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond repute
 
Patrick Johnson's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 20,517
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Jun 2007
   
05-24-2019, 08:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolhall60561 View Post
I play edge of ball when shooting out of the kitchen.
Some players want base of ball which can offer better opportunities.

What is the rule?
To be "in the kitchen" the base of a ball must be inside the line (not on it).

To be "out of the kitchen" the base of a ball must be on or outside the line.

For a legal hit with ball in hand in the kitchen, the cue ball must:

- start inside the line, and

- have its base on or outside the line when it contacts a ball (or a rail before hitting a ball), or

- hit a ball whose base is on or outside the line (in this case no part of the CB needs to be on or outside the line).

pj
chgo

Last edited by Patrick Johnson; 05-24-2019 at 09:00 AM.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#3)
Island Drive
AzB Silver Member
Island Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond repute
 
Island Drive's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 7,940
vCash: 500
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
   
05-24-2019, 08:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolhall60561 View Post
I play edge of ball when shooting out of the kitchen.
Some players want base of ball which can offer better opportunities.

What is the rule?
The rule is, before you start a match with anyone, this should ALWAYS....be Clear. Some guys are so anal, that you have to ask em. Center of the round rail spot or outside edge of the rail spots.

If they make a big deal ''outtof'' it....probablay better to look elsewhere for a game.


www.worldbilliardtour.com
Domain Name Only....

Bill Meacham
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#4)
Bob Jewett
Northern California

Bob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 16,934
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
   
05-24-2019, 08:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolhall60561 View Post
I play edge of ball when shooting out of the kitchen.
Some players want base of ball which can offer better opportunities.

What is the rule?
There are lots of rules as Bill mentioned. If you want to go by the rule book it is the center of the ball (or base of ball, as some say). The detail of a ball being exactly on the line is as PJ said above.

The World Standardized Rules are here: https://wpapool.com/rules-of-play/ and Rule 1.5 "Cue Ball in Hand" is the one to start with.


Bob Jewett
SF Billiard Academy
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#5)
megatron69
AzB Silver Member
megatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 228
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Phoenix az
   
05-24-2019, 11:45 AM

Best thing to do is to just take the line out of play.

I just pretend the line for the kitchen is exactly the same as the endzone line in football. So the width of the circle or the diamond is an invisible 'wall' about a half-inch think (or whatever, never bothered to measure the thing). I place the cue at least an inch inside that 'wall.'

Sidenote: Anyone anal enough to give you grief over exactly what the rule is or where exactly it's legal/illegal to place the cue in the kitchen is not worth playing. I've played dozens of these people in leagues/tournaments in nearly a dozen different states over 35 years, and it's just not worth the trouble. A good player doesn't need to try and use the rules to beat you; they will let their play speak for itself.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#6)
Bob Jewett
Northern California

Bob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 16,934
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
   
05-24-2019, 12:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by megatron69 View Post
Best thing to do is to just take the line out of play.

I just pretend ...
No, I think the best thing to do is to play by the rule. The real problem comes in when you need to know whether an object ball is playable or not. Placing the cue ball an inch different is usually not that important. For the object ball, you really need a clear rule.


Bob Jewett
SF Billiard Academy
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#7)
megatron69
AzB Silver Member
megatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond reputemegatron69 has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 228
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Phoenix az
   
05-24-2019, 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Jewett View Post
No, I think the best thing to do is to play by the rule. The real problem comes in when you need to know whether an object ball is playable or not. Placing the cue ball an inch different is usually not that important. For the object ball, you really need a clear rule.
Oh, we're talking about the object ball . . . Okay, then never mind my first post.

With the object ball, I basically do the same thing as noted above. The base of the ball must be outside the kitchen. Though I won't argue about that either; if my opponent wants to argue about whether the base of the ball is or isn't across, I'll concede it immediately and shoot something else.

Again, I'm not there to argue about a rule, I'm there to play. If I can't win because of that rule, or any rule for that matter, I didn't deserve (or wasn't good enough that night) to win anyway.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#8)
Tennesseejoe
AzB Silver Member
Tennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond reputeTennesseejoe has a reputation beyond repute
 
Tennesseejoe's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 1,910
vCash: 500
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Middle Tennessee
   
05-24-2019, 12:28 PM

It would be good if all tables had a line drawn across the head spot to show where the kitchen is. It is very much "Old School" to disregard the rules.


