Shafts breaking, suggestion?

Kurt · May 25, 2011

I've now broken two Predator 314-2 shafts in a row. Both times it happened when I was putting extreme draw on the ball. It's because when I'm stroking the ball, I end up pushing the shaft down on the table. I'm pretty accurate with the draw shots but obviously my stroke needs work, since I've never seen this happen before with anybody else.

Either way, it seems like I can't use the Predator 314-2 shaft anymore..it just can't handle the flex I'm putting on the shaft.

So...I need a new shaft that can handle the pressures I put on it. Preferably, I'd like it to have really low deflection and be a quality/proven shaft. Any suggestions on a shaft I can use that I won't break?

hang-the-9 · May 25, 2011

If you can break 2 shafts with your stroke, you may want to try baseball. I have never seen anyone hit a ball with draw that will cause a shaft to bend enough to snap. I've seen shafts bend pretty far during the break.

My suggestion would be to check how you hit the ball more than a new shaft

Are you pushing down on the cue when you hit like you would when you're digging with a shovel? That may explain the issue here. Maybe spend a bit of time with an instructor to see what is going on.

As far as "sturdiness" goes, the OB is made up of interlocking peices instead of pie shaped ones, that may hold up better.

Drew · May 25, 2011

Where did it break? The flexing shaft concentrates stress on the ferrule tenon. You have a serious stroke issue if you're doing this on draw shots. You can either keep buying new shafts or you can fix your stroke. Start using an open bridge on all your shots, including draw shots.

donuteric · May 25, 2011

I'd agree with the previous two posters.

I broke my Z2 ferrule once when I over struck a draw shot, missed, and scooped the CB with the edge of the ferrule. That took out small part of the tip, and the ferrule was bent slightly. It was fixed by simply replacing a tip.

If this is a recurring theme, I'd certainly work on that draw stroke. Sometimes it's not about the speed, it's where the CB you're supposed to hit at.

Kurt · May 25, 2011

hang-the-9 said:
If you can break 2 shafts with your stroke, you may want to try baseball. I have never seen anyone hit a ball with draw that will cause a shaft to bend enough to snap. I've seen shafts bend pretty far during the break.

My suggestion would be to check how you hit the ball more than a new shaft

Are you pushing down on the cue when you hit like you would when you're digging with a shovel? That may explain the issue here. Maybe spend a bit of time with an instructor to see what is going on.

As far as "sturdiness" goes, the OB is made up of interlocking peices instead of pie shaped ones, that may hold up better.

Both 314-2 shafts broke when I was drawing the cue ball. I tend to push down pretty hard on the table with the shaft immediately after the stroke. I could tell the shaft was weakening, because I've been hearing little cracking sounds for weeks now when I would do draw shots..then finally the shaft broke..not completely in half, but still broke. I never break with my stick either. AND, interestingly enough...I have a Tim Scruggs, and I had played with the original Scruggs shaft for 5 straight years with no issues whatsoever...then within 10 months of buying my first 314-2, it breaks..and then within 3 months of getting a replacement, the second one breaks.

I realize something is seriously wrong with how I draw the ball (even though I tend to make it most of the time), but it seems to me that the 314-2 isn't as sturdy as the original Scruggs shaft that came with the stick. I guess I could give the OB a try and see if it can withstand my draws

Kurt · May 25, 2011

Drew said:
Where did it break? The flexing shaft concentrates stress on the ferrule tenon. You have a serious stroke issue if you're doing this on draw shots. You can either keep buying new shafts or you can fix your stroke. Start using an open bridge on all your shots, including draw shots.

That's not a bad idea about using an open bridge on my draw shots...I can do it, but I find it's a lot easier to use a closed bridge when it comes to a long draw shot.

The shaft is breaking very close to the center....nowhere near the ferrule.

brandoncook26 · May 25, 2011

My suggestion....stop breaking shafts (couldn't help it).

Seriously, unless you have the worst luck ever, it is not a shaft problem. You need work on your stroke. Honestly, you are probably hindering your ability. If you put that much force on your draw, you are using to much power when stroking. A quality stroke should look effortless. You do not need to force it, you can smooth draw and get MORE out of your stroke.

I have found that when I try to draw, I put much more power into it and get about half the results. The best draw shots I've ever had felt like I did nothing and I actually overdrew my position.

-Brandon

plshrk22 · May 25, 2011

Are you keeping your cue as level as possible? Or are you jacking the butt up to get the tip lower when you are cueing up for the draw shot?

Black-Balled · May 25, 2011

-Doctor, It hurts when I do this.
-Stop doing that. Or go back to the regular shafts.

Sounds pretty straightforward to me.

Kurt · May 25, 2011

plshrk22 said:
Are you keeping your cue as level as possible? Or are you jacking the butt up to get the tip lower when you are cueing up for the draw shot?

