Bar Box, 8', 9' and 8-Ball WC

Avathar

Avathar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi Everybody!

I just read a bit about the lovely tournament SvB took part and got a bit confused...

Lets place a short bit of my own history in here, before I ask my questions...

I remember that in two pubs of my hometown they had coin tables, but cannot tell anything about the size, since I was just in my teens and could not have cared less... I just loved that I was one of the better bangers in the pub ;)

When I started playing pool on the club side of the world, I realized, that good equipment seemed to be something much cooler, than the table in the bar, where I knew I had to aim to overcome the hanging table...

Now to the point. I have seen many pool halls in Germany (and Austria) and never found any 8' table and do not remember really any coin tables of smaller sizes.

In 2007 I came to Austin, Tx for the first time and for the first time ever have seen an 8' table! And even more, most places were proud to have 1 or 2 9 footers... Anyhow, I ran my more than 25 balls 3 times of 5 breaks in my first try (before that I never had run more than 16 balls EVER!) and managed 2 break and runs in 8-ball, before the 9 footer was available again and I changed tables...

So if a pretty bad player like me can find making balls that easy, what is the point for the pros to spend time with such a gamble (I mean for them it must be as efficient to find the best players as tossing a coin anyhow?) and all that instead of playing WC 8-Ball???


Oh, do I understnad right, that if you guys talk about "bar box" you talk about smaller sized tables (7') with big white ball and such??
 
Avathar

Avathar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
WellI guess, my point was not made too clear...

I prefer shooting on a nine footer over the smaller sized tables at any time and rather spend the time needed in training, to improve my stroke ntil it works (and it changed by far since then of course).

I was rather surprised, that you have very players like SvB joining a bar box tournament, rather than participating in the 8-Ball world championships...

I do not want to put anyone down with that, mind you...

In my opinion it is just sad, that the World Championships have such a little regard in the pool world, thatplayers that have prooven to be in the top 10 of the world do not even care for the WC...

In most sports that have a WC players would be honoured to be allowed to represent their country in such an event... Pool players say "F... off, I'd rather go for the cash"....

Also I was surprised to see that many pool halls with mostly 8' tables in Austin, while yo udo not see them anywhere over here... 6" distance increases the needed precision by far... (of course here should be smiley, I am just not sure which one...) In that I have to agree to you a bit... of course the psychological effekt is there... Anyhow, I feel makin balls from the headstring is much easier than from the first diamond, also you need less speed or english (dpending what you want to use to get your balls where you want them to be) on a smaller table since the ball does not need to run as far...
 
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krelldog

krelldog

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think it boils down to costs for SVB. Its got to be ridiculously expensive to travel to the middle east when you factor in lodging and travel. While Shane aint going to back down from anyone...the roster for the world 8 ball is incredibly deep. I think even Shane would admit the players in the far East are the best in the world.

Why would Shane play in the Bar Box tournament in Vegas? The biggest expense he should have in Vegas will be the mask he'll need when he robs the tournament. Many think he is the best bar box player in the world. He already won the ten ball...and 8 ball bar box is his best game. I doubt he is second guessing his decision.
 
Avathar

Avathar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yeah, but that is just my point...

I mean where is pride? Where is patriotism? How can anybody expect to create public interest in our sport, when the big names do not even care for stuff like WCs?

What worth has the title when a bar box tournament is more valuable for some of the best players in the world (No disrespect meant towards the winners, of course... They have beaten up some of the really great ones!)...
 
JMuck

JMuck

Registered User
Silver Member
Avathar said:
Yeah, but that is just my point...

I mean where is pride? Where is patriotism? How can anybody expect to create public interest in our sport, when the big names do not even care for stuff like WCs?

What worth has the title when a bar box tournament is more valuable for some of the best players in the world (No disrespect meant towards the winners, of course... They have beaten up some of the really great ones!)...
Click to expand...

I think Shane has tremendous pride.I'm sure being number one in the world is the goal.Practicality seems to be primary.There are many thing to consider.
 
B

Big Fish

Registered
Avathar said:
Hi Everybody!

I just read a bit about the lovely tournament SvB took part and got a bit confused...

Lets place a short bit of my own history in here, before I ask my questions...

