Bogus Tim Scruggs Cue

nick serdula · Dec 10, 2016

When I was shown this Cue last month it had no logo and was described as unknown. I see it is on ebay now and has a TS logo.
Think of it what you will.
I have bought a Cue from this seller and also have told him to loose my number.
That was before this Cue grew a logo.
Seems I saw the BS coming down the track so to speak.
That being said here is the Cue with an old butt cap and no logo.
Caviet emp ouch.
Merry Christmas every body,
Nick Serdula

Chopdoc · Dec 10, 2016

That cue was discussed in the main forum.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=441150

How offensive that it turns up for sale on Ebay with a logo on it.

Where is AZB member HoldemRw?

.

SC02GTP · Dec 10, 2016

After reading the thread in the link above, I thought Bob Frey authenticated this cue and I don't see the issue with it being offered on Ebay. Not my cue, just clearly confused.

Chopdoc · Dec 10, 2016

SC02GTP said:
After reading the thread in the link above, I thought Bob Frey authenticated this cue and I don't see the issue with it being offered on Ebay. Not my cue, just clearly confused.

It seems to have been cleared up. The OP showed up, as you say, and explained it.

The cue is sold now anyway.

I would never mess with a sale, that was a cue ID thread that I and others had commented in.

Glad it got ironed out.

.

shadowmoss · Dec 10, 2016

?

After looking at some of my old TS's there is nothing popping out at me saying this could not be a Scruggs but you can never tell with all the oddball thing Tim has been ask to do in his life time or any other cue maker.for that matter.

WildWing · Dec 10, 2016

There were a few of us who did recognize this as a Scruggs. The hints were the point length, space between the points, the wrap, and very important, the way the shaft brass inserts are shaped. You had to have some of Tim's older cues to recognize all this. That eliminates most of the field here.

Yet, there are some who said bogus. They have not a clue. I guess it's about par for AZ.

All the best,
WW

Billiardbills · Dec 10, 2016

The horseshoe cue on the far right has the exact same ringwork as well as the pilots are proper.

There's another cue below by Tim with the same ringwork and pilots.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bank it · Dec 10, 2016

nick serdula said:
When I was shown this Cue last month it had no logo and was described as unknown. I see it is on ebay now and has a TS logo.

Think of it what you will.

I have bought a Cue from this seller and also have told him to loose my number.

That was before this Cue grew a logo.

Seems I saw the BS coming down the track so to speak.

That being said here is the Cue with an old butt cap and no logo.

Caviet emp ouch.

Merry Christmas every body,

Nick Serdula

..................

PRED · Dec 10, 2016

So you can get a Scruggs cue logoed posthumously?

WildWing · Dec 10, 2016

PRED said:
So you can get a Scruggs cue logoed posthumously?

By Bob Frey you can.

All the best,
WW

Chopdoc · Dec 10, 2016

Billiardbills said:
The horseshoe cue on the far right has the exact same ringwork as well as the pilots are proper.

There's another cue below by Tim with the same ringwork and pilots.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you for the visual reference.

.

PRED · Dec 11, 2016

WildWing said:
By Bob Frey you can.

All the best,
WW

Did Scruggs bequeath this service to him? I can see a LOA but adding a logo to a cue the maker didn't add his mark to when he was alive seems extraordinarily out of bounds.

Billiardbills · Dec 11, 2016

PRED said:
Did Scruggs bequeath this service to him? I can see a LOA but adding a logo to a cue the maker didn't add his mark to when he was alive seems extraordinarily out of bounds.

Bob Frey worked with Tim for some time and he is about the only one that has the authority to add it to a true Scruggs cue.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

PRED · Dec 11, 2016

Billiardbills said:
Bob Frey worked with Tim for a LONG time and he is about the only one that has the authority to add it to a true Scruggs cue.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What is this "Authority" you assert? Is it from Scruggs Estate? Were the heirs of Scruggs compensated for the use of their property? Again I ask how you add a logo when the Maker deemed it not necessary? Did Scruggs refuse to add it previously and now the deed is done?

Billiardbills · Dec 11, 2016

I have no idea but if you have a cue that IS A SCRUGGS Bob can put a new butt cap with a TS logo on it. It is pretty widely known that Bob is Tim's authorized repair shop. It's also on Bob Frey's website.

Go check it out yourself.

PRED · Dec 11, 2016

Repair is one thing, adding a logo is a whole different animal. If it is a known Scruggs then you guys should have no problem with how the Maker designed the cue and tout it as a logo delete, a rare bird. Maybe there is a photo of the cue with the logo and the butt cap was replaced later. The logo gives it instant provenance to the unsuspecting, which can occur innocently as the cue changes hands over the years.

nick serdula · Dec 11, 2016

Bob Frey

Bob will only logo a Cue that already had a logo. If the butt cap is damaged he will replace it. If Bob put a logo on this Cue he must have built it. But Bob has just about no memory today especially concerning previous builds. He knows his work when he sees it. I talked with Bob 2 days ago just before seeing this Cue with the logo added. I will make it a point to ask if Bob himself did the logo. I did tell the owner to send it to Bob.
If he did he might be the only one of a very few that has ever taken that advise.
Without asking Mr Bob I can only say what I saw. A cue with no logo and then the same Cue with a logo added.
Nick

Chopdoc · Dec 11, 2016

WildWing said:
There were a few of us who did recognize this as a Scruggs. The hints were the point length, space between the points, the wrap, and very important, the way the shaft brass inserts are shaped. You had to have some of Tim's older cues to recognize all this. That eliminates most of the field here.

Yet, there are some who said bogus. They have not a clue. I guess it's about par for AZ.

All the best,
WW

I figured it for a frankencue. Modified perhaps. I could not rule out a Scruggs, obviously, modified or otherwise.

I am very happy it ended up properly identified.

.

nick serdula · Dec 11, 2016

Also

Tim would not logo a Cue if he didn't like the final result. He would destroy them usually in front of a full shop. Every now and then a friend of the shop would beg the Cue. And Tim would discount it accordingly. The front of this Cue has a bad blemish. That is why I said I doubted Tim would put his name on it.
The owner dies. Never sold the Cue as he promised and it gets sold for $200.
It is not a TS Cue guys. It is a no logo second at best. More than likely given to a friend at best. I knew that when I saw the Cue.
Experts you say.
Knew right away you say.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight,
Nick

Chopdoc · Dec 11, 2016

PRED said:
Did Scruggs bequeath this service to him? I can see a LOA but adding a logo to a cue the maker didn't add his mark to when he was alive seems extraordinarily out of bounds.

It's a matter of a repair.

Some cue makers will authorize somebody else to produce their logo for repairs.

Frey is, of course, the perfect person to do so for Scruggs.

As was already said, Frey probably remembered the cue and knew it originally had a logo. That's an assumption, of course.

.

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