I'm keeping the cue level when I stroke it, but have a tendency to push downwards near the end of the stroke.

It's weird though..I've seen Mike Sigel's break shot, and it looks like he's about to snap his shaft in half every time he breaks..but it doesn't ever seem to break. I can't imagine I'm putting more force on the shaft with a draw shot than he is when he breaks.

Black-Balled · May 25, 2011

Kurt said:
I'm keeping the cue level when I stroke it, but have a tendency to push downwards near the end of the stroke.

It's weird though..I've seen Mike Sigel's break shot, and it looks like he's about to snap his shaft in half every time he breaks..but it doesn't ever seem to break. I can't imagine I'm putting more force on the shaft with a draw shot than he is when he breaks.

You should not use Mike Sigel as a barometer for your experience.

Kurt · May 25, 2011

Black-Balled said:
You should not use Mike Sigel as a barometer for your experience.

Stop being an asshat, seriously. Your short quips aren't helpful, or appreciated.

I'm in no way comparing myself to Mike Sigel..I'm simply stating that it's weird that I'm putting more pressure on my shafts than Mike Sigel seems to be putting on his break shots.

It has to be a combination of my lousy stroke and the 314-2 shaft though..because like I said, I've had the same stroke for 10 years and I played at least 5 years with the Scruggs shaft without any breaking or cracking of any sort.

rayjay · May 25, 2011

Stop using laminated plywood shafts. period.

plshrk22 · May 25, 2011

Well he is probabaly using a break cue also. I think you may be standing up unknowingly because you are trying to do a powerful draw shot. This is why when people break, their tip is on the table. Their stroking arm is moving up with their body while the bridge/shaft is staying stationary. You need to work on staying down on your shot.

brandoncook26 · May 25, 2011

Kurt said:
Stop being an asshat, seriously. Your short quips aren't helpful, or appreciated.

I'm in no way comparing myself to Mike Sigel..I'm simply stating that it's weird that I'm putting more pressure on my shafts than Mike Sigel seems to be putting on his break shots.

It has to be a combination of my lousy stroke and the 314-2 shaft though..because like I said, I've had the same stroke for 10 years and I played at least 5 years with the Scruggs shaft without any breaking or cracking of any sort.

He called you an asshat, lol. Whether or not it's substantiated, it made me laugh my ass off.

<----- Probably also an asshat

Kurt · May 25, 2011

rayjay said:
Stop using laminated plywood shafts. period.

Can you be more specific with this? I know nothing about wood types. Is plywood and/or lamination known for not being as quality or sturdy as other wood types? Is the 314, 314-2, and Z2 all plywood? What shafts aren't laminated plywood, and which ones would you recommend for me?

Kurt · May 25, 2011

plshrk22 said:
Well he is probabaly using a break cue also. I think you may be standing up unknowingly because you are trying to do a powerful draw shot. This is why when people break, their tip is on the table. Their stroking arm is moving up with their body while the bridge/shaft is staying stationary. You need to work on staying down on your shot.

Ah..excellent point! I knew I always had an issue with this..but I'll keep this more in mind especially on draw shots!

plshrk22 · May 25, 2011

Most of the LD Shafts like Predator, OB1, etc are laminated. There are different variations of laminated shafts though, some are flat laminated, pie laminated like the predator. I used a predator for 10+ years and loved it. It was the first edition of the predator shafts. Never once did I hear a crack or was in fear of breaking it. I sold it a year ago because I got to shoot with some quality all wood shafts and have never looked back. BUT I am a strong believer in "Its the Indian, Not the Arrow".

donuteric · May 25, 2011

Kurt, I think members here are just expressing the truth. Some might have written in a way that provokes unnecessary misunderstandings among members on this forum, but they simply stated the truth. If you're convinced that these laminated shafts don't fit into your routine, then I'd recommend to get a Mezz shaft. They are high quality LD shafts.

The truth is, however, in within your stroking ability. Replace the shaft, if needed, but pay particular attention to how it happened.

Drew · May 25, 2011

Kurt said:
That's not a bad idea about using an open bridge on my draw shots...I can do it, but I find it's a lot easier to use a closed bridge when it comes to a long draw shot.

The shaft is breaking very close to the center....nowhere near the ferrule.

It's easier with a closed bridge because you're forcefully holding the shaft low to table. But you shouldn't be adjusting to a bad stroke. Don't raise your elbow or stand up mid-stroke. Do you notice yourself miscueing a lot when drawing with an open bridge? Or shooting a "draw" shot which doesn't draw?

When you can draw the ball just as well with an open bridge, then you'll have that little problem solved.

FWIW: The Tim Scruggs shaft you were using is much stronger than the 314 because it's a single solid piece of wood. Scruggs isn't known for using sh1t wood in his cues either.

Shafts breaking, suggestion?

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