I remember that in two pubs of my hometown they had coin tables, but cannot tell anything about the size, since I was just in my teens and could not have cared less... I just loved that I was one of the better bangers in the pub ;)

When I started playing pool on the club side of the world, I realized, that good equipment seemed to be something much cooler, than the table in the bar, where I knew I had to aim to overcome the hanging table...

Now to the point. I have seen many pool halls in Germany (and Austria) and never found any 8' table and do not remember really any coin tables of smaller sizes.

In 2007 I came to Austin, Tx for the first time and for the first time ever have seen an 8' table! And even more, most places were proud to have 1 or 2 9 footers... Anyhow, I ran my more than 25 balls 3 times of 5 breaks in my first try (before that I never had run more than 16 balls EVER!) and managed 2 break and runs in 8-ball, before the 9 footer was available again and I changed tables...

So if a pretty bad player like me can find making balls that easy, what is the point for the pros to spend time with such a gamble (I mean for them it must be as efficient to find the best players as tossing a coin anyhow?) and all that instead of playing WC 8-Ball???


Oh, do I understnad right, that if you guys talk about "bar box" you talk about smaller sized tables (7') with big white ball and such??
Click to expand...

SVB has only one standing bet that is to play anybody in the world 8 ball on the bar box. Its his favorite game . If bar box 8 ball was just a roll of the dice I don't think he would make that statement. So far no one has jumped up and took a roll of the dice.
 
Avathar

Avathar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Big Fish said:
SVB has only one standing bet that is to play anybody in the world 8 ball on the bar box. Its his favorite game . If bar box 8 ball was just a roll of the dice I don't think he would make that statement. So far no one has jumped up and took a roll of the dice.
Click to expand...

I am not sure why this should be a contradiction...

Shane can beat anybody and most players but the top 20 in the world, he will beat easily in every of the standard games on every table...

But instead of going to challange the big names in the WC on a nine footer, he goes for the easy cash... I doubt, that he would face bankrupcy (however that maybespelled), if he would loose a few bucks from travel and expenses, if the WC does not bring him to the finals...

I think it is not only shane that was missing over there, was it?

I think it sounds a bit that I want to put him or his values down... Thats not my goal, honestly.
I just found him to be an outstanding exsample, since he was for sure one of the favourites for the title with a few others....

I think that if a bar box tournament is more valuable for players like him, there is just somehting significantly wrong with how we see our sport and I just wonder what it is...

SvB has of course the best chance to take the win on this tournament (specially if he likes that game). Stil, the chance that he looses against anybody is boigger there, than it would be in a similar event with the same guys on a nine footer... so yes it is partly gambling and having fun...

At the same time there waits possible honor and pride of becoming a WC (for the first time?)... Still it doesn't seem to be worth it...

And I guess some others took a similar road, since there were many empty spots in the brackets...

It would be the same if Raymond van Barneveld or such would miss the Darts WC and rather go playing some electronic darts tournament for the fun of it...

Of course we do not get TV coverage anymore... Not even our own people know the biggest names in pool...
The WC has no stream? No medial feedback at all, but a live results page?

Hell, lets face it.. something goes SEERIOUSLY worng, if a WC does not attrackt enough players to fill the brakcets...
 
justadub

justadub

Rattling corners nightly
Silver Member
Perhaps Justin or someone else that knows Shane well will chime in here, but my impression is that the WC would be a VERY expensive trip, and the prize money was reduced substantially this year. with a very deep field and less money, he has to look at it from a business standpoint, one would think. And to factor in the barbox tourney being played at the same time with far fewer expense and MUCH greater odds of making $$$, it appears the choice is simple.

I expect that if there wasn't such a good option for Shane, perhaps he might have considered going.

Of course, this is all speculation, based on stuff I've read here. Again, hopefully someone who really knows him will shed some light on the matter.
 
JMuck

JMuck

Registered User
Silver Member
Avathar said:
I am not sure why this should be a contradiction...

Shane can beat anybody and most players but the top 20 in the world, he will beat easily in every of the standard games on every table...

But instead of going to challange the big names in the WC on a nine footer, he goes for the easy cash... I doubt, that he would face bankrupcy (however that maybespelled), if he would loose a few bucks from travel and expenses, if the WC does not bring him to the finals...