"Man can neither love nor hate what he does not know." Cicero
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#9)
Patrick Johnson
Fish of the Day
Patrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond repute
 
Patrick Johnson's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 20,517
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Jun 2007
   
05-24-2019, 12:33 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by megatron69 View Post
Best thing to do is to just take the line out of play.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Jewett View Post
No, I think the best thing to do is to play by the rule.
I'm kinda on the fence about whether using center or edge is better - I think it's possible to see one better than the other, and it doesn't matter to me, so... as long as it's understood, I'm good.

pj
chgo
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#10)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member

iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 11,471
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
05-24-2019, 12:45 PM

I hate the term “base of ball”. I don’t know why the rule book does not say “center of ball”.

I have 3 standard questions I ask before every 1 pocket session:

1) edge or center of ball
2) is OB off table a foul
3) are 3 fouls loss of game

In 20 years of playing, I’ve never had a single person say center of ball.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#11)
Bob Jewett
Northern California

Bob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 16,934
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
   
05-24-2019, 01:14 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
I hate the term “base of ball”. I don’t know why the rule book does not say “center of ball”....
Maybe like this from the WPA rules?
8.13 Position of Balls

The position of a ball is determined by the projection of its center vertically downward onto the playing surface. A ball is said to be placed on a line or spot when its center is placed directly over that line or spot.


Bob Jewett
SF Billiard Academy
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#12)
pt109
WO double hemlock

pt109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond reputept109 has a reputation beyond repute
 
pt109's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 28,220
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: out of country but incontinent
   
05-24-2019, 01:46 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennesseejoe View Post
It would be good if all tables had a line drawn across the head spot to show where the kitchen is. It is very much "Old School" to disregard the rules.
A room I was involved in...90s...at 4:00 AM one time, I drew in the balk line...
...the triangle, and a line from the head spot to the center of the end rail.
I came in late afternoon....and they were freaking...and checking security cameras...
...they thought it was an act of vandalism....til I explained...some people are starting to
play one pocket and straight pool....these lines solve problems.
...they relaxed and I drew more on three more action tables.

What the hell, the first one was my Anniversary

I’ve always used base of the ball...had to remind some snooker players that when
you’re shooting from the D, you can put whitey right on a spot for the D colors.


Lionize your game.
http://www.alexpagulayan.com/

MAGIC CHALK call Marco Polo 647-287-8131

If pool players had to have knowledge of geometry and physics before talking about geometry and physics, all of the aiming threads would disappear.

Bob Jewett
SF Billiard Academy

Last edited by pt109; 05-24-2019 at 01:48 PM.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#13)
336Robin
aimisthegameinpool.com
336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute336Robin has a reputation beyond repute
 
336Robin's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 13,396
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: West of Winston-Salem, NC
   
05-24-2019, 01:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
The rule is, before you start a match with anyone, this should ALWAYS....be Clear. Some guys are so anal, that you have to ask em. Center of the round rail spot or outside edge of the rail spots.

If they make a big deal ''outtof'' it....probablay better to look elsewhere for a game.
You got that right. All they are doing is trying to rob you of chances to hurt them if they scratch. At least in one pocket anyway.


"Let your "Stick" do the talking!"

336Robin
"Improve your shot making forever for $3.99!"


The Target Ball Concept-Aiming,
The Flight of the Cue Ball-Aiming Adjusted for Side Spin,
Robbing the Bank Shot!-Pass Over Banking
Change your game for a couple of Bucks! and
Comes with a lesson!

website:http://aimisthegameinpool.com
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#14)
Patrick Johnson
Fish of the Day
Patrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond reputePatrick Johnson has a reputation beyond repute
 
Patrick Johnson's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 20,517
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: Jun 2007
   
05-24-2019, 05:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
I hate the term “base of ball”. I don’t know why the rule book does not say “center of ball”.
I like "base of" ball's descriptiveness - but you mostly judge a ball's position near the line by sighting from above, where "center of" ball is probably more useful.

pj
chgo
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#15)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member

iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 11,471
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
05-24-2019, 05:40 PM

The problem I have with the word base, is when you are down with your eyeball near the table, there is a patch of ball about 1/4” wide that looks like it’s all in contact with the cloth. I’ve had some players when I asked them “what does base of ball rule mean to you” say that entire patch counts. And a couple of these guys were good players.

I’ve seen the same thing with spotting balls on the foot spot, or racking. That the entire approx 1” diameter of the paper spot counts!

When you use the word center, I think it’s much less ambiguous. It’s a point. Not a patch.
  
Reply With Quote
Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.