I think it is not only shane that was missing over there, was it?

I think it sounds a bit that I want to put him or his values down... Thats not my goal, honestly.
I just found him to be an outstanding exsample, since he was for sure one of the favourites for the title with a few others....

I think that if a bar box tournament is more valuable for players like him, there is just somehting significantly wrong with how we see our sport and I just wonder what it is...

SvB has of course the best chance to take the win on this tournament (specially if he likes that game). Stil, the chance that he looses against anybody is boigger there, than it would be in a similar event with the same guys on a nine footer... so yes it is partly gambling and having fun...

At the same time there waits possible honor and pride of becoming a WC (for the first time?)... Still it doesn't seem to be worth it...

And I guess some others took a similar road, since there were many empty spots in the brackets...

It would be the same if Raymond van Barneveld or such would miss the Darts WC and rather go playing some electronic darts tournament for the fun of it...

Of course we do not get TV coverage anymore... Not even our own people know the biggest names in pool...
The WC has no stream? No medial feedback at all, but a live results page?

Hell, lets face it.. something goes SEERIOUSLY worng, if a WC does not attrackt enough players to fill the brakcets...
Click to expand...

This post I agree with.The system is broken in which a player rises through the ranks and is recognized for his/her skill and hard work to get there.

Shane's heart and dedication should not be in question.I'm sure he has to sometimes make difficult choices to try and be the best.
 
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gwk9ball

gwk9ball

Pool Junkie
Silver Member
As much as Shane travels overseas I dought that expences was the reason he didn't go, He grew up playing Bar Table, so I bet he really likes that tournament. I think SVB picks the tourn. he likes no matter where they are held and he goes and tries to win.
 
hlymnstr14

hlymnstr14

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Avathar said:
I am not sure why this should be a contradiction...

Shane can beat anybody and most players but the top 20 in the world, he will beat easily in every of the standard games on every table...

But instead of going to challange the big names in the WC on a nine footer, he goes for the easy cash... I doubt, that he would face bankrupcy (however that maybespelled), if he would loose a few bucks from travel and expenses, if the WC does not bring him to the finals...

I think it is not only shane that was missing over there, was it?

I think it sounds a bit that I want to put him or his values down... Thats not my goal, honestly.
I just found him to be an outstanding exsample, since he was for sure one of the favourites for the title with a few others....

I think that if a bar box tournament is more valuable for players like him, there is just somehting significantly wrong with how we see our sport and I just wonder what it is...

SvB has of course the best chance to take the win on this tournament (specially if he likes that game). Stil, the chance that he looses against anybody is boigger there, than it would be in a similar event with the same guys on a nine footer... so yes it is partly gambling and having fun...

At the same time there waits possible honor and pride of becoming a WC (for the first time?)... Still it doesn't seem to be worth it...

And I guess some others took a similar road, since there were many empty spots in the brackets...

It would be the same if Raymond van Barneveld or such would miss the Darts WC and rather go playing some electronic darts tournament for the fun of it...

Of course we do not get TV coverage anymore... Not even our own people know the biggest names in pool...
The WC has no stream? No medial feedback at all, but a live results page?

Hell, lets face it.. something goes SEERIOUSLY worng, if a WC does not attrackt enough players to fill the brakcets...
Click to expand...

"If you are riding a dead horse the best thing to do is dismount"... saying of the Dakota Indians

i wise man once wrote that in his forum signature. now who was that...?

SVb is playing the percentages, risk vs reward, half a loaf is better than none...what don't you understand? pool is not soccer or the NFL with a worldwide audience and advertisers outbidding each other for sponsorship. its pool, i'm sure they go around begging people to sponsor events. the WC paid $20000 to the winner of the WC! does that warrant dropping $5000 running around the world with maybe a 5% chance of winning? SVB spent like $125 with low overhead expenses to win $4300 in the 10 ball with most likely at least a 33% chance of winning. plus luck, good or bad, always plays a small part in winning a pool tournament. with better players, luck is even a bigger component. one good/bad roll is huge at that level.

while he has made lots of money from pool, i doubt he is wealthy from it. so going to reno for a week, finishing $8000 up or more and getting your ego stroked the whole week seems like the better option, patriotism aside of course.
